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manels1111
September 27, 2012, 04:17 PM
My friend was remodeling his house and found behind sheet rock in the wall this gun that I recently bought off him. I'm trying to gather as much information as I can about the gun.

It says on it US model of 1917 Remington 368457. Other than that I can't make out any more markings on the gun. I've attached some photos maybe someone can clue me into the origin of this gun.

Thanks in advance.

manels1111
September 27, 2012, 04:18 PM
2 more photos with the model number

Jim Watson
September 27, 2012, 04:36 PM
The markings don't lie.
It is a US Model of 1917 manufactured for the US Army in 1917 or 1918.
It was made for use in WW I when Springfield and Rock Island could not turn out enough 1903s. The model was also produced by Winchester and Eddystone.

Your find has been extensively sporterized with removal of iron sights, installation of a scope clearance bolt handle, installation of a thumbhole sporter stock, rebluing, and apparently drilled and tapped for two different sets of scope bases.

If it is mechanically sound and the bore in decent shape, the stock could be refinished, a scope installed, and you would have a good stout hunting rifle.

Caliber is probably still .30-06 but some were rechambered and it would be wise to check that out.

Here are some pictures of the original military configuration.
http://world.guns.ru/rifle/repeating-rifle/usa/m1917-us-enfield-e.html
Notice the receiver sight with protective "ears", the "dog leg" bolt handle, and the deep magazine floorplate with step into the bottom line of the stock foreend. All that done away with to make it into a nice sporting rifle.

manels1111
September 27, 2012, 04:49 PM
Thanks Jim it actually had a Weaver V9-W scope on it that has range adjustments up to 1000 yards. I had to take it off to actually figure out who made the gun. I bought it before I knew. It needs alot of cleaning and thanks so much for the input.

Scorch
September 27, 2012, 06:14 PM
Sporterized Enfield.

What are you going to do with it? I would take it apart and do a thorough once-over before firing it. The finish looks like it has seen some moisture, so the bore might be rusted, but it looks like it will clean up fine.

A question comes to my mind; why would someone seal a rifle into a wall? Stolen? Dunno.

F. Guffey
September 27, 2012, 07:22 PM
I have a Remington M1917, it has been voted “the ugliest”. I bid on and won the rifle for $120.00, when it comes to ugly nothing comes close to the five holes drilled in the top of the front receiver ring. The Remington M1917 was the first choice for a build because it did not have the cut out on top of the rear sight bridge. The Eddystone and Winchester had the cut, filling the hole was/is not absolutely necessary.

One of the two rear holes could double as a ‘Hatcher’ hole. The Remington M1917 is a strong receiver, I do not know if the receiver ring has been compromised because of the holes drilled in a line. The receiver/barrel square threads could offer an advantage, not my job to sell anyone on the advantage of square threads.

F. Guffey

Winchester_73
September 27, 2012, 08:19 PM
It would be a good deer rifle. In addition to the holes, it was shortened aka sporterized as others have said, and apparently reblued. I have a weaver V9 myself on my Belgium Browning Safari grade rifle. A nice scope.

tahunua001
September 27, 2012, 11:33 PM
Sporterized Enfield.
absolutely wrong. if it was a Pattern 14 rifle chambered in .303 British then it would be a sporterized enfield. however it is a US Model 1917 30 caliber, chambered in 30-06. therefore it is not, nor was it ever an Enfield rifle intended for service to the crown.

OP, a couple concerns.
1. it was hidden inside a wall. you may want to have the police run the numbers on it, just to be safe. nobody wants to have a dirty gun in their collection.

2. the bolt is not original, the GI bolts had a dogleg bolt similar to the ones of remington 600 carbines and XP-100 bolt action pistols. since that one looks like a modern sporter bolt handle you may want to confirm the caliber with an experienced gunsmith as it may have been modified to accept a different cartridge, 300 win mag seems to be a favorite with 1917 owners where I'm from.

3. though the stock may look kindof rough now, it actually appears to be quite salvageable. all it should need is some sandpaper and a fresh coat of varnish.

4. the outside looks pretty devoid of rust so you shouldn't have to worry much about moisture damage to anything but the stock. I would take the rifle out of the stock just to be sure though, when dealing with 95 year old rifles it is best to err on the side of safety.

Mike Irwin
September 28, 2012, 08:11 AM
I think the body of the bolt is original, but the bolt handle is a replacement.

It was a gunsmithing option that I remember seeing advertised (or similiar ones advertised) in 1950s and 1960s issues of American Rifleman magazine.

That thumbhole stock is very interesting. I've never seen one like it in the time frame that it appears to be from -- white line spacers like that were all the rage in the 1950s and 1960s.

velocette
September 28, 2012, 08:15 AM
Your sporterized 1917 Enfield (Eddystone Enfield, Remington Enfield or Winchester Enfield depending upon which arsenal made the rifles) was the most common WW I battle rifle. The Enfield name comes from the almost identical rifle that Remington had contracted with the British govt to produce, chambered in .303 Brit. When the US became involved in the great war, the factorys changed to .30-06 & we had the '17 Enfield. The 6 round internal magazine is a hold-over from the .303 rimmed round which the rifle would only hold 5 of.
They are the strongest of the WWI design rifles and some have said the ugliest. Their sights were aperture & far easier to use than the '03 Springfield.
After the war, Remington took the design, removed the military ears, bayonet mounts & other military things & put it in a sporter stock, It was the Model 30 Remington.
When the rifle was sold off as military surplus, many of them were sporterized as inexpensive hunting rifles. They were commonly re-chambered in magnum level cartridges due to their immense strength and long action. The level of craftmanship on the sporterization varied widely from sub Bubba to top level quality. Straigtening the bolt handle was a common change.
The '17 Enfield in the picture is mine, sporterized by me from a sub-Bubba'd rifle. It consistently will shoot 1 1/4 moa with no load development with its original GI barrel. All work was done by hand, no power tools used.
You have an an excellent quality rifle that will handle virtually any modern ammunition. Clean it up and enjoy it.

Roger
http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p235/RogerS_photo/Enfielddone012.jpg
http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p235/RogerS_photo/Enfielddone006.jpg
http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p235/RogerS_photo/17Enfield001.jpg

Mike Irwin
September 28, 2012, 09:12 AM
"After the war, Remington took the design, removed the military ears, bayonet mounts & other military things & put it in a sporter stock, It was the Model 30 Remington."


Interesting note about that...

The Remington Model 30 is one of the few commercial sporting rifles offered in the United States with clip guides that would allow loading from a stripper clip.

The Remington Models 8 and 81 also had clip guides, but use special clips that are rare as hen's teeth and even more expensive.

MJ1
September 28, 2012, 10:39 AM
I came across a scoped Model 30 in Hamilton, Montana about ten ears ago in a pawn shop. I'm not sure they knew what it was as it had been painted in several colors of green and brown and it was $275 cash only price. It was early Sunday morning and I had no cash. I came back Monday with the cash and the price had gone up to $475 and the Weaver scope had been removed and a cheapo Tasco put on the rifle.. I walked.

.303 and 3006.

This is how I like them but I would have a 1917 sporter if I could find the right one.

..MJ..

James K
September 28, 2012, 11:22 AM
It is interesting to note that Remington actually used M1917 receivers and other parts to produce the Model 30, 30S, and 720. When the WWI contract was cancelled, Remington was left with around 2-3 weeks production of receivers, barrels and other parts. Such was the wartime production volume that those leftovers provided the basis for Remington sporting rifle production for the next 20 plus years, some 30,000 rifles. Remington never actually MADE any receivers or .30-'06 barrels in all that time; they just drew on the WWI stockpile.

They used some clever tricks, like cutting off the bolt dogleg, threading the end, drilling and tapping the bolt knob, and "look ma, a new bolt!"

Also a note on the magazine. It was so big not because it was designed for the .303 British but because it was designed for the .276 Enfield, which had a huge base (.526"). That big magazine allowed the .303 to be used when the British decided not to change caliber and meant that 6 rounds of .30-'06 could be inserted. Nonetheless, the Model 1917 was always loaded with 5 round Springfield clips and the extra capacity rarely used.

One interesting fact is that some folks believe the original British rifle, the Pattern 1913, was made for the .280 Ross, or that the .276 Enfield is a copy of the .280 Ross. That is not true; the .280 Ross is a much longer round and won't fit the magazine of the Pattern 1913.

Here is a photo of some of the rounds mentioned.

Jim

MJ1
September 28, 2012, 12:56 PM
We need a like button here for posts we like or are informative. I would save a lot of quoting and reply space.

James K
It is interesting to note that Remington actually used M1917 receivers and other parts to produce the Model 30, 30S, and 720. When the WWI contract was cancelled, Remington was left with around 2-3 weeks production of receivers, barrels and other parts. Such was the wartime production volume that those leftovers provided the basis for Remington sporting rifle production for the next 20 plus years, some 30,000 rifles. Remington never actually MADE any receivers or .30-'06 barrels in all that time; they just drew on the WWI stockpile.

velocette
September 28, 2012, 03:19 PM
Jim K;
Your description of the bolt modification is almost exactly what I did on my '17 Enfield. The knob on the end of the bolt lever was hacksawed off, then the bolt was packed in wet rags & a torch was applied to the dogleg which was bent to more pleasing shape. The end of the moderately straightened bolt lever was filed down to fit inside the hollow end of the original bolt lever knob which was then welded back on. Ended up with the bolt lever shortened by about 1/2" & bent to my satisfaction.
I spent a year building that rifle & it gives me great pleasure every time I take it to the range.

Roger

James K
September 28, 2012, 04:50 PM
Remington didn't go to all that trouble. They just cut the handle at the bend and threaded it and drilled and tapped the knob, then staked the assembly to keep the knob from unscrewing. You can tell those bolts by the stake mark on the inside where it doesn't show.

Jim

impalacustom
September 28, 2012, 10:00 PM
The Remington Models 8 and 81 also had clip guides, but use special clips that are rare as hen's teeth and even more expensive. Mike the really rare and hard to get ones are the 25,30,32 that are brass. The 35 and 300 are a bit easier to get but still rare in brass, the steel ones not too bad. I have a few for my 35 and here's the cool part. Remington actually sent 1 with the rifle back in the good old days.