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DML
January 9, 2001, 01:49 AM
I often hear and read comments regarding the sharp recoil when firing the Benelli M1 S90. Most folks think this is due to the light weight of the Benelli as compared to an
870 or 590. Check the specs. The M1 S90 weighs about 6.7 to 7 pounds compared to 7 1/4 pounds for the 870HD or 6.75 for the Mossberg 590. I don't see a significant difference in the weights.

Could it be that the Benelli's action is what causes the sharp recoil? I have fired all three shotguns and I find the Benelli somewhat unpleasant.

Of course, this is just my opinion and we all know what that's worth.

Al Thompson
January 9, 2001, 06:03 AM
Had one and sold it. Never did a side by side recoil test with other guns.

FWIW, my Ithaca 37s have a pretty good thump on'em too.

Giz

jthuang
January 9, 2001, 10:45 AM
I agree, I think most people will point to the inertia style action of the Benelli rather than the weight.
Subconsciously, when people think semi-auto shotgun they must think gas gun and expect lighter recoil from the Benellis. As you noted, inertia operated guns kick harder than gas guns.

Also, it has been my experience that Benelli stocks are slightly longer than normal (Gunsite's custom shop has a buzzing business cutting down Benelli stocks for over $100 a pop). Poor stock fit may also have something to do with the increased perception of recoil.

I will have to do a side-by-side comparison of my Mossberg 590 and Benelli M1S90 sometime.

Justin

NAD
January 9, 2001, 11:31 AM
A pump gun will kick just as much as a Benelli.

Intel6
January 9, 2001, 11:38 AM
One of the biggest things when talking recoil is the fact that it is a subjective thing that varies from person to person. I am 6'4", 230lbs and one of my big bores is a .460 Weatherby that I shoot frequently. What I consider severe recoil may be allot different than the guy who is smaller than me and has never shot much more than a .22LR rifle.

I see the recoil question pop up allot on the lists and I can give you my unscientific opinion. Because I am big and shoot heavy recoiling weapons, that doesn't mean I don't feel recoil, I just have learned to deal with it.

I feel I am somewhat knowledgeable on this specific subject because among the SG's that I own and shoot, I have a Rem 11-87 Police, Rem 1100 and a Benelli M3S90. I can tell you in my unscientific opinion, that Benelli's do have more "felt recoil" than the same load shot in a Rem gas autoloder.

One specific instance comes to mind when talking about this subject. I really enjoy shooting slugs and to make them cheaper to shoot, I started to cast my own. I wanted to work up a load that shot decent so I decided to load up some test ammo and shoot at some paper to try and find a decent load. At the time, the only SG I had with actual sights was my M3S90 with the rifle sights so that was what I used. I fired 50+ rounds of my hot slug reloads throught it and the recoil was heavy. When I got my MMC ghostrings on my 11-87 Police I began shooting my slug reloads in that and they were much more comfortable in the 11-87P than the M3S90. There seemed to be both less snap and less recoil with the Rem than the Benelli.

Again, this is just my opinion on things but I think the Rem gas autoloader shoots softer than the Benelli.

Zach Vonler
January 9, 2001, 03:35 PM
I recently added a 590 to the collection and both my friend I went to the range with and I thought the Benelli had significantly more recoil with the exact same loads. We thought that was sort of strange (I expected that a pump should generally have more recoil than any semiauto).

Monkeyleg
January 9, 2001, 07:53 PM
I'm glad to hear (sort of) that others "feel my pain." I thought it was old age or I was becoming a wuss. The last outing with the Benelli was five or six boxes of 00 and a few boxes of slugs. The next day my shoulder was completely black and blue. No doubt I was also mounting it wrong, as I learned in one of Dave's posts. But 870's and Mossbergs never felt like that.

Dick

Oleg Volk
January 10, 2001, 03:08 AM
I fired a couple of rounds through Benelli M1 and refused to do so again. Same for the Mossberg 590, but after one round. The guns lift up on recoil and bruise my face no matter how good the cheeck weld.

Then I tried an 1187 Police...hmmm....lovely. 3" slugs were comfortable, shot loads were less kick than my 20ga pump (1300). Got to get one of those. As far as I am concerned, gas operation is the way to go. No matter how good the specks and the reputation of the Benelli or the 870, I'd rather not have a weapon that makes me flinch just thinking about firing it.

Kalvan
January 12, 2001, 06:57 PM
I've got an 11-87, and a Benelli M1, and had a Mossberg 590. If I'm going to a 3-gun match, it's the Benelli that I'll take every time because it's lighter and more maneuverable than the 11-87 and I don't have to worry about short-stroking it, as happened with the 590 both times I used it. I've heard people say the general perception is that the 11-87 has lighter recoil because it's gas operated, but I don't have a problem with the M1 and I think it's less recoil than the 590. I'm a big guy and you could chalk it up to that, but my girlfriend likes her Benelli too and she's about 5'5". Now if I knew that I was going to be shooting a lot of slugs or buckshot, I'd probably go with the 11-87.

Schweizer
January 21, 2001, 07:27 AM
What's all that fuss about benellis recoil???

It just a question of mounting it properly.
I suggest you read the post on mounting (from Dave McC) and try what fits you best. Keep in mind that there's not only one 'best' technique. What works for others might not be good for you at all.
Try different stocks, add a pad - but most importantly check your mounting technique!
I'm not a very big guy (6 feet, 170 pounds) and have absolutely no problem to controll the recoil. I shoot slugs, magnums and even PG only - no problemo at all.
Of course after having sent hundreds of slugs down the range my shoulder also gets a little bruised but it's not that I'd be really painful or anything.

I completely agree with NAD that benellis kick just as hard as any pump or at least to me the difference is not obvious.

laissezfirearm
January 21, 2001, 07:54 AM
The bolt on the Benelli/Beretta 1200s does not begin to unlock until after the gun as a whole has started decelerating (at which point the bolt carrier continues to move backwards against the tension of the action spring), so it should provide the same "felt" recoil as a pump gun of the same weight.

Practically? Try a shorter stock. It will allow you to more quickly and accurately place the butt into your shoulder "pocket" -- assuming you've got one. If not, it will ALWAYS hammer you, unless you get into porting. Unfortunately simply adding weight to a short-recoil gun will screw up the functioning.

Dave McC
January 21, 2001, 09:48 AM
A coupla things, tho y'all have pretty well covered it. I noted on one on the Italian semi's that the pad was somewhat smaller than what I use. Larger surface area means less kick per sq/in. You might want to compare sizes,and put on a slightly larger one.It may look funny, but semis are no esthetic treat anyway.And I'd rather shoot good than look good.

The problems with kick are form,fit,gun weight and load energy. Most shooters' problems I see are first form, then the other variables.

For the techies that want to mess around with their shotguns, remember that recoil reduction is incremental. A lighter load may take away say, 2%(arbitrary number), a few oz of weight added may be good for another 2%,etc. It adds up.

BUT, you can pursue this until the Law of Diminishing Returns comes up and bites you, have perfect fit, and if you use lousy form, it will still hurt you. Shooting a shotgun wrong is Instant Karma, you'll know it immediately.

gw360
January 22, 2001, 04:31 AM
I have to agree, my M3 Convertible kicks harder than my USRAC (aka Winchester) 1300, Remington 870 or my Winchester Model 12.

What can I say, I like scatterguns :)

GGGLOCK
January 22, 2001, 08:43 PM
The pumps I've shot kick as hard as my M1S90. Even the Mossberg Jungle Gun I tried kicked as hard. The only noticeable difference was with a Vang comped 590. That thing was a ***** cat.

The best advice for managing recoil has already been given in previous posts. I won't repeat it here, but believe me, it works.

One thing I didn't see mentioned is that in Benelli's 2001 catalog, they offer an 11 oz. mercury filled recoil reducer for the M1S90 and SBE for $40. Says it's easily installed with no bracket required. I guess these fit in the butt stock? Never tried one, but it could be another option.

jthuang
January 23, 2001, 12:05 PM
No kidding, I think Gunsite's custom shop charges $110 to cut down Benelli stocks.

Justin

Hemphill
January 23, 2001, 01:49 PM
I personally think the benelli M1S90 is a ***** cat. Since I am over 6'4" tall, the gun fits me like a glove. I routinely shoot 100 rds of 3" 00 in a session with no problems. On the other hand, the 870s and most pums in general are so short as to cause me to drive my thumb into my cheek. I have a permanent scar from the repeated impacts.

laissezfirearm
January 23, 2001, 06:42 PM
>I know what I paid to get the stock on my
>Beretta cut to a reasonable length.

Should've gone DIY.

It's actually a piece of cake to chop down the Beretta stock by about 3/4". Done correctly, the only sign of the former length is the hole on the bottom for the original sling swivel position. (It's what I shot Louis Awerbuck's class with.)

All you need is a saw and a file. Takes a bit of time to get the buttpad and the exposed fragment of the skeletal frame to look pretty, though.

Of course, you can just get the Choate adjustable LOP stock for about $50.

Moe
January 28, 2001, 12:30 PM
I don't find the kick that bad with my m1s90. I think it is a bit more than the 11/87 I had but less than the pumps I had. I am of medium build 6' 170 lbs and I tend to like a long lengthof pull for rifles as I crawl the stock on them but like shorter stocks on shotguns as I am not bringing my eye to sights. In fact I think shorter stocks shoulder faster as they are less likely to catch on your jacket. Yet The long stock of the benelli don't bother me.