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Old September 11, 2012, 03:43 PM   #27
Slamfire
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Join Date: May 27, 2007
Posts: 4,094
Quote:
Where is your body of independent testing that conclusively proves that Hatcher was lying?
I do not agree that Hatcher’s account is perfect and infallible. Someone pointing at Hatcher’s Notebook and claiming history happened exactly as Hatcher wrote, because it is in this book, is committing an error in circular logic. In 1947 Hatcher has just retired, looking forward to a long and happy association with former organization and he is absolutely not going to say anything in word or deed critical of the Army. So, he writes this account and shifts the problems away from Army Ordnance.

Nor would it help to point fingers at Townsend Whelen who, I think, was then a major figure employed by the NRA. Not wise to upset your future employers.

If you can’t see that, then that is OK.

Naramore’s account was written in 1937, Naramore is a contemporary of Hatcher, obviously a coworker/associate, Hatcher created the illustrations in Naramore’s book undoubtedly reviewing the text. I find it hard to believe that Hatcher was not part of the discussion and did not notice or remember the correct reason why tin can ammunition caused pressure problems.


Quote:
Where is your body of independent testing that conclusively proves that civilian competitors greasing their bullets had no bearing at all on the subsequent rifle failures?
Where are the decades of failure reports? Failure reports before and after the 1921 incident. Competitors had been greasing their bullets long enough for aftermarket grease kits to be made. The British were greasing their bullets up to, at least the late 60’s. Their practice now, heck if I know. Where is the century of failure reports from the Swiss, Austrians, who used greased bullets, the Swiss for over a century?

Quote:
Where is your body of independent testing that conclusively proves that the Army's manufacturing processes were 100% at fault?
You run into accounts in old American Rifleman magazines and in, surprising enough, Captain Herbert McBridge's articles in American Rifleman have incidental comments on the poor quality of WW1 ammunition. Hatcher’s own account of the single heat treat receiver ought to be a clue. A 03 receiver fragmented at a ammunition plant and there was "evidence that the heads of the cartridge cases had been soft", this incident started the investigation into the systemic production defects of the single heat treat receivers.

Of course, the late twenties decision of the Army to scrap all 1,056,506 single heat treat receivers ought to be a clue as to the quality of their manufacture. Out of a total of 1.8 million 03 receivers made to 1939 only 42% were considered safe enough to retain in service.

Asking for proof at 100% level is unreasonable and will never happen. President Kennedy was shot in 1963, there is not 100% agreement who did it. I have heard that only 30% or 50% of the American population believes that the world was created 6000 years ago, so we don’t have a census on the creation of the earth. When, as we all know, it was created 23 Oct 4004 BC. LOL.
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Last edited by Slamfire; September 12, 2012 at 10:46 AM.
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