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Kaliburz
August 6, 2000, 01:52 AM
Okay, got a buddy who just got a Mauser Carbine made for Argentina in Berlin, 1891 model in 7mm Mauser. It has a 24" barrel. The stock ends right near the "barrel stepdown". It has no upper handguard, as the riles do. The stock has the hole where the cleaning rod goes (no rod). Near the barrel stepdown, it looks like there was some kind of band around the barrel (maybe for the sling??)

Now, I was wondering, what did a dang think look like factory. All the pics we find are for rifles or just show the bolt area, but not the entire rifle. We think it's been modified...or it's just missing some minor parts, like a front spring swivel. Other then that all the numbers match, bolt too.

I understand its hard to get an idea how this thing looks like without a picture, but figured I"d ask.

Kaliburz

johnbt
August 6, 2000, 07:05 AM
Okay, if I can type w/o spilling my coffee. From the Stand.Catalog of Firearms: Argentine Model 91 Rifle: A 7.65mm bolt action rifle w/ a 29" bbl., 5-shot magazine, full length stock, cleaning rod and bayonet lug. Also made w/ a 17.6" bbl. without bayonet lug. Approx. 180k rifles and 30k carbines were made in 1891. All stamped w/ Argentine code of arms. (no pictures) John

Harley Nolden
August 6, 2000, 07:23 AM
kaliburz:
Argentine Mauser 1891:
This is the first Mauser magazine rifle, having the protruding box single line magazine found in the Belgian 1889 and the Turkish 1890. Made in Germany The Argentine Mauser is little more that the Turkish Mauser Model of 1890 with some very small modifications. There were minor changes to the bolt and the extractor was straightened. Apart from this they were virtually identical. Refer to Turkish Mauser for Further information.

I will shend a photo by separate email.
HJN

James K
August 6, 2000, 10:45 PM
The Argentine Modelo 1891 carbine has a 17.63" barrel and is full stocked to the nose cap. It has a handguard from the front of the rear sight to the band, and a sling bar under the pistol grip. It is 7.65mm, not 7mm.

HTH

Jim

rrgardner
August 25, 2014, 07:59 PM
I have come across one that I found in a basement I was working on. I checked it and found out it was called an engineers gun a shorter version for non combat soldiers or civilians. Does anyone know where I could get a new or used bolt for this modlel as the one I have needs one?

Goatwhiskers
August 26, 2014, 08:03 AM
rrgardner, check e-gunparts (Numrich), they likely will have one. Bear in mind that you will have to get the headspace checked before firing, the bolt may fit correctly or not. If not gunsmith adjustments will be required. GW

Jim Watson
August 26, 2014, 12:03 PM
There were a lot of Argentine 1891 rifles cut down to kind of a Mannlicher carbine type profile by shortening the barrel back to the nose of the stock and cutting down the front band and bayonet lug into something more streamlined. Sounds like Kaliburz's Bud has something of the sort. Not Argie GI.

Lakota
August 26, 2014, 01:12 PM
I have one that Bubba got his hands on and made a sport rifle out of it.
I have been trying to get an original stock for it with no luck.
It is an accurate little carbine and I use it for Deer and Hog hunting.
It is one of favorite shooters and a great little truck gun

http://i1057.photobucket.com/albums/t396/Buckhead3/102_0493.jpg http://i1057.photobucket.com/albums/t396/Buckhead3/102_0496.jpg

Lakota
August 26, 2014, 03:04 PM
That is the 1891 Argentine 7.65 x 53 carbine it will only fire the the 7.65 Argentine ammo it should say 7.65 Argentine on the box and on the rim if it is hunting ammo and 7.65 x 54 on the rim of the surplus ammo. It will fire the 7.65 x 53 and the 7.65 x 54 ammo.
Hey rrgardner Like Goatwhiskers said check Numrich. The last time I was on there about a week ago they had some but I don't think they had any curved handle bolts. Or check Liberty Tree I know you can get one there but you will have to buy all the parts and put it together your self. Not cheap but will give you a great little rifle. The Argentine Mauser was one of the best small ring Mauser's made.

James K
August 26, 2014, 08:54 PM
7.65x53 and 7.65x54 are the same thing. The case actually measures 53.5mm, and some makers rounded up and some rounded down.

Jim

F. Guffey
August 27, 2014, 09:14 AM
7.65x53 and 7.65x54 are the same thing. The case actually measures 53.5mm, and some makers rounded up and some rounded down.

Jim

When looking for dies do not turn down bargains if the box is stamped B.M., The 7.65 BM stands for Belgium Mauser, the same die works when used on 7.65 Turkish Mausers.

F. Guffey

James K
August 27, 2014, 10:38 AM
7.65 was the first caliber offered by Mauser in its smokeless powder line of bolt action rifles, and in the early days, the only one. The next, the 7x57, was not developed until 1892.

The company did not offer the 8x57 because it was a German government development and Mauser did not have the rights to use it. (Also, at that time, Paul Mauser was ticked off at the government for not consulting him when designing its new rifle, so I have little doubt that pride was also a factor.)

Of course at that time, the 8x57 had not yet reached the dominant position it later achieved, and both the Mauser company and its customers felt that the 7.65 was just as good.

Jim

F. Guffey
September 11, 2014, 10:10 AM
The 7.65 BM stands for Belgium Mauser,

And there is not enough curiosity, why call it the BM? Why not the 7.65 German Mauser?

Could be a Turkish Mauser with a BM chamber or an Argentine Mauser with a BM chamber. I have BM dies that fit all of the 7.65mm53 chambers. To assure matching sets of cases I have the 7.65mm53 forming die.

F. Guffey

James K
September 11, 2014, 12:58 PM
It was called the "Belgian Mauser" cartridge because the first rifles to chamber it were made for (ready for this?) Belgium. A better term might be simply 7.65 Mauser, since, as noted above, the 7.65mm was a Mauser proprietary cartridge.

The Mauser rifles made for Belgium, Turkey, Argentina, Bolivia, Colombia, Paraguay and maybe others at that time were all made for the same 7.65mm cartridge, no matter what someone chooses to call it. Later, most of those countries adopted the 7x57 or the 8x57 cartridge, but Argentina continued to use the 7.65 into the semi-auto rifle era.

Minor point. The country is BELGIUM. The adjective form is BELGIAN. So please, it is "Belgian rifle", not "Belgium rifle".

Jim