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View Full Version : Bushnell First Strike Red Dot + 870 = Failure Twice


plouffedaddy
July 5, 2012, 04:27 PM
http://i96.photobucket.com/albums/l178/tiffani33/IMAG1197.jpg

As many of you may remember I tested the Bushnell First Strike about a month ago on my 12gauge 870 and the product failed to live up to its' published specs. Well, Bushnell was great to deal with and they paid shipping both ways and I had a replacement unit within 2 weeks. The reps at Bushnell assured me the product could hold up to the recoil of the 12 gauge and that I probably had a bad unit.

Well, I went out yesterday to see how the replacement would hold up. After only 25 rounds, it started to crack again. I'll be calling Bushnell again tomorrow but at this point I have to say that the First Strike just can't stand up to the 12ga recoil; the proof is in the video below:

Strike Fire Review Video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y2qFBCOhudk&feature=plcp)

zippy13
July 5, 2012, 04:52 PM
Thanks for the up-date. Let's hope the third time is the charm.

Al Den
July 5, 2012, 06:11 PM
Third time? Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me. Fool me thrice, I may be dead...

Creeper
July 5, 2012, 07:08 PM
Interesting... I have some acquaintances that have used them on a Benelli M4, a heavily used Benelli M2 3-gun & a Remington Tac 4 shotgun as well as a Steyr .308 Scout rifle with no issues.

Perhaps you did get two lemons in a row. I'd be interested in knowing what Bushnell has to say about your first and second failures... the 'why' part.

I do have a question: Where is the crack... the body or the lens?

Cheers,
C

plouffedaddy
July 5, 2012, 07:51 PM
Where is the crack... the body or the lens?

It's in the lens; this time it's not as bad as it was on the last one but I stopped shooting with it after 25 rounds---when I noticed the two cracks developing. It's still visible in the video though.

Al Den
July 5, 2012, 08:51 PM
I wonder if its actually the 870 frame -- so poorly made it's flexing, twisting, and putting unanticipated stress on the holo-site. From a modern Remington pump I would NOT be at all surprised frankly...

FrosSsT
July 5, 2012, 09:14 PM
Im not a fan of bushnell optics, and you have reminded me why. Maybe you should try out the leupold red dot if you have the extra $

Creeper
July 5, 2012, 09:19 PM
so poorly made it's flexing, twisting, and putting unanticipated stress on the holo-site.

Interesting theory. A single clamping point on a 1013 rail, you'd think not... but perhaps a pressure point that applies a load to the sight body, distorting it and in turn, causing the lens to crack? Perhaps amplified by flex in the receiver? All possibilities to support a theory.

Without having the parts in my hands to check the fit and observe the possible causes for failure... the most obvious cause is a flaw in the construction of the sight.
One would assume (oops... assumption is the mother of all ______ ) that the lens is isolated, or otherwise tolerant of shock and distortion loads... to a point.

Cheers,
C

Virginian-in-LA
July 6, 2012, 05:59 AM
The 870 receiver is milled from forged steel. Rough Express chambers may exist, but that has nothing to do with this, and the rest of the Remington line up is doing just fine.
I had fits with the mounts and everything else years ago with a Weaver Qwik-Point. I have a Burris SpeedBead now and so far so good.

Al Den
July 6, 2012, 06:31 AM
...milled from soft, money-saving improperly heat-treated, forged recycled mild scrap steel?
Just sayin...

eastbank
July 6, 2012, 12:14 PM
what a lot of crap,reciever flexing may have broken the sight. i have used eotec,s,red dots and other single point mounted sights on mossberg,remington and winchester shotguns with out any problems since the sights came out. the sights were defective plain and simple. eastbank

plouffedaddy
July 6, 2012, 02:25 PM
the sights were defective

That's what I'm thinking as well... I have a Deltapoint and a RMR but I was really hoping this red dot would perform and not cost an arm and a leg. Guess:confused: not...

Pahoo
July 6, 2012, 02:43 PM
...milled from soft, money-saving improperly heat-treated, forged recycled mild scrap steel?
Just sayin...

WOW, now that's a stretch.!!! .... :eek:
Even though I've been somewhat critical of the newer issues of the Expresses, I would not go there this time. .... ;)


Be Safe !!!

TheKlawMan
July 6, 2012, 03:43 PM
Does it say that it is good to go on a 12 gauge? I only checked a couple of places and they advertise it for rifles.

plouffedaddy
July 6, 2012, 04:07 PM
Does it say that it is good to go on a 12 gauge

Sure does; on page 2 of the manual. The reps also say so.

zippy13
July 6, 2012, 06:38 PM
Perhaps you were looking through it too hard. ;)

Creeper
July 6, 2012, 06:42 PM
Perhaps you were looking through it too hard. ;)

http://ts1.mm.bing.net/th?id=I4944869486167968&pid=1.7&w=123&h=155&c=7&rs=1

Al Den
July 6, 2012, 08:00 PM
"Looking too hard"? That's just silly. OK, can't be the receiver flexing -- that's just crazy talk! Two broken sights in a row eh? I think the dots were turned up too high. But I have an insensitve question for the OP:

are you really, really, ugly by any chance, and how do you fare with mirrors in general?

;)

plouffedaddy
July 7, 2012, 07:14 AM
are you really, really, ugly by any chance,

Not according to my mom! :p



I think the dots were turned up too high.

No brightness adjustments on the optic; it has a light sensor and auto adjusts.

eastbank
July 7, 2012, 03:42 PM
getting two bad sights in a row,what are the odds of that? well i know a man who married the same women twiced,hows that for bad odds. eastbank.

Virginian-in-LA
July 7, 2012, 03:51 PM
They may have a machining issue or a lens polishing issue they are just learning of with your help.
The very best steel is made from "recycled" steel - otherwise known as scrap - these days. It's about the only "Made in the USA" steel you can find. You just test the melt and add the right alloys to get the final result you want. I've run two foundries.

plouffedaddy
July 10, 2012, 08:46 AM
Update: 10JUL12--I just spoke with Bushnell again and they were very helpful as they were last time. They're sending out a pre-paid label to have this optic replaced. The supervisor there, Jacob, inquired about the type and number or rounds I fired through it and when the cracks developed. He apologized and seemed legitmately concerned/surprised. He also stated they still have my 1st one in the lab and are still trying to figure out what was the cause of the failure.

I'm still impressed by their customer service and hope they can get the kinks worked out but I don't know if I'll run the replacement on my 870 again or just relegate it to rifle use. I'm kind of a glutton for punishment though so I may just mount it up again for part III.

Creeper
July 10, 2012, 11:50 AM
I'm still impressed by their customer service and hope they can get the kinks worked out but I don't know if I'll run the replacement on my 870 again or just relegate it to rifle use. I'm kind of a glutton for punishment though so I may just mount it up again for part III.

That's a good beta tester... round 3, coming up. :p

TheKlawMan
July 10, 2012, 12:31 PM
The supervisor there, Jacob, inquired about the type and number or rounds I fired through it and when the cracks developed. He apologized and seemed legitmately concerned/surprised. He also stated they still have my 1st one in the lab and are still trying to figure out what was the cause of the failure.

Possible, but I would think they would dig into it and get a quick, if not definitive answer, so they can head off any desigh or manuacturing problems before they have to eat a lot of these. Then it may be that the lab is backed up with so many returns that they haven't gotten to it and they are in no hurry to do so if they have a good idea what is the problem.

TheKlawMan
July 10, 2012, 12:34 PM
I'm still impressed by their customer service and hope they can get the kinks worked out but I don't know if I'll run the replacement on my 870 again or just relegate it to rifle use. I'm kind of a glutton for punishment though so I may just mount it up again for part III.

If it failed so quickly on a 12 gauge, is it likely to fail on a rifle after a bit longer?

plouffedaddy
July 10, 2012, 02:29 PM
That's a good beta tester... round 3, coming up.

Somebody's gotta do it! :D

Possible, but I would think they would dig into it and get a quick, if not definitive answer, so they can head off any desigh or manuacturing problems before they have to eat a lot of these. Then it may be that the lab is backed up with so many returns that they haven't gotten to it and they are in no hurry to do so if they have a good idea what is the problem.

I've returned a few guns/accessories in the past and never had a reaction like I've had from Bushnell on this red dot. Both times that I've called they've asked me if I minded talking to their tech guys/engineers about how I used it. Again, they all seem surprised (genuinely so) at what I'm telling them. They've also seen both of my videos and ask question after question--I take it as a good sign but who knows :confused:

If it failed so quickly on a 12 gauge, is it likely to fail on a rifle after a bit longer?

Not necessarily IMO. I've seen a Burris Fastfire fail on a Mossberg 930 but I run one on my SBR'd AK and SGL 31 and have never had an issue through thousands of rounds. The 12ga is a lot of power, probably exponentially so (I'm not an engineer here...) compared to an AR or AK.