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Old December 21, 2012, 01:00 PM   #55
zukiphile
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 13, 2005
Posts: 1,610
Quote:
Originally Posted by gaseousclay
define 'we.' not all gun owners are created equal and we all don't agree on the same things.
I believe that "we" refers to those who have a principled commitment to the civil right described in the Second Amendment.

Quote:
Originally Posted by gaseousclay
i've seen knee-jerk reactions from both the pro-gun community and anti-gun community.
I haven't seen anything thoughtless or over-the-top communications from Second Amendment defenders over the last week. I am sure some must've occurred, but the contrast against the gleeful dreams of greater restrictions is considerable.

Quote:
Originally Posted by gaseousclay
the moment you say, 'keep your hands off my guns,' is the moment when everyone stops listening and we get nowhere.
I do not want to go anywhere that begins with an agreement that the state should have its hands on my guns. If agreement on that point is what is required for the conversation, I would prefer to not have the conversation.

Quote:
Originally Posted by gaseousclay
i'm not agreeing with an assault weapons ban per se, but I don't think it should be made easily available to just anyone. I have no problem jumping through a few extra hoops to acquire a gun ...
I would have a significant problem in going through "a few extra hoops" for a rifle, a device that is used in criminal activities only infrequently.

Quote:
Originally Posted by gaseousclay
...I have nothing to hide.
Whilethat is unlikely, it may be true. However, whether you have something to hide is distinguishable from whether the state has any limits in the depth and extent of its interrogation before allowing you to exercise a right.

A lot of the power of the defense of this right rests on a coherent statement and application of principle. Once those principles are jettisoned, one enters a land of serial half a loaf compromises with people on interested in leaving you any of that loaf.
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