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View Full Version : Question on SBR/Pistol uppers.


HKFan9
July 5, 2011, 09:12 PM
I have never done any of the tax stamp NFA stuff before. I have an ar-15 now... that has a BCM 14.5'' upper on it, but the flash hider is pinned and welded.

I work in a gun shop.. and the smiths let me take any left over AR parts they do not need usually.. so I have spare parts and rebbuild kits laying around.

I was tossing around the idea of building up a AR Pistol, but here is my question. The only really spare part I do not have at the moment is another registered lower. I plan on buying one registered as a pistol shortly... but I did not know if I assembled the upper with a short barrel... and my only existing lower is a registered rifle lower... if I would get in trouble.

I WOULD NOT pin the short upper onto my rifle... but can I get in trouble for simply having the short upper assembled in the house... before I build a registered pistol lower?

Frank_CPL_USMC
July 5, 2011, 09:23 PM
not a %100 sure, but 1) it sounds like youre in california, and 2) one thing i have heard on the subject is if you a SBR upper, and no pistol lower to match they could nail you with intent to assemble an illegal SBR. not quiet sure how the registering of a pistol lower works though. I have a 9mm AR and was throwing the idea around on whether to make it a pistol or not when i first set out to build it, and decided to just go with a full size carbine.

rjrivero
July 5, 2011, 10:42 PM
"Constructive Possession" is the new term they are tossing around with regards to situations like this. (They used to call it "Constructive intent" but with intent being hard to prove, the decided to rename it "Constructive Posession.")

So, you own a complete AR. Now if you have an "orphan" short barreled upper, and no legitimate lower, either a pistol lower or a registered SBR, for it to mate to, then you have "Constructive Possession" of an Illegal Short Barrel Rifle. It makes no difference if you have ever mated that Short barrel upper to it or not.

The chances of getting pinched on this is probably pretty slim, however, it is a felony that carries with it a possiblity of 10 years in club fed.

Frank CPL USMC: There are many states besides California that require registration of pistols.

HKFan9
July 10, 2011, 12:02 AM
I do not live in CA... I am actually from PA where we do not have a "registry".

But they way I understood it was when buying a stripped lower... and intending to put a pistol buffer tube on it... and a short barreled upper in means of making an AR-pistol.... when one was purchasing the stripped lower it would have to go both on the 4473... AND the Application of Sale for a handgun.... seeing as it would be configured as a HANDGUN, not as a rifle with a stock.


I see what you mean with Constructive Pocession... although stupid... I guess it does look like I would be attempting to break the law. I guess I will just wait until I buy a AR Pistol lower to build the upper.

David Hineline
July 14, 2011, 12:05 AM
For a $200 tax and some paperwork you can build it as a short rifle and have a gun you can use not a stupid oversized pistol/rifle wannabee.

HKFan9
August 8, 2011, 10:35 PM
I thought about Registering a SBR... but in PA... we can keep HANDGUNS loaded in our car... with my CCW.... I unfortunately cannot keep a rifle or a shotgun loaded in the car.

I was thinking a AR pistol in a "GO" bag in the trunk would be a nice thing to have.

LukeA
August 8, 2011, 11:35 PM
but in PA... we can keep HANDGUNS loaded in our car... with my CCW.... I unfortunately cannot keep a rifle or a shotgun loaded in the car.
Does the law indeed say that?

David Hineline
August 8, 2011, 11:57 PM
If that was my thinking then I would go with the factory Sig pistol and not have to deal with the AR buffer tube out the back.

It takes what 1.5 seconds to load the AR SBR in your trunk if needed, having a shoulder fired gun is worth the ability to aim over having a gun that is loaded.

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=245634211#PIC

rjrivero
August 9, 2011, 10:48 AM
It takes what 1.5 seconds to load the AR SBR in your trunk if needed, having a shoulder fired gun is worth the ability to aim over having a gun that is loaded.

In some states, a Loaded Magazine weather it's in the long gun or not, is considered having the gun loaded.

Now a loose bunch of 5.56, a magazine, and a rifle, will take considerably MORE time to load than 1.5 seconds in such states.

HKFan9
August 30, 2011, 11:51 PM
I like the idea of the buffer tube on the back of an AR pistol. The Sig is nice... but with a Buffer tube... specially the ones with foam.. or I've seen people wrap them in para cord... you can indeed shoulder fire it.

There is not much recoil from an AR.. so the buffer tube does not hurt your shoulder... but you can use it to brace and fire and get a good cheek rest.

That AND its the fact I have TONS of spare AR parts laying around at my disposal.... seems like it would make sense to at least buy a lower and make them into something shootable.:cool: