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GLJones
September 27, 2001, 02:36 PM
I really want an FN P90. I understand that there are no legaly transferable ones so what about this...

Can a Class III dealer order one for me and convert it to semi-auto only? Would that make it legal to own? I know there are no legal pre-ban mags but I like the look of this firearm and would just like to have one, ten round limit if must be.

Correia
September 27, 2001, 03:26 PM
ATF rules that once a machine gun, always a machine gun.

DUDE
September 27, 2001, 03:58 PM
If for some how you where able to get a P90 you would not be able to buy the Ammo to shoot it, the 5.7x28 round is fires is not legaly for any one that is not a Cop, or in the Military, to have.
If you would like some thing that look and feels like a P90 then you can buy a Air-Soft P90 that shoots BBs for about $400.

Robert the41MagFan
September 27, 2001, 04:01 PM
I believe that part of the 94' weapons ban prohibits the possession of a foreign made short barrel rifles manufactured after Sept of 94'. And then there is the problem of the magazine capacity.

the 5.7x28 round is fires is not legaly for any one that is not a Cop, or in the Military, to have.

It was FN's choice not to offer this cartridge to civilians, not law.

Robert

DUDE
September 27, 2001, 07:15 PM
No it really is not legaly to have this round, the BATF ruled that the 5.7x28 cartridge is "non-sporting" and cannot be sold outside of Law Enforcement and Military agencies.

scouter27
September 27, 2001, 08:15 PM
Even if you could get the ammo, it would be very expensive to fire, even in semi auto. I also don't think that the magazine can be in low cap. only, due to it's design, but it could be made mostly of solid plastic, but I may be thinking of another weapon.

Correia
September 28, 2001, 11:17 AM
The only way that I think that you could legally obtain one of these is to become an SOT (Special Occupational Taxpayer). I do not know the details of this, but basically the ATF says that your job allows you to have restricted weapons. Like if you are an FFL that sells to law enforcement. Then you can have one as a "dealer sample".

The following link has lots of good information about this illogical piece of crap legislation.

www.2.cs.cmu.edu/afs/cs.cmu.edu/user/wbardwel/public/nfalist/nfa_faq.txt

4V50 Gary
September 28, 2001, 12:52 PM
Of course, we can make a civilian version of the cartridge and calling it 22 FN.

Hunter Rose
October 2, 2001, 04:22 PM
Actually, for those willing to go with the "toy" version, I seem to recall seeing the P90 offered on a website for around $250. I'll see if I can dig up the link later tonight...

scouter27
October 2, 2001, 05:19 PM
What good would that be :p ;)

GLJones
October 2, 2001, 05:31 PM
Oh well, Just one more reason for civil disobedience. If everyone would follow the constitution and ignore all laws contrary to it, the government would find it impossible to enforce anything.

Lets hope the Supreme Court will eventually declare all gun laws unconstitutional and really scare the crap out of the liberals/socialists.

scouter27
October 3, 2001, 03:16 PM
I wouldn't say ALL gun laws are unconstitutional. I don't mind the insta-check, or the security behind owning a class III. But, then again, some are very bad.

4V50 Gary
October 6, 2001, 04:07 PM
Got to play with one again this past week. A law enforcement distributor brought one to the "trade" show and everyone had an opportunity to empty a magazine. Tried a few single shots (easy to accomplish when set on full auto) and then short bursts followed by a long, continuous burst. It was sweet.

scouter27
October 6, 2001, 04:37 PM
What was the recoil like? Too much to control on full auto or not?

4V50 Gary
October 8, 2001, 10:59 AM
It's a small bullet & the FN P90 is easier to control than a SMG.

fal308
October 9, 2001, 09:30 AM
Saw three of them on tables at Knob Creek last weekend. Tow were on Gemtech's table and one had a suppressor on it. Don't recall where I saw the other one but it was near Gemtech's table.

4V50 Gary
October 9, 2001, 12:57 PM
Hey Barclay,

Hope all is well with you.

Gary

EQUALIZER
October 9, 2001, 01:20 PM
Does anyone know if I could purchase ammo and the FN with a class 3? I've been wanting one too. Is the ammo all that much? How much and who distributes it?

Is there anything pre-ban (mags) that are comparable in size, wt. and ammo?

Lots of ?s, but a couple of us just got to get one, or at least something close. Air soft fluff shot just isn't the same. ;)

Thanks!

eq

DUDE
October 9, 2001, 03:55 PM
As i said in one of my frist posts on this thread it is not legaly to have the 5.7x28 cartridge, the BATF ruled that the 5.7x28 cartridge is "non-sporting" and cannot be sold outside of Law Enforcement and Military agencies.
And FN is not looking to make or sell the P90 in any other round.

Benjamin
October 9, 2001, 06:48 PM
Does anyone know if I could purchase ammo and the FN with a class 3? I've been wanting one too. Is the ammo all that much? How much and who distributes it? Is there anything pre-ban (mags) that are comparable in size, wt. and ammo?



If you had a class III dealer's license, yes. No problems then.

As for the money - if you have to ask about feeding it, you shouldn't have bought it. (Highbrow way of saying that I have no clue)

Anything preban that compares.....how about a Grendel? 30 really high velocity, small bore projectiles ? It's a .22 Mag pistol, if you weren't familliar.

EQUALIZER
October 9, 2001, 10:03 PM
Thanks for the responses guys.
I'm not that familiar with the P31. Never shot one. As to pre-ban, I was wondering if many quality sub-sized autos like the FN p90 are still available pre-ban make new or used? I wasn't too clear about the "pre-ban". I was thinking not only in terms of what the "Crime Bill" did to felonize the purchase of over 100 weapons by their classification, but also in terms of 10 mag cap.

Was also hoping that the ammo would be available to a class III holder who was a lowly civilian. OH well...:( :rolleyes: Guess we can give up on exercising our inalienable rights when it comes to this one.:(

Anybody got any ideas on what would be comparable and available to the citizens at large?

fal308
October 10, 2001, 12:06 PM
Gary,
Still alive and kicking! Sorry about your DPMS having to leave.

Equalizer,
The FN P90 never was pre-ban. They weren't brought out until after the 1986 ban. They weren't even out until after the semi-auto "assault weapons" ban IIRC, and there are no semi-auto versions of them around.
If you're looking for a substitute that mere civilians can own in the USofA the closest I can think of would be the Calico pistol. These came in.22lr and 9mm. This won't get you near the same ballistics as the 5.7 but you do get the full capacity magazine holding either 50 or 100 rounds:cool:
Use the search feature with 5.7 as the keyword. I somewhat recall several threads dealing with discussions of comparable rounds.

scouter27
October 10, 2001, 01:35 PM
Do you (anyone) know where I could order one of those Calico carbines? They look like feally fun firearms.

fal308
October 11, 2001, 09:57 AM
Gun Broker has some currently listed www.gunbroker.com and search using "Calico".
Guns America also has several listings; www.gunsamerica.com and search using "Calico"
I also see them semi-regularly at gunshows.

scottMO
October 11, 2001, 05:01 PM
I got to demo one last May. It is a sweet shooter. Very minimal recoil. the selector switch was very different (if you are used to a H&K. During the demo, a round was fired and went through a kevlar helmet and vest and then into several layers of wood. But when it was fired at the wood from an angle, it didn't even penetrate the first layer of wood, but did not recochet (sp).

The FN Rep that brought the rifles, stated that St. Louis PD was purchasing these (semi-only) to replace their shotguns and that these would soon be in all of the squad cars.

I have heard that they have a flaw, that if/when a gun is dropped, the bullets in the mag will jumble up and get out of alignment, causing problems.

FWIW,

scottMO

scouter27
October 11, 2001, 07:15 PM
The mag is the only problem that I've heard of. It also spits all the rounds out if you drop an un-emptied durring a reload, IIRC.

Are there rounds that will not penetrate that much? Could be dangerous in a populated area.

4V50 Gary
September 23, 2002, 02:17 PM
Took the one day armorer's course on the FN P90. It is remarkably simple. Field strip begins with removal of the magazine. The magazine disassembles quite easily. Depress the floorplate release and slide the floorplate off. The spring and follower comes out along with two rollers. The magazine does not have any fancy mechanism to cause the bullets to turn perpendicular for feeding. Rather, it's through channels moulded into the plastic that does this. Nothing to break!

Once the magazine is removed, push the huge takedown button that is found on the receiver. This allows the receiver mechanism to be pushed forward and out of the plastic frame. Separate the moving pats group (bolt group) from the barrel/optical sight group. Disassembly of the latter requires an open ended wrench to remove the muzzle break. This allows the barrel to be pushed back slightly and usncrewed clockwise. The barrel is then withdrawn from the rear and the barrel spring pulled out from an opening on the top of the receiver. The barrel lock (which serves the dual purpose of securing the receiver to the plastic frame) may now be removed along with its spring. Charging handle slips off next.

Disassembly of the moving parts group is easy. Simply use a knife to remove the snap rings that are attached to the end of each of the dual guide rods. New snap rings are required for reassembly. The bolt slips off anda roll pin punch is required for further disassembly.

The hammer group comes out from the rear of the stock. The buttplate slides up for removal and exposes the hammer group. There's a simple lever on the hammer group that is thrown up and allows the hammer group to be withdrawn en-bloc. The trigger may be removed and requires a paperclip or screwdriver. After the trigger comes out, the operating rod (connects the trigger to the hammer group comes out next.

Won't go into further details (should have pictures) but the entire thing is so simple it's clever.

One nifty feature I didn't notice until the class is that the gun features back-up iron sights. On both sides of the rail that protects the optical group, there are crude iron sights that allows the user (right or left handed) to sight the weapon and fire.