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Doug444
January 11, 2002, 10:41 AM
I've got the high bid on a JP Sauer & Sohn (that's the way they spell it!) Western Marshal .44 Mag. Don't know if I'll get it or not, but I'm wondering what it's really worth. Typical "Peacemaket" clone, made in West Germany. Thought it'd be a good "start" for my CAS stable (to go along with my Rossi '92 in .44 Mag.). I plan to shoot 200-240 gr. bullets @ 700-800 fps. Anybody have any experience with this gun?

Thanks.

Doug444

Kirk Keller
January 11, 2002, 11:23 AM
I owned a Hawes Western Marshall in .44 Mag and found it to be a wonderful piece. I fired all sorts of .44 Special and .44 mag factory ammo through mine and was quite impressed with the weapon in all respects. How much did you pay for it if you don't mind my asking?

Kirk Keller
January 11, 2002, 11:28 AM
I should clarify. The Hawes Western Marshall and the J.P Sauer and Sohn Western Marshall are one and the same. See this post:

Hawes Western Marshall Thread (http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=92878)

Hope this helps.

Doug444
January 11, 2002, 02:29 PM
KM - thanks for the reply. I've not won the auction yet, hence my secrecy (don't want to lose it:D !). The thread you referenced would seem to accurate is all I can say for now. I'll let you know if I get it.

Doug444

Kirk Keller
January 11, 2002, 02:54 PM
Glad to help. Good luck with the bidding!

Kirk Keller
January 11, 2002, 04:45 PM
Saw the piece. Looks to be in good shape. Trigger guard has the finish rubbed off (holster wear), but that can be easily refinished or replaced with a nicer looking brass trigger guard. A great place for parts if you need any is e-gunparts.com (http://www.e-gunparts.com/products.asp?chrMasterModel=1510zWESTERN%20MARSHALL).

They seem to have all sorts of goodies and even schematics for the weapon.

Again, good luck and I hope you get it!

Doug444
January 12, 2002, 11:31 PM
KM - I won the auction:D ! I'll pay all told (with shipping and transfer fee) Just under $265, which I don't think is too bad, considering a new Vaquero is going for $100 more (plus tax) around here. I'll let you know how it turns out once I get it.

Doug444

Quantrill
January 13, 2002, 09:13 AM
I bought one of these before the GCA1968. I remember picking it up from the local bus company that also carried freight. It was the last gun that I ever got that way.
I have owned it ever since. It has been a fine revolver. My wife now uses it for her primary pistol for CAS shooting. My gunsmith cut down the barrel to 5.5 inches and installed a new front sight that makes it look more like an early revolver. He pronounced it a "solid sixgun". I always liked that term. Good Luck with yours. Quantrill

Doug444
January 23, 2002, 05:00 PM
Got confirmation today that the gun is on its way to my FFL, so I should have it tomorrow or Friday:D ! Now I need to get some cast bullets and an appropriate powder (probably Titegroup) and set aside some time at the reloading bench. No guarantee I'll make it to the range this weekend, but I should be able to within a couple of weeks. More to come!

Doug444

Kirk Keller
January 23, 2002, 06:23 PM
Let me know how she shoots.

Nick96
January 26, 2002, 12:48 AM
I've got one too. Picked it up at a gun show maybe 10 years ago. It was in somewhat rough condition, but I was looking for a "project gun" anyway. I think I paid around $165 for it. Haven't seen any others, so they must be somewhat limited in number.

Mine is blue steel frame and had an anodized aluminum trigger guard and backstrap assembly - rosewood grips. I ordered a brass trigger guard and backstrap assembly and walnut grips from Conneticut (sp) Vallet Arms. I put together one of their 1861 Colt kits some years back, and found that these parts fit perfectly (after some grinding and polishing). Touched up the blueing a little.

It's now pretty much a display case gun. I have shot a few .44 Mags through it - but didn't like the blast & kick - and I was a bit concerned about stressing the frame (I really don't know how old it is) and the brass trigger guard and backstrap assembly . But shooting .44 Spl's is very pleasant. Not a long range target gun - but a pretty good point & shooter out to about 10 yards or so.

I've toyed with the idea of reloading .44 Mag shells with black powder, but never actually tried it. Kind of like the low pitch thump and smoke when I shoot the cap & ball .44. Anyone have experience doing this?

Word of caution though. Similar to the original Colt, there is no firing pin/hammer interupter. So it's best carried with the hammer down on an empty chamber. If it's dropped or the hammer is bumped hard enough with a live round in the chamber it could go off.

Doug444
January 26, 2002, 01:09 AM
The Hawes Western Marshall .44 Mag. arrived today. Since it came to my gunsmith I had him do a quick once-over and he said it seemed pretty solid. Has a little front/back play, but since I'll be basically only shooting .44 Spl. loads it should be fine.

It has the same anodized aluminum trigger guard and grip backstrap as Nick96's, and it's showing a fair amount of holster wear, but it balance nicely in my big paw. And at not much more than 1/2 the cost of a new Vaquero, at this point I feel I've made a good purchase.

I've got 500 cast 200 gr. bullets and a pound of TiteGroup, so I should be able to put together several loads to test this next week. I hope to shoot it Sat. Feb. 2nd, so I should have a range report that night.

Later.

Doug444

Doug444
January 28, 2002, 10:22 AM
Plans changed so I had time to load up some initial "cowboy" loads and head to the range on Sunday. Used a 200 gr. RNFP bullet from Western Nevada Bullets and TiteGroup. Started out with Win. .44 Spl. brass and 4.5 gr., then went to 5.0 gr. Then loaded some Rem. (UMC) .44 Mag. brass with 5.0,5.5, and 6.0 gr. Took the Western Marshall and the '92 Rossi and headed to the range.

Results: All shot @ 15 yrds w/o sandbags, but forearms rested on a carpet covered block, 2-hand hold.

.44 Spl. cased loads - Both loads went about 5" for 10 shots, centered about 3" rt. and 3" low of POA. Same loads out of the Rossi '92 were less than 2", about 1" high.

.44 Mag. cased loads - significantly better, with the first load (5.0 gr.) going 10 shots into 2", about 2" rt. of POA. The '92 put 5 into a group 3/4" high by 2" wide 1" low of POA. The other loads started to open up a bit, but nowhere near what the .44 Spl. cased loads were.

All in all, I'm pleased with the Marshall. Now I just hope I can get a Vaquero that likes the same load!

Doug444

Kirk Keller
January 28, 2002, 02:32 PM
Thanks for the update. Congratulations with your new weapon and I'm glad you're pleased with its performance. Happy shooting!

roboink
April 22, 2011, 03:10 PM
Just shot a Hawes SA in .44 mag the other day...what a beast and the noise it made...thank God I had double ear protection. I'll post a pic of it later today or tomorrow.

Old Grump
April 22, 2011, 03:45 PM
I got it!
KM - I won the auction ! I'll pay all told (with shipping and transfer fee) Just under $265, which I don't think is too bad, considering a new Vaquero is going for $100 more (plus tax) around here. I'll let you know how it turns out once I get it.

Doug444 Good for you, I have it in .357 mag and it's right around 50 years old. A lot of bluing gone but it still shoots well and is as accurate as my Dan Wesson. I think you will like it but you might want to ease up a little on full loads. It's a handful to hang onto with giddy up and go loads speaking from personal experience. I keep boss loads for serious but shoot most of the time with specials or down loaded magnums with no loss of accuracy. I'm thinking you will find the same thing with your 44. Literally the only thing I don't like about is that skinny little trigger but once I start shooting I forget all about it. It only seems to bug me for the first shot.

roboink
April 23, 2011, 04:39 AM
What do you recommend for ammo. I don't do any reloading, but order online most of the time or Gander Mt.

Sarge
April 23, 2011, 05:59 AM
I've had three of these over the years, two .44's with a .45 Colt between them. The only one that gave me trouble was the last .44, which broke a cylinder bolt spring and could utterly NOT be disassembled and nut-buster, moderate heat, nor any of the standard 'locked threads' remedies had the slightest effect. Perhaps some gorilla had it apart and put it back together at some time, complete with loctite-from-hell. I don't know. I do know that one got scrapped for parts.

Overall though, they were nice, strong revolvers with slick actions that shot pretty close to the sights. I'd buy another and I wish I had kept the .45 Colt. I killed a big groundhog with one of the .44's, offhand, at about 117 paces if I recall correctly. I don't know which of us was more surprised.

Old Grump
April 23, 2011, 01:40 PM
Overall though, they were nice, strong revolvers with slick actions that shot pretty close to the sights. I'd buy another and I wish I had kept the .45 Colt. I killed a big groundhog with one of the .44's, offhand, at about 117 paces if I recall correctly. I don't know which of us was more surprised. You were, he didn't care anymore. :D

My brother bought his when he was in the Coast guard and used it for his part time job as armed security. They insisted he get a double action, he insisted they test him on the range. There was no more said about him needing a double action.

roboink
April 24, 2012, 03:59 PM
Pic of my Hawes Western Marshall,.44 magnum,which is in the hands of Bob Munden doing some action work to it. Talked with him and said he use to work for the Hawes company back in the day.




http://s100.photobucket.com/albums/m22/roboink555/Hawes%20Western%20Marshall/