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View Full Version : new rifle...model 94 winchester, pre 64?


k511
April 2, 2012, 11:09 AM
Grandpas model 94 winchester was my first centerfire rifle i learned to shoot and hunt with...when he passed and my brother ended up with the rifle, nedless to say i have wanted one of my own for some time...yesterday i found one at an estate sale... .30-30 cal, top ejection, excellent wood, great finish, just great condition overall...got a it at a great price aswell:D serial # is 17309** any winchester buffs out there that can feed me some info on what i got here? thanks in advance

gak
April 2, 2012, 11:58 AM
Congratulations! Definitely a Pre-64 which I think you already know. Looks to be a 1951 manufacture. Is yours a "long wood"? (Longer wood ahead of the rear barrel band than most post-50's 94s). With rare exception 1951 was the last Pre 64 year that *some* (not super rare but a minority) had that feature as regular (non-special model) production. This longer forearm was one aspect which characterized all carbines from 1894 through 1950. 1950 was the last year where--as far as I know--all were "long wood." No matter if it doesn't, but it's an added plus for some having an early 94 feature like that. In any event, sounds like a keeper! Pics required!

k511
April 2, 2012, 12:28 PM
http://s1238.photobucket.com/albums/ff485/nickharp1/?action=view&current=DSC_0594.jpg

k511
April 2, 2012, 12:34 PM
hmm my computer isant letting me attach files today :confused: and im not sure how to insert an image... i have pics on photo bucket, and the FTL faq says to enter the full url to the image :confused: and im not sure what that is..... still very much learning the computer, i swing a hammer for a living lol

k511
April 2, 2012, 12:35 PM
http://i1238.photobucket.com/albums/ff485/nickharp1/DSC_0594.jpg

http://i1238.photobucket.com/albums/ff485/nickharp1/DSC_0593.jpg


nevermind i figured it out

gak
April 2, 2012, 03:13 PM
Looks indeed like you have a long wood! Doesn't appreciably increase value necessarily or "officially" (the books don't distinguish "long wood" within the year that I know of), but for some increases desirability and hence value to them. Certainly not a minus and having that more antique "old west" or "Pre War" look separates it from the rest of the rather pupulous Pre 64 crowd. If you ever had to sell--and I wouldn't--I'd certainly list that aspect. A fine firearm you got handed down. Enjoy!

k511
April 2, 2012, 03:16 PM
Thanks for the info Gak :)

PetahW
April 2, 2012, 03:44 PM
The "model" you have is a standard "Model 94 Carbine".

.

gak
April 2, 2012, 04:16 PM
PetahW said:
" The "model" you have is a standard "Model 94 Carbine" "

...And that's just about all they made that I recall in the "Pre 64" period...versus "Pre War" when any number of rifle, combo and trapper (baby carbine) variants could be had, ...and Post 64 when a variety could be had or ordere of special editions, commemoratives and what not. Don't know if I've ever seen a Pre 64 rifle, and not even a special edition "trapper" that I can remember. Anything different available in the 40s?

Keg
April 2, 2012, 04:20 PM
Nice 94....And has some figure in the wood.....

JimCameron
April 2, 2012, 04:56 PM
K511, very nice 94. You are a lucky guy. I have a 94 made in 1952 in .32 Winchester Special that is a looker and a shooter. Nice find. Enjoy.

30-30remchester
April 2, 2012, 05:31 PM
K511, you have one unusual feature on this carbine. The buttstock has what is known as Whelen flutes on the comb. Cornel Whealan designed this type of buttstock for the model 55 Winchester. While not exactly rare on standard carbines, this type of buttstock is uncommon.

k511
April 2, 2012, 05:34 PM
interesting and good to know.... thanks for the info everyone

gak
April 2, 2012, 07:06 PM
30-30remchester said:
"The buttstock has what is known as Whelen flutes on the comb."

Good catch.

PetahW
April 2, 2012, 08:04 PM
[And that's just about all they made that I recall in the "Pre 64" period...versus "Pre War" when any number of rifle, combo and trapper (baby carbine) variants could be had, ...and Post 64 when a variety could be had or ordere of special editions, commemoratives and what not. Don't know if I've ever seen a Pre 64 rifle, and not even a special edition "trapper" that I can remember.]

FWIW, there's only TWO (2) recognized genre's of Winchester Model 1894/94 leverguns, pre-64 & post-64.

ANYTHING else is a subdivision, like post-64 Model 94AE's, & BB94's, or Pre-War whatever.

Also, Winchester NEVER designated any levergun as a "Trapper", until the post-64 period.

Anyone who says they've never seen a Pre-64 Model 94 Rifle need only look through a few Winchester reference books, if they don't have access to the real thing.

.

gak
April 3, 2012, 01:44 PM
Petah, you may be correct as to books, but as a working or practical definition most who indicate Pre 64 are referring to war-era on, and (more usually) post war up through 1963. Thus (of the top eject era) most collectors/owners refer to Pre War, Pre 64 and Post 64, subdivisions or not. If you say you have a Pre 64, 99% assume it to be 1941 or newer, and often--speaking of "subdivisions"--think in (generally) in terms of Pre 64s being post war (small case)r, just as a matter of common language used. Re "trapper" you are correct, but again it's a (more useful) working definition virtually everyone knows about. "Baby carbine" is another that was used. WWI was not called WWI at the time either.

SO, yes, you are technically correct. "Pre War" is *of course* Pre 64, but not often the terminology used to describe Pre 1941 guns. Distinction is usually made. Most folks (instead) skip "Pre 64" and take it a step further to your "subdivision" to be clearer. "Pre War" describes it so much better and why it is used.

SO, if you read my treatise, you know I was well aware of Pre War rifles, but was instead speaking of not knowing of any regular-production war-era forward (but could certainly be wrong there)...but more especially post-war Pre 64 rifles. Pre War, 'nother story, as I stated.

I usually agree with you, but not in picking semantics on this one. They're good historic and technical clarifications nevertheless.

yournodaisy
April 3, 2012, 10:16 PM
Nice rifle..I have two 1894's..one 1961 and one 1941..their awesome!

Keg
April 3, 2012, 10:18 PM
Yes..pre-war just helps clarrify what age pre-64 gun.. that is being talked about....

Ray A. Gandy Sr.
December 20, 2012, 05:44 PM
I have inherited my fathers Deer rifle, it is a Winchester 94 Rifle, with a 25 inch Octagon barrel, stamped 30 win. center fire smokeless powder only. Ser. # 202818
He bought it used from an old Indian guide around 1951, can anyone bring me up to date on this Rifle,IE: whats it worth approx. etc.

jmr40
December 20, 2012, 06:07 PM
According to this website.

http://oldguns.net/sn_php/winmods.htm

It was made in 1900

Sarge
December 20, 2012, 06:09 PM
Congrats on a splendid old rifle!

Scorch
December 20, 2012, 09:42 PM
I have two 1894's..one 1961 and one 1941..their awesome!
No, you don't. You have two Model 94s. Winchester quit making 1894s about 1927. Up to that time they were marked Model 1894 (on the barrel and on the tang), after that time they were marked Model 94. Anything after about 1927 or so is a Model 94. Not only do they look different, they feel different.

valleyforge.1777
December 22, 2012, 11:46 PM
Well, for whatever it's worth, Winchester (FNH) is making "Model 1894" again and they are in the current catalog.

Scorch
December 23, 2012, 12:28 AM
FNH sells the Model 1894 made by Miroku (not Winchester or FNH). And, FWIW, it is even farther from the original than the Model 94s (rebounding hammer, angle eject, etc).

solocam72
December 23, 2012, 08:13 AM
Nice find! My dad has 6 of these old pre 64 model 94s, I used one as my first deer rifle as was the case with many kids back in the 80s 90s, I shot my first deer and a couple more to follow with that old gun before I graduated up to my own bolt rifle, I wanted an all around deer and elk cartridge and chose a 7 rem mag, my dad gave the old 94 I used as a kid to my brother which will never part with it

PetahW
December 23, 2012, 10:23 AM
FNH sells the Model 1894 made by Miroku (not Winchester or FNH). And, FWIW, it is even farther from the original than the Model 94s (rebounding hammer, angle eject, etc).


Not to mention the tang safety...................... :rolleyes:



.

fivebux
December 25, 2012, 08:24 AM
Hello everyone this is my first time using a forum so if I'm posting in wrong area please let me know. I was just given a Winchester 94 post 64 in 44 mag. Its manufacture date i found out is 1969. What I am trying to find out is what sub model is it and if someone can help me cause it does have a feeding problem.:confused:

PetahW
December 25, 2012, 10:37 AM
Happy Holidays, and welcome to the web, fivebux.

Depending upon barrel length, and with NO other information, I'd WAG that your post-64 Model 94 .44 Mag is a standard Carbine (20" bbl) or a Trapper (16" bbl).

You should also probably expand on it's feeding issues in our Gunsmithing Section.


.

brinker
January 23, 2013, 08:36 PM
I know alot of shooters like Marlins: My Model 94/sn 2018545 I think it's around 1954. My first deer rifle, for Christmas 1961. Mom was a hunter and she had a Marlin, Gave me the Mod 94 I don't recall the cal. of the Marlin but she always said it was nicer. That the 30/30 was a brute. I haven't hunted with the 30/30 in years. I used my 1903 Springfield. This coming year I traded for a model 700 243 Winchester and I plan to hunt with it. I still Target with the Springfield, It's original and I roll the dice every time I shoot it. When I was young I watched the lone ranger and Roy Rodgers, I noticed the lever action Winchesters, I can't recall for sure but all the lever Actions had round barrels. also latch top Springfields were in alot of movies. Good luck with your choice, Be careful and shoot clean Sunny

Malamute
January 23, 2013, 10:10 PM
FWIW, there's only TWO (2) recognized genre's of Winchester Model 1894/94 leverguns, pre-64 & post-64.
ANYTHING else is a subdivision, like post-64 Model 94AE's, & BB94's, or Pre-War whatever.

Also, Winchester NEVER designated any levergun as a "Trapper", until the post-64 period.

Anyone who says they've never seen a Pre-64 Model 94 Rifle need only look through a few Winchester reference books, if they don't have access to the real thing.



The early type carbines seem to be generally recognized, usually called "saddle ring carbines". That distiction or variant is more desirable than a later, post war, or even pre war ramp sighted guns. After the early type carbines (saddle ring carbines) went out, and ramp sights came in, they pretty much look alike, other than the long wood forends.

Pathfinder45
January 24, 2013, 02:07 AM
Mine was made during WWII. Sometime later they changed the hammer from checkered to serrated around '48to '50, I think, to speed production or reduce costs. Shortly thereafter they changed from long-wood to shortwood forearms. Old Winchesters have a grace and poise that the new ones don't quite get.