Met a guy from Illinois today

[willrussellville]

I am out of state in MS on vacation. After dropping the wife off at the outlet mall, I went to the local gun shop that cousin recommended. A guy from Illinois walked in and was looking at some 22 rifles. He asked the clerk what he could purchase and clerk responded, nothing if you are from Illinois. He wasn't surprised and I asked him a little about living there after reading posts here about IL being unfriendly to firearms owners. He showed me a gunowners card in his pocket from the state of IL. I asked him if the state knew every gun he owned and he responded yes. I said, man ya'll need to elect some different folks and he said we are either going to or I am moving to Texas. So... does the government know every gun in the state (that honest people own)?

[egor20]

I've bought a few guns overseas, gun shows and FTF sales, Virginia doesn't have a registry, I suppose they could find the Form 4473 of the one's I have bought at LGS's though.

[jgcoastie]

For the law-abiding folks? Yes, IL knows every gun they have.

[chasep255]

Long guns or hand guns? I know NJ keeps track of hand guns but not long guns.

[Davey]

I asked him if the state knew every gun he owned and he responded yes.

For the law-abiding folks? Yes, IL knows every gun they have.

False and false.

The state does not have any type of registration. FOID card is not proof whatsoever of firearm ownership. The only spot in IL that has registration is Chicago and that's not even that many. Recent news piece stated a little under 3,500 of the 100,000+ FOID holders in Chicago actually have a Chicago permit.

[C0untZer0]

I know in the past I could have purchased firearms in Louisiana and IL would not have known about it. Maybe that's changed but there was nothing stopping me from purchasing firearms in LA in 1985.

[youngunz4life]

Met a guy from Illinois today

Did you give him a powerhug?:D

[willrussellville]

I should have given him a powerhug(good advice)! I felt really bad for him as he walked out. I did a litte reading after posting this and apparently Chicago is the challenge.
Question to Davey. This person had a state issued card. What is its purpose if not to register his guns? I know I get a Federal check for felony every time I purchase and it goes on the vendors books as to disposition of the gun, so technically I guess the government knows guns I purchased from FFL. But I have swapped and bartered for guns also from individuals. I guess I question why a state card? Do other states have this? Is there a "penalty" for having a gun in IL without an FOID?

[cecILL]

The FOID card is abut the same as your driver's license. You drive any car you want, or borrow any car you want, or buy any car you want. Same here with firearms. Just have to have the card. The card is issued for 10 years.

Still a three day wait on pistols and a twenty-four hour wait on long guns. Illinois does not have the types of bans that a lot of other states have. There are other posters here that live in downstate Illinois (not Chicago). I believe they would agree that Illinios is not such a bad place to live.

It is against the law to possess a firearm or ammunition without the FOID.

Hope this helps.

[Talin342]

Actually, you don't need a driver's license to buy a car or even borrow one much less have one in your posession, so no, it's nothing like a FOID.

However, you do bring up a good point since cars a much more effective killers than guns.

[sigcurious]

Actually, you don't need a driver's license to buy a car or even borrow one much less have one in your posession, so no, it's nothing like a FOID.
May not be a perfect analogy, but I sure like to test drive cars before buying them, driving them after I buy them, and I certainly don't lend my cars to people without licenses... ;)

Owning a car without a license is like owning a gun that's been made inert, sure you can look at it and looks like all of its friends, and it makes a great paper weight, you just cant use it for its original intended purpose...

[Spats McGee]

Actually, you don't need a driver's license to buy a car or even borrow one much less have one in your posession, so no, it's nothing like a FOID.
May not be a perfect analogy, but I sure like to test drive cars before buying them, driving them after I buy them, and I certainly don't lend my cars to people without licenses...

Owning a car without a license is like owning a gun that's been made inert, sure you can look at it and looks like all of its friends, and it makes a great paper weight, you just cant use it for its original intended purpose...
As regards the car, actually, you can, at least on private property. You do not need any license to buy a car. Nor to drive it on private property. You can drive it on the farm and on private property all you want. You just can't get out onto the public streets.

[Pahoo]

False and false.
Like most "perfect" laws, this one is not and they are aware of it's imperfections. Sadly, not only is it a weak law, it's a bad one for the private citizen. ..... ;)

Two weeks ago, I too had a conversation with an Ilinoise citizen, buying a handgun from an Iowa dealer. When he went to pay for it, the Iowa dealer asked him for his FOID card and then stated that there would be a $25.00 shipping charge to an Illinoise dealer and he would have to wait the three days. In addition to having to go out of his way to pick it up, he would pay an additinal $10.00 transfer fee as well as the Illinoise tax. .... :mad:
Needless to say but the guy was disappointed and then proceeded to bad mouth Chicago politicians. I told him that is went deeper than that.

Be Safe !!!

[mrray13]

A FOID card doesn't register your weapons, only permits Illinois residents to buy them, and ammo.

I know I get a Federal check for felony every time I purchase and it goes on the vendors books as to disposition of the gun, so technically I guess the government knows guns I purchased from FFL. But I have swapped and bartered for guns also from individuals. I guess I question why a state card? Do other states have this? Is there a "penalty" for having a gun in IL without an FOID?

Same as in Illinois. You fill out your paperwork, they call it in, and log the sale in their book. Individual to individual is even simpler, just copy and keep their FOID information, as well as firearm sold/traded information for 7 years. (might be 10)

No answer as to why a state card.

Yep, there is indeed a penalty for an Illinois resident to own/possess a firearm, or ammo, without a valid FOID card.

Basic faqs about the FOID (http://www.isp.state.il.us/foid/firearmsfaq.cfm)

(430 ILCS 65/14) (from Ch. 38, par. 83‑14)
Sec. 14. Sentence.
(a) A violation of paragraph (1) of subsection (a) of Section 2, when the person's Firearm Owner's Identification Card is expired but the person is not otherwise disqualified from renewing the card, is a Class A misdemeanor.
(b) Except as provided in subsection (a) with respect to an expired card, a violation of paragraph (1) of subsection (a) of Section 2 is a Class A misdemeanor when the person does not possess a currently valid Firearm Owner's Identification Card, but is otherwise eligible under this Act. A second or subsequent violation is a Class 4 felony.
(c) A violation of paragraph (1) of subsection (a) of Section 2 is a Class 3 felony when:
(1) the person's Firearm Owner's Identification Card
is revoked or subject to revocation under Section 8; or

(2) the person's Firearm Owner's Identification Card
is expired and not otherwise eligible for renewal under this Act; or

(3) the person does not possess a currently valid
Firearm Owner's Identification Card, and the person is not otherwise eligible under this Act.

(d) A violation of subsection (a) of Section 3 is a Class 4 felony. A third or subsequent conviction is a Class 1 felony.
(d‑5) Any person who knowingly enters false information on an application for a Firearm Owner's Identification Card, who knowingly gives a false answer to any question on the application, or who knowingly submits false evidence in connection with an application is guilty of a Class 2 felony.
(e) Except as provided by Section 6.1 of this Act, any other violation of this Act is a Class A misdemeanor.
(Source: P.A. 91‑694, eff. 4‑13‑00; 92‑414, eff. 1‑1‑02; 92‑442, eff. 8‑17‑01; 92‑651, eff. 7‑11‑02.)

Penalties for not having a FOID...

Entire FOID statute here (http://www.ilga.gov/legislation/ilcs/ilcs3.asp?ActID=1657&ChapAct=430%26nbsp%3BILCS%26nbsp%3B65%2F&ChapterID=39&ChapterName=PUBLIC%2BSAFETY&ActName=Firearm%2BOwners%2BIdentification%2BCard%2BAct%2E)


Just in case you wanted to read a little, lol.

[Davey]

Question to Davey. This person had a state issued card. What is its purpose if not to register his guns?

Some say it was instated to keep black people from owning guns but I don't know about that. The purpose? To make it harder to own guns. It's completely worthless and doesn't solve a single problem. It pretty much doesn't do anything that an ATF 4473 form doesn't do.

There is no gun registration in Illinois at the state level. When you go your gun shop and pick out your gun you show them the FOID, fill out the 4473 form, NICS check, come back 24/72 hours later, hand over the monies, play with your new gun. Chicago on the other hand is like taking out a mortgage.

[sigcurious]

hehe spatz, I was just pointing out its a lot more like a driver's license than "nothing like"

[Spats McGee]

sigcurious, that's fair enough. Personally, I find the driver's license comparison interesting. I've seen postings by antis in which the idea has been put forth that "we should treat guns like cars, and make everyone who wants to use it get a license."

My response? If the antis really want it that way, fine . . . , but I'm not convinced that they have thought it through:
1) You don't need a license to buy a car.
2) There's no minimum age to drive a car (on private property).
3) Anybody with enough funding can own one, regardless of age.
4) Felons and the mentally ill are allowed to own and drive cars.
5) There's no background check required to buy a new car.

[abelacres]

Spats,

What's so sad is that driving / owning a car isn't even a right it's a privilage.

I have some in-laws in Ill.

You can't buy guns or ammo without the FOID card, but you can buy all the reloading components you like.

[Spats McGee]

You can't buy guns or ammo without the FOID card, but you can buy all the reloading components you like.
All of the components? If that's the case, is reloading without an FOID legal? I would assume so. If ammo possession is illegal without an FOID (it is, right?), but reloading is legal, then I wonder at what point the legal reloading becomes illegal ammo possession.

[ConlawBloganon]

I am currently residing in a place outside of the US that has extremely draconian gun laws. It is always interesting to talk to people from the other side. They think I'm nuts, but the feeling is mutual. :D

[Pahoo]

A couple of years ago, I attended a Gun Show in central Illinoise. In observation of my gun show ediquate, I asked a dealer if I could look at an old Savage-99. He said no problem, if I could show him my FOID card. I replied that I was from Iowa and we do not issue these but I did have an Iowa Pistol Purchasing Permit. He was rather hesitant as he did not know how to handle this. Finally let me look at the 99 and after handing it back, asked him what that was all about. ... :confused:

Could be a bunch of smoke but, he stated that dealers are not allowed to let anyone handle their guns unless they had a valid FOID card so as not to allow a felon to have a gun and they could be procecuted for doing so. Seems as if there was an incident up-stated that got a dealer into trouble for allowing a felon to "hold" one of his guns. ..... :eek:

Looks like it's not easy to be an FFL dealer, especially in Illinoise. .... ;)

Be Safe !!!

[Baba Louie]

So IL does not register guns per se... but the worse of two evils, the dreaded potential gun OWNER...

...which makes sense from a politicians POV. Gotta know WHO might have what. I'm sure it's all about Officer Safety, much like handgun registration in Clark CO NV (Las Vegas et al) which has been around since 1965.

How long has IL been registering citizens who might own guns & ammo? Just curious as to the history and time frame. I guess... 1968 perhaps? (looked it up) Yep. What happened that year? Let me think... oh yeah, Yippies in Chicago upsetting the DNC convention. dirty dam yippies (Abbie Hoffman IIRC)

...and ever since, peace reigned in the land of Abraham

[Sailor1911]

Yep, I was there then. That's when King Richard the first quelled the uprising of the masses. Made the Rodney King beating look like a cake walk.

[Eagle Eye]

You don't need a license to steal a car or to use a stolen car. And you don't need a FOID card to steal a gun or to use a stolen gun. But it sure keeps the honest people honest....LMAO!

[C0untZer0]

The police are not here to create disorder, they're here to preserve disorder.

Richard J. Daley

..

[chack]

It always blows my mind how casually people accept restrictions and infringements on their constitutional rights. It makes me wonder how long it will be before someone decides that a permit is needed to own books or personal libraries are limited to a arbitrary capacity.

[abelacres]

Spats,

I'm not sure. Another family member had went up for a vist and found primers and powder on a heckuva sale at a sporting goods store. He asked if he needed a FOID card to buy supplies and he was told no and could buy all he liked. (Which he did.) Could have been a screw up on the clerk's part, but I would just imagine they are pretty well trained.

[Davey]

It always blows my mind how casually people accept restrictions and infringements on their constitutional rights. It makes me wonder how long it will be before someone decides that a permit is needed to own books or personal libraries are limited to a arbitrary capacity.

We have at least a half dozen or so cases going on right now fighting the nonsense here in IL. A lot of people are fighting hard over here.

[jsimmons]

If you think the Feds *AND* the state of Texas doesn't know who owns what and how much/many, you are sadly mistaken. Are they supposed to keep that info? No. Do they? I'd bet a paycheck that they do. Just wait and see.

If a terrorist event hapens, Marshal Law will go into effect, and they WILL be knocking on everyon's door that has purchased a gun (from a dealer or through a FFL) or ammo (online or locally with a atm/credit card), and you'll be standing there wondering how they knew.

I hope you have a place to hide your stuff...

[blackriderhank]

you can buy ammo in IL without an FOID if you are not from IL. Individual firearems are not registered in IL. FOID and gunhateing pols are one of the reasons I left IL

[Mike38]

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[kraigwy]

Don't know much about Ill laws, always wondered how they would act regarding the LEOSA.

Last fall I took a motorcycle road trip to Camp Perry OH. I crossed through Ill on I-90/80, (the part where you have to pay extra to drive, we don't have them in Wyoming). At one of the rest areas I was warming up and met some Chicago Cops who were on a MC day trip.

I was wearing my old APD leather Jacket (it was cold) which still has a faded APD Patch. One of the guys ask me if I was a cop. Jokingly I told him I had been but stole the coat when I retired. That didn't seem to impress him. He asked if I was carrying and I just grinned and say "don't know, am I"? He just shook his head and walked away.

They didn't seem as friendly as most cops I've run across. Hope it wasn't an example on CPD. Later I found out about Chicago being uppity to people traveling through with guns.

They got some funny rules back east.

[mrray13]

Yep, kraig, you met Chicago's finest, and their elitest attitude that only they should carry. I know state troopers from my way, who have been hassled by CPD. Seriously. They don't think any off duty officers should carry, save for themselves.

And I could go on about the way they act off duty, in personal vehicles traveling through down south. Some of my favorite traffic stops, lol!!!

[Terminus009]

Now that every state in the republic allows ccw for law abiding citizens in one form or another, except THIS state, I'm sure the politicians and CPD can feel the water up around their necks. The 2nd Amendment is getting its day in court all over the state and I believe, if we all do our part, writing our legislators regarding this issue, it is inevitable that a non-discretionary ccw law will be passed in the near future. If not, it is further inevitable that the districts outside of Cook county will begin nominating and returning pro-2nd Amendment candidates for seats in Springfield. I, for one, am actively involved in this effort. I urge my fellow Illinoisans to do the same. NRA-ILA can help us get organized. Visit the NRA-ILA website, Grassroots page, to find out more.

From Southern Illinois,
Let's get busy!
J