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Old August 27, 2009, 10:30 AM   #16
NavyLT
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Join Date: January 25, 2006
Location: Oak Harbor, WA
Posts: 1,719
Quote:
Originally Posted by louiethelump
And if you have to announce the presence of the gun, expect to have it unloaded, run in the computer to make sure it is not stolen, and returned to you empty. Any officer would be in hot water with his supervisor if he does not run any gun he comes in contact with in the computer, and does not run every person he comes in contact with in the computer. you may not like it, but that is the officer's job, and you better get used to it.
Just curious. Why would you insist on violating the 4th amendment? What reasonable articulable suspicion is there for ASSUMING that a gun MAY be stolen just because it is in the legal possession of a person not prohibited from possessing it? I find it outrageous that a police agency would have a policy like that. Without RAS that the gun is illegal it is also illegal to check it.

AND, let's say you get Joe citizen on the side of the road, he tells you he has the gun stored in the glovebox, his record from the DL comes back clean, AND you run the gun's serial number to check if it is stolen. NOW it does comes back on the hit list. Guess what! It is now inadmissable as evidence because you had NO RAS in order to seek further evidence of a crime. You have conducted an illegal search and seizure!

It is permissible for you to conduct search and seizure of a weapon for officer safety IF you have RAS that the party is armed, such as "Yes, I do have a gun". However, the supreme court has ruled that, absence of any other RAS, the search and seizure MUST BE LIMITED to that necessary for officer safety. Running the serial number is now making that search and seizure for the purpose of evidence gathering, which without RAS of a crime related to that object, the gun, is ILLEGAL!

It is just like executing a search warrant on a house looking for a stolen piano. If you find drugs in a desk drawer during the search, are the drugs admissable as evidence? NO. Because you were looking for a stolen piano and there is no way the stolen piano could be in the desk drawer you looked in. Is it reasonable to check a DL during a traffic stop? Absolutely, no problem with that. Is it reasonable to check the serial number of a gun found to be in LAWFUL possession of a person who may LAWFULLY posses it? NO!

In response to louiethelump's post about how the police operate, I would highly recommend that everyone watch the 45 minute video available on youtube and on www.flexyourrights.org entitled "Busted, the citizen's guide to surviving a police encounter".

Last edited by NavyLT; August 27, 2009 at 10:40 AM.
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