The Firing Line Forums - View Single Post - Why does every one hate the XD grip safety

Gaerek · March 15, 2013, 11:29 AM

I had avoided posting in this thread, not because I was avoiding confrontation, but because I saw where it was heading. But, I just want to sum up my feelings. Not going to reply to anyone in particular, just give my thoughts.

Do I have a problem with XD/XD(M)/XDS)?

No, not at all. I don't particularly like them personally. They don't feel good in my hand. BUT, they are good guns. I've recommended them in the past, and I'll continue to recommend them. For the record, if I was planning on buying a small single stack .45, I would probably get an XDS, not a G36. I've held both, and strangely, the XDS feels better. It's also more reliable (the G36 is probably the worst gun Glock has made).

So I have a problem with people who like and shoot XD/XD(M)/XDS?

Not at all. A good friend I met at my defensive handgun class shoots the compact .45 XD(M). He loves it. I give him crap all the time, but mainly because he pays twice as much for ammo than I do. I have not once criticized his decision to shoot that gun. He loves it, and it works for him. I would NEVER say, "Hey dude, you should really get a Glock, it's a better gun!" Why? Because it's not true. Whether the Glock is mechanically better or worse than all variants of XD is irrelevant. For him, a Glock wouldn't be better, just like for me, an XD wouldn't be better for me.

What I do have a problem with is people who are so blinded by their own opinions and biases that they seem to think that their choice of gun is superior to everyone else's. These same people would never recommend anything except what they shoot. Before you say I'm directing this at someone, I'm not. There's people who do this with practically every gun made. Just look at all the threads of people bragging about their "flawless" hi-point, or Taurus. These same people get defensive anytime you mention a flaw in their choice, and will defend it irrationally. Do I believe Glocks are "Perfection (TM)?" Not at all. They have flaws in design, and I am more than happy to admit that. It's just funny watching some people, in this thread and others, get defensive when you mention a flaw in their choice, as if you are attacking them personally.

So, about the LCI and Striker Indicator...

Unobtrusive or not, the are there. I understand having an LCI...they're required to be sold in certain jurisdictions. Are they useful? Marginally. I certainly don't trust them, and will always prefer a press-check to looking at an LCI, if I can. Yep, Glocks have them. I prefer the Glock one because it's subtle. DO they make guns safer? Not one bit.

The Striker Indicator...anyone who argues that this thing has a purpose is kidding themselves. The only reason it's there is so the gun can be marketed as safer. Go look at ads for the gun from several years ago...they all mention the striker indicator. But if the gun is loaded with one in the chamber, the LCI will be up, and by definition the striker will also be up. The only exception to this is if you pull the trigger and the gun goes click. But then, you STILL have a round in the chamber, and you should be clearing the malfunction. If you're taking time to look or feel for the striker indicator before clearing the malfunction, you're doing it wrong. If the gun is unloaded, no round in the chamber, the condition of the striker is irrelevant.

Now, do I care that they are there? Not at all. My original point was that they don't really increase real safety (all they do is increase perceived safety) and, that the striker indicator is completely superfluous. Would I prefer the LCI to be a little more subtle? Sure, but that's not something that would make me not buy a gun...same with the striker indicator.

The Grip Safety

I've already talked ad nauseum about this one. Do I care that it's there? No, I didn't even notice it when I shot the gun. I have no real preference either way whether it's there or not. If Glock decided the Gen 5's were going to have them, as long as it didn't affect function, I wouldn't care, and would likely buy one. Not because of or in spite of the grip safety. However, it is my belief that a grip safety only increases the perceived safety of the gun (just like a trigger safety...Glocks would be perfectly safe without them, I believe). If you're doing something dumb with a gun, with or without that extra mechanical device, you or someone around you can still get hurt. If you cannot remember to keep your finger off the trigger, especially when holstering, then I question whether a gun is a good idea for you, with or without a grip safety.

I like shooting 1911's, and the grip safeties don't bother me at all. I am neutral when it comes to them. However, it doesn't change my belief above about them, that they are basically superfluous, and are really there more for marketing the gun as "safer" than other guns that don't have them.

So why do you like your Glock so much?

When I was first looking into buying a handgun, I was originally going to buy an XD(M) 9mm. This was after browsing magazines, and wanting something simple to shoot, that wasn't a Glock (I just couldn't choose something that was popular! Had to go with an underdog). However, when I hit the range to try out a variety of guns, I found that I absolutely hated the feel of the XD(M), and in my hands, it didn't point naturally (1911's, for example, don't either...I just like shooting them anyway, but not defensively). When I shot the Glock, it felt like it was designed just for my hands. I shot it better, and it felt better. LCI's, Striker Indicators, Grip Safeties, etc, simply didn't enter into the equation. So when it was time to hit the LGS to make my purchase I went straight to the Glock counter. For me, it's a work gun. It's not meant to be pretty. I just want it to go bang when I pull the trigger, and put holes where I point it. I hate the Glock sight, and changed it almost immediately.

But I am fully aware of people's preferences. If someone asks for advice on a gun and says, "I don't want a Glock" I won't try to sell them on one. My recommendation will likely include a gun in the various XD lines. You can point out 100 flaws with the Glock, and it won't change my opinion...but I won't get defensive about it. Relieved ejection port? I don't care that the Glock doesn't have one. I don't have a BTF issue. Un-conventional grip angle? You mean, it doesn't have a 1911 grip angle? That's fine with me, because the Glock points more naturally for me. "Conventional" grip angle guns are conventional because they copy the 1911 grip angle. Glock went with what is ergonomic for most people. Many people don't like it. That's fine, use what works for you.

And that's the bottom line. Use what works. Don't use a thread on grip safeties to show why XD's are better than Glocks...that's just petty, and shows insecurity in your choice. After all, a gun is a personal choice. But it's not a personal attack if someone points out a flaw in your choice.

I mean, I could point out several flaws of a 1911...but I choose not to because it would be counter productive, and I know I'd get a reaction to that.

Alright, I'm done. Feel free to say I'm an XD hater and a Glock fanboy, if you'd like. That's certainly not what I am, but if that's what you see...fine, I don't care. XD's are great guns. I just don't prefer them. I also don't need a laundry list of features to "prove" that my choice is better than another person's choice. I know what works for me.

March 15, 2013, 11:29 AM	#168
Gaerek Senior Member Join Date: October 3, 2012 Location: Arizona Posts: 939	I had avoided posting in this thread, not because I was avoiding confrontation, but because I saw where it was heading. But, I just want to sum up my feelings. Not going to reply to anyone in particular, just give my thoughts. Do I have a problem with XD/XD(M)/XDS)? No, not at all. I don't particularly like them personally. They don't feel good in my hand. BUT, they are good guns. I've recommended them in the past, and I'll continue to recommend them. For the record, if I was planning on buying a small single stack .45, I would probably get an XDS, not a G36. I've held both, and strangely, the XDS feels better. It's also more reliable (the G36 is probably the worst gun Glock has made). So I have a problem with people who like and shoot XD/XD(M)/XDS? Not at all. A good friend I met at my defensive handgun class shoots the compact .45 XD(M). He loves it. I give him crap all the time, but mainly because he pays twice as much for ammo than I do. I have not once criticized his decision to shoot that gun. He loves it, and it works for him. I would NEVER say, "Hey dude, you should really get a Glock, it's a better gun!" Why? Because it's not true. Whether the Glock is mechanically better or worse than all variants of XD is irrelevant. For him, a Glock wouldn't be better, just like for me, an XD wouldn't be better for me. What I do have a problem with is people who are so blinded by their own opinions and biases that they seem to think that their choice of gun is superior to everyone else's. These same people would never recommend anything except what they shoot. Before you say I'm directing this at someone, I'm not. There's people who do this with practically every gun made. Just look at all the threads of people bragging about their "flawless" hi-point, or Taurus. These same people get defensive anytime you mention a flaw in their choice, and will defend it irrationally. Do I believe Glocks are "Perfection (TM)?" Not at all. They have flaws in design, and I am more than happy to admit that. It's just funny watching some people, in this thread and others, get defensive when you mention a flaw in their choice, as if you are attacking them personally. So, about the LCI and Striker Indicator... Unobtrusive or not, the are there. I understand having an LCI...they're required to be sold in certain jurisdictions. Are they useful? Marginally. I certainly don't trust them, and will always prefer a press-check to looking at an LCI, if I can. Yep, Glocks have them. I prefer the Glock one because it's subtle. DO they make guns safer? Not one bit. The Striker Indicator...anyone who argues that this thing has a purpose is kidding themselves. The only reason it's there is so the gun can be marketed as safer. Go look at ads for the gun from several years ago...they all mention the striker indicator. But if the gun is loaded with one in the chamber, the LCI will be up, and by definition the striker will also be up. The only exception to this is if you pull the trigger and the gun goes click. But then, you STILL have a round in the chamber, and you should be clearing the malfunction. If you're taking time to look or feel for the striker indicator before clearing the malfunction, you're doing it wrong. If the gun is unloaded, no round in the chamber, the condition of the striker is irrelevant. Now, do I care that they are there? Not at all. My original point was that they don't really increase real safety (all they do is increase perceived safety) and, that the striker indicator is completely superfluous. Would I prefer the LCI to be a little more subtle? Sure, but that's not something that would make me not buy a gun...same with the striker indicator. The Grip Safety I've already talked ad nauseum about this one. Do I care that it's there? No, I didn't even notice it when I shot the gun. I have no real preference either way whether it's there or not. If Glock decided the Gen 5's were going to have them, as long as it didn't affect function, I wouldn't care, and would likely buy one. Not because of or in spite of the grip safety. However, it is my belief that a grip safety only increases the perceived safety of the gun (just like a trigger safety...Glocks would be perfectly safe without them, I believe). If you're doing something dumb with a gun, with or without that extra mechanical device, you or someone around you can still get hurt. If you cannot remember to keep your finger off the trigger, especially when holstering, then I question whether a gun is a good idea for you, with or without a grip safety. I like shooting 1911's, and the grip safeties don't bother me at all. I am neutral when it comes to them. However, it doesn't change my belief above about them, that they are basically superfluous, and are really there more for marketing the gun as "safer" than other guns that don't have them. So why do you like your Glock so much? When I was first looking into buying a handgun, I was originally going to buy an XD(M) 9mm. This was after browsing magazines, and wanting something simple to shoot, that wasn't a Glock (I just *couldn't* choose something that was popular! Had to go with an underdog). However, when I hit the range to try out a variety of guns, I found that I absolutely hated the feel of the XD(M), and in my hands, it didn't point naturally (1911's, for example, don't either...I just like shooting them anyway, but not defensively). When I shot the Glock, it felt like it was designed just for my hands. I shot it better, and it felt better. LCI's, Striker Indicators, Grip Safeties, etc, simply didn't enter into the equation. So when it was time to hit the LGS to make my purchase I went straight to the Glock counter. For me, it's a work gun. It's not meant to be pretty. I just want it to go bang when I pull the trigger, and put holes where I point it. I hate the Glock sight, and changed it almost immediately. But I am fully aware of people's preferences. If someone asks for advice on a gun and says, "I don't want a Glock" I won't try to sell them on one. My recommendation will likely include a gun in the various XD lines. You can point out 100 flaws with the Glock, and it won't change my opinion...but I won't get defensive about it. Relieved ejection port? I don't care that the Glock doesn't have one. I don't have a BTF issue. Un-conventional grip angle? You mean, it doesn't have a 1911 grip angle? That's fine with me, because the Glock points more naturally for me. "Conventional" grip angle guns are conventional because they copy the 1911 grip angle. Glock went with what is ergonomic for most people. Many people don't like it. That's fine, use what works for you. And that's the bottom line. Use what works. Don't use a thread on grip safeties to show why XD's are better than Glocks...that's just petty, and shows insecurity in your choice. After all, a gun is a personal choice. But it's not a personal attack if someone points out a flaw in your choice. I mean, I could point out several flaws of a 1911...but I choose not to because it would be counter productive, and I know I'd get a reaction to that. Alright, I'm done. Feel free to say I'm an XD hater and a Glock fanboy, if you'd like. That's certainly not what I am, but if that's what you see...fine, I don't care. XD's are great guns. I just don't prefer them. I also don't need a laundry list of features to "prove" that my choice is better than another person's choice. I know what works for me.