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603Country
January 21, 2012, 05:38 PM
Based on info from this forum, I ordered some new water based surfactant carbon remover (Slip2000 Carbon Killer) and some Boretech Eliminator for copper removal, though it's an all around cleaner. I decided to try the new stuff first and follow up with my 'old' stuff to check if the new stuff missed anything. The old stuff is sometimes Butch's Bore Shine and sometimes Shooter Choice and a couple of different copper removers that have ammonia. The test was on my Ruger 260 which I knew had a dirty bore. I used the Carbon Killer first, and the first patch was very dirty (as expected) and the second patch was less dirty than I would have expected, as was the third. Then I used the Boretech Eliminator, following directions carefully, and got some blue (copper) and a small amount of carbon. After I let it soak for a while and used a nylon brush as directed, I got no more carbon but got plenty of blue. After a few more patches and soaking I finally got no blue and no carbon on the patches. Then I dragged out my old chemicals and started from scratch. Used to be that no matter how hard I worked, there were still traces of fouling. This time...nothing. Nothing at all. So if the new chemicals didn't get all the copper and carbon, the old chemicals sure didn't find or remove anything. I'm impressed with the results and I worked far less hard than I did using the 'old' stuff. Next I'll try them on my 223, which I can never seem to get totally clean.

Cowboy_mo
January 22, 2012, 11:07 AM
I just purchased and received the same products but haven't had a chance to use them yet...

Sounds like I will be a happy camper:)

CowTowner
January 23, 2012, 05:47 AM
I just purchased and received the same products but haven't had a chance to use them yet...

Me too! I should be cleaning up post hunting season this weekend.

I decided to run through cleaning my CZ 75BD and the Kadet 22 conversion I have too.
I have only one word for the outcome, WOW!

Universeman
January 26, 2012, 02:38 PM
i just purchased some "wipe out" this is a foam cleaner you spray and leave in for 60 mins then just wipe it out. i used it first on the barrel of my Kimber custom tle 2. which had copper fouling i could see and couldn't get rid of. after wiping the stuff out the copper was gone. it says for the really dirty barrels you can leave this stuff in over night. which i did for my .257 wby and the next morning i ran a patch through and it was deep dark blue. after that it was cleaner than ever before. didn't harm anything to leave it on all night. i would highly recommend

hooligan1
January 29, 2012, 04:49 PM
I have a bad copper fouling problem in my Vanguard, as I have been testing some new loads. I worked on it today for about two hours only to find I haven't got it all,,, I'm sure I'm whittling it down so to speak but I'm kinda amazed at the products that I normally use, (and have good results usually)have had no real effect on the fouling. You can see the copper on the rifling at the muzzle end.
Here's a list of stuff I have tried today: Butch's "bore shine", Shooters Choice mc#7, Hoppes # 9, Smith &Wesson "bore gel, Barnes "Copper Remover.
So far the Barnes had the biggest effect but still no awards are going to be given to these suckers. I am currently working on data with the Swift Sirrocco II and the 160 grn Accubond from Nosler. I think its the Swift bullet laying the copper down because I use Accubond bullets in two other rifles and they have no trace of copper in the bore after a regular cleaning.

I like some of you, will have to try the Wipe-Out, but its the shipping from Midway that I can't understand( it's higher than the cost of the product), it's almost too expensive for me right now.

amamnn
January 29, 2012, 05:04 PM
Have you actually looked at the bore using a scope?



It's been my experience with a lot of the new chemicals (some named above and some others as well) that they reach a point where, although no traces appear on the patch, there is still fouling in the bore which can be easily seen with a borescope.

It may not be absolutely neccessary to have the bore squeaky clean, but if you do, you know where you are starting--anything less leaves you in doubt as to when the fouling will start degrading accuracy..............Nylon might be ok for toothbrushes but it does not do the job that bronze or aluminium brushes do on fouling--another look with the borescope reveals that the metal brushes do no harm to the bore.

603Country
January 29, 2012, 05:10 PM
hooligan, try that Boretech Eliminator. Shipping was not extreme (not that I remember) and the results were amazing. Like you, I was working and working on the copper with the usual stuff (ammonia types) and not really getting it all. I can't swear that this new stuff got all the copper, since I don't have a borescope, but I think maybe it did. I guess you can say I'm still in the early testing phase, but results so far are excellent. Next week I'll be working up 260 loads and 220 loads, so I'll have plenty of dirty bores to contend with.

hooligan1
January 29, 2012, 05:31 PM
Where did you find the stuff,, do tell??

603Country
January 29, 2012, 08:15 PM
hooligan, I got the Boretech Eliminator from the Sinclair catalog. To get the Slip2000 Carbon Killer and the Slip2000 lubricant, I had to go to their website. I didn't mention the lubricant in the earlier discussion, but I bought that because it supposedly has to reach some extremely high temp before it'll carbonize in your bore. Whether or not that's true, I just don't know. But, the lubricant had milspec numbers all over it. Right or wrong, I'll take that to mean that Uncle Sam is buying it.

When you order the Boretech, you might want to get some nylon bore brushes. That was strongly advised on the bottle, and from the way a blue gusher came out the end of my barrel, it might really eat your bronze brush in short order. I wonder what's in that bottle.

CowTowner
January 30, 2012, 05:44 AM
I got the whole kit and caboodle at Brownell's.

Cowboy_mo
January 30, 2012, 08:39 AM
+1 for Brownells as the source of these products.

Hooligan, I compared Midway to Brownell's for these items and since Brownell didn't have to charge sales tax and their shipping was lower than Midway, that's where I purchased.

hooligan1
February 4, 2012, 08:08 PM
Right on man, I went to Cabelas today to check out what they had, I purchased the "Gunslick Foaming Bore Cleaner", it came highly recommended, and the reviews were good on most sites, so I purchased a can and went to work.

Although it took some more of the copper out, it failed to completely remove this buildup of copper, that you can literally see from the muzzle.:(

I'm going to order the Eliminator next friday!!!!:(:mad::(:o;)

CowTowner
February 6, 2012, 10:23 AM
Get the rimfire version as well if you want your .22's cleaned up really well. Good stuff, Maynard!

Jerry45
February 6, 2012, 11:08 PM
After reading the OP I ordered, received and tried some Boretech Eliminator last week. Stuff really works. I’ve used Hoppies # 9 for years and could never seem to get all the copper out. I started using Frog Lube a couple of months ago and the people that market it assured me it would “season” the bore and prevent copper from fouling. It seemed to be doing a good job of stopping any new fouling but I still wasn’t satisfied (seemed to be some old fouling left behind) hence the reason to try Boretech Eliminator. The Boretech Eliminator really does a fine job. I followed the instructions and after I though all the copper fouling should have been removed I was still getting a slight green color. I was using a brass jag so I switched to a plastic one. Walla! No more green.

I still like the Frog Lube but will be containing to use the Boretech Eliminator to clean the bore. Thanks for the heads up 603.

madcratebuilder
February 7, 2012, 08:57 AM
The absolute best bore cleaning I have achieved is with a DIY electrolysis tank.

I've had barrels I thought where complete junk come out looking near new.

http://www.surplusrifleforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=80&t=62728

Eazmo
February 7, 2012, 03:57 PM
I received my new products yesterday.
I ordered direct from slip 2000 , carbon killer and gun oil.
direct from bore tech , eliminator and a few sizes of there nylon brushes.

So i had a few minuets this afternoon to test. and WOW both of these products really work!

I grabbed a 4" stainless GP100 (eats only full jacket rounds)that was not filthy but pretty dirty. I started with Eliminator, followed directions of a couple of wet patch's down the bore and cylinders for the loose stuff. Then followed by a wet nylon brush and let it sit for 15 min. Next clean patch down the bore and wow it came out blue. A second patch and all clear. now wet patch with carbon killer and let sit 15 min.
I have never been able to get the black carbon out of the cylinder flutes and it just wiped right off. same with inside the frame by the forcing cone just wiped clean. awesome product!!!
I have always had a hard time with the fouling ring in the cylinders also. It took a second application on a couple of them but it basically brushed right out.

I think it is key to let the products soak and do there thing! DWELL TIME.

So far super impressed. I will tackle an AK with about 1800 rounds thru it this weekend for an extream test.

Not sure on the gun oil yet as it feels diferent, we'll see how things look after some range time.

hooligan1
February 10, 2012, 09:16 PM
Alright, I get it!, I called Larry over at Columbia and he's sending me some Eliminator.
Universeman, that product was my last choice, and if this Eliminator fails me I'll try it.

I spent an hour or so out at Cabelas last Sunday and they had the Gunslick Foaming bore cleaner, which I tried and tried, and tried, and yes I even tried for the fifth time, and it probably will be fine for the regular,"run of the mill" fouled barrels, but not this one.

The Eliminator is in the mail, and if it works like "advertised" they will have a spokesperson in me, that hast no equal man!~!!!!;)

hooligan1
February 24, 2012, 05:12 PM
Alright just got back from a 2 week nonstop work trip, just pushed the twentieth patch through and it's still gleaning copper....... hopefully the eliminator I'm about to leave "overnight" will ELIMINATE this damn copper fouling.

A good thing I've noticed so far is that it is starting to remove said fouling that I can actually see. Man my fingers are crossed,, who'd think a swift bullet would foul this badly....:(

hooligan1
February 26, 2012, 07:52 AM
Well guess what fellas, I have got the copper out of my Weatherby finally and I'm satisfied... I actually slept all night... Boretech Eliminator works wonders and is now part of my usuall rifle cleaning operation.....

Three thumbs up!!!!:eek::D

Jerry45
February 26, 2012, 07:57 PM
My Remington 700 06 is almost 40 years old. When I was young I used to hunt with it. I’d fire maybe ten rounds every couple of years. Cleaning consisted of keeping it well oiled. I’d run an oiled patch then dry patches and repeat until the dry patch wasn’t “black” anymore. Maybe five patches. I just started shooting it again a year ago and was using Hoppies and Remmi oil in the boar. Never did get much copper or carbon out. Then I started using just FrogLube a couple of months ago. It was getting the carbon out but didn’t seem to be removing any copper. Kind of hard to tell as it doesn’t change color and the patches were coming out clean looking. I started using the Boar Tech Eliminator the time before last range session. The fist patch was black black black. After letting the Boar Tech sit the patch came out Blue Blue Blue then started coming out lighter and lighter green. Last range session I ran three wet patches down the Bore and headed home. BLACK, BLUE, BLUE, green, green, green, clean. About bout 30 patches worth. I believe there was a LOT of carbon and copper layers from years of buildup. I believe I still have some clean up to do but I also believe it’s just about ALL out.

AR and .17 cleaned right up first time.

mxa
February 27, 2012, 10:32 AM
With all the good success people have had with boretech I'd like to try some but which boretech product are you using? They have special formulas for carbon and one for copper ... and a few others.

Eazmo
February 27, 2012, 12:49 PM
yes they do.
most of this about using Eliminator.
I believe this is there general all around cleaner.

I'm gonna try some of there rim fire blend next.

Jerry45
February 27, 2012, 01:05 PM
This http://www.midwayusa.com/find?userSearchQuery=Bore+Tech+Eliminator+Bore+Cleaning+Solvent+

603Country
February 27, 2012, 01:50 PM
I've been doing a lot of shooting (load workups for my 260), and I've tried quite a few combinations of cleaning solvents to see what worked best or worst. Keep in mind that I don't have everything that the market offers, but I do have quite a few. So here's what I think that I know:

Best. Slip2000 Carbon Killer, followed by the Boretech Eliminator

Almost as good. Butch's Boreshine or Shooter's Choice, followed by the Boretech.

Wrong order. The Boretech, followed by the Slip2000 Carbon Killer.

Summary. Without a doubt, the Boretech Eliminator is the best Copper remover I've ever used. The Carbon Killer is excellent, but I"m not going to say it's the absolute best in my experience. It probably is.

Some more of what I THINK that I've found, is that just maybe you don't want to remove all of the copper every time you clean the bore. My best accuracy appeared to be after I used the Carbon Killer and the Boretech Eliminator to clean the bore down to the steel and then after I shot 10 or 12 rounds I cleaned with only the Butch's Boreshine. That's when I got the best groups, though maybe that was just accidental. I just don't know for sure, but I am wondering if maybe it's best that the bore does have some copper. I wonder what the extreme accuracy shooters would say about wanting a little copper in the bore or no copper at all. Probably it would depend on the individual barrel and maybe even to some degree whether it was button rifled, cut rifled, or hammer forged. All this heavy thinking is way over my pay grade but I have always been, and remain, an inquisitive Engineer.

CowTowner
February 28, 2012, 07:52 AM
I'm gonna try some of there rim fire blend next.

I have and it's just as impressive as the regular.

Eazmo
February 28, 2012, 10:01 AM
Thanks Cow,

It;s on my next order!