PDA

View Full Version : Fighting dirty?


irish52084
May 17, 2011, 06:05 PM
I don't know how many of us have thought about this, so I thought I'd bring it up.

How hard and dirty are you willing to fight in a street fight? Do you adjust your level of "fight" based on perceived threat? Are you unwilling to fight dirty? Do you train to fight or defend yourself with something other than a firearm, or at least to get to your gun?

I know for me, if I feel threatened I have no qualms about fighting dirty. I don't think twice about the old groin kick/punch, eye gouge, biting etc... If you're going to attack me you better be willing to accept some serious pain in return, cuz I'm in it to win, not to look good doing it.

tape
May 17, 2011, 06:08 PM
my fighting days of rolling around on the ground is over, the only fight I'm going to be in is a gunfight.

irish52084
May 17, 2011, 06:11 PM
So are you saying that if someone grabs you and drags you to the ground you just give up if you can't get to your weapon? Surely this is not true.

I'm not talking about strictly fist fights here, but more or less how you respond to a situation forced upon you with physical violence.

bigbaby
May 17, 2011, 06:18 PM
Once it starts your instincts take over. The only thing 'dirty' would be getting your ass kicked because you were thinking; especially about how you should respond. If someone owes you money or has disrespected your sister maybe you measure your response, but if you are attacked, you must assume it is your life that is on the line.

tape
May 17, 2011, 06:19 PM
I'm 50 and disabled, and yes, if I can't get to my weapon I through. I have a dislocated fractured vertebrae in my neck and plagued with chronic pain, I'm easy to give an asswhip'n too.

ClayInTx
May 17, 2011, 06:37 PM
Outside the ring there is no such thing as a dirty fight, and sometimes inside the ring.

Ichiban
May 17, 2011, 06:42 PM
Fist fights are for the school yard and the ring. Any physical altercation I get involved in will not be started by me and will be perceived as a life or death situation, thus it will fought with no "rules."

BeachHead
May 17, 2011, 06:43 PM
It doesn't matter if it's a life or death encounter, or a fight where someone just wants to rough me up -- I'd fight to win.

Pahoo
May 17, 2011, 06:52 PM
A real fight, is kind of like sex; If it aint dirty, you're not doing it right. .... :eek:

I'd like to think that there is one more good fight left in me but some mornings, I really question that. ...... ;)


Be Safe !!!

Roger Ronas
May 17, 2011, 06:54 PM
Losing sucks. You fight to win, there are no rules in a fight.
Just like I don't understand "Rules of engagement" or rules of war, when you are in a war it's all out fight to win.

RCR

BeachHead
May 17, 2011, 06:58 PM
My thoughts exactly. Would you want to risk getting the snot kicked outta you or possibly worse, all because you thought it'd be sporting to fight on a level playing field? No. Capitalize and take advantage wherever and whenever you can.

gearhounds
May 17, 2011, 07:06 PM
Outside of professional competition, there is no such thing as a fair fight. To me, as an LEO, a fair fight is the one I win.

ripnbst
May 17, 2011, 07:13 PM
"Just like I don't understand "Rules of engagement" or rules of war, when you are in a war it's all out fight to win."

Well there are rules of war so that when we are in Afghanistan and Iraq we don't kill everything that moves. The tribal wars in Africa where they rape and kill women, those are wars with no rules.

Streetfights are meant to be fought dirty. I have never been in a true "fight" knock on wood. But if I were, one of us is going to the hospital no doubt about it cuz I am not stopping until its that way on one side or the other. If you are conscious, I'm striking you again. If I am conscious, I'm striking you again.

dreamweaver
May 17, 2011, 07:16 PM
there are no rules in a street fight.
do unto others before they do unto you.

tape
May 17, 2011, 07:18 PM
never been in a true fight lol, I got pool cue and beer bottle imprints in my skull

highvel
May 17, 2011, 07:24 PM
Fair is whatever it takes!

publius
May 17, 2011, 07:33 PM
My days of "bar brawling" over stupid stuff ended in college. If I get in a fight today it will be real and dangerous, eye gouging, groin kicking/grabbing/, biting are all on the table.

tony pasley
May 17, 2011, 07:47 PM
Rules for fighting-" I win."

WC145
May 17, 2011, 07:52 PM
Fighting dirty?

Is there any other way?

chadstrickland
May 17, 2011, 07:52 PM
as someone already said..in the street there is no such thing as a fair fight...fight as if your life is on the line..because it may well be...:)

C0untZer0
May 17, 2011, 07:58 PM
Kicking someone in the balls is fighting dirty.

Shooting him in the balls - well there's just no phrase to adequately describe that.

SwampYankee
May 17, 2011, 07:58 PM
Well, I expect this to be closed shortly, and not without reason (only the least of which is the attempt to evade the language filters- thanks "tape").

But the fact is that if someone attacks you, they are already fighting dirty.

This 2011. Not 1011. There is no honor or chivalry in modern society. There is law. Well established and well enforced law. And if you break the law, expect to be punished by the person you attack firstly and the state secondly. This is not England. While you may be arrested for defending yourself, self preservation is every man (or woman's) right.

egor20
May 17, 2011, 08:04 PM
IMHO a "fair" is a place to look at horses, sheep and goats, eat cotton candy and ride the ferris wheel. A fight is a bit different. I prefer fairs myself.

tape
May 17, 2011, 08:11 PM
you're welcome Swamp

Catfishman
May 17, 2011, 08:18 PM
I'm all for defending myself to the end. But, every situation is different. Sometimes, I would avoid groin kicking, etc. I don't want to be on the ground hoping for mercy from a guy(s) with sore XXXXs.

rifleman8
May 17, 2011, 08:32 PM
There needs to be a really good reason for me to fight someone. 99.9 percent of the time I will walk away from any conflict. However, if I am attacked, I will do whatever necessary to incapacitate the attacker, preferably within 30 seconds. If you are involved in a fight any longer than that, you shouldn't be fighting, you should be running.

shootniron
May 17, 2011, 08:41 PM
While you may be arrested for defending yourself

If I am gonna be arrested anyway.....hell, I might as well shoot him.

Ringolevio
May 17, 2011, 10:24 PM
I want to expand on what a number of others have said, and which we discussed in the thread on "Non-lethal Weapons".

Fighting with nothing but your hands belongs only in the ring and in the movies.

My generation was raised on movies and TV that taught us that only a bad guy would pick up a chair and break it over his opponent's back. We were also taught "No hitting below the belt" and "You don't kick a man when he's down."

But in the real world, the first rule of streetfighting is "Have something in your hand." And when a man is down is exactly when you should kick him. If you put him on the ground, you have to make sure he doesn't get up under his own steam. And kicking him makes more sense because if you kneel down to punch him (like in the movies), that's when his partner will kick you in the head.

Buzzcook
May 17, 2011, 11:22 PM
Fighting dirty is a concept reserved for the ring, where there are rules.

A better idea is to fight smart. Learn the basics of self defense, practice them, and keep in shape. You'll be better than 90% of the guys out there.

Of course for those of us over a certain age weapons make things easier.

champ198
May 18, 2011, 12:27 PM
in a hand to hand combat fight there is only one rule in my book...there are no rules....im a small guy at 5'10" 180 or so and not in the best shape...i used to be pretty heavy in martial arts back in my early 20s..in my 30s now and got fatter and lazier...aint no fight fair dont care what it is...i dont ever plan on fighting fair...ever...ill use whatever possible to win weather it be a rock or a twig dont matter to me...if its there and i can get it ill use it...period

Spats McGee
May 18, 2011, 12:40 PM
I like the way egor20 put it:
IMHO a "fair" is a place to look at horses, sheep and goats, eat cotton candy and ride the ferris wheel. A fight is a bit different. I prefer fairs myself.

I'm over the hill, out of shape, and haven't been in a physical fight in about 30 years. I have a wife and daughter who depend on me. I think we can all do the math from there. An attacker forfeits any right to claim, "No fair!" Fair takes a backseat to survival.

HiBC
May 18, 2011, 12:59 PM
There is something about using your head first.Best to not be in the situation.
But,you can get unlucky enough get attacked.
If you find yourself in a fair fight,your tactics sock.
I will not sport or ego fight.The rules are pretty much the same as for deadly force self defense.And then,the whole point would be inflicting grave damage by any means possible.

Claude Clay
May 18, 2011, 01:27 PM
if someone is meaning to be wrong to me i am going to give them every chance they will allow me to to go away.
that has worked for me and up until the 1st thing i have to do is the last thing i want to do--shoot to protect me & mine, I'll continue to be that way.

besides, what BG wants to be in a 'fair' fight. they pick the fight cause they think they have the upper hand. the trick is to show them they are wrong before they are too close to you to wave off. situational awareness is your job--all the time.

Hog Hunter
May 18, 2011, 01:35 PM
In a street fight there are no rules so I dont belive there is dirty fighting. I will do what I have to do to take my opponent out as quick as possible and be the last man standing. I try not to fight anymore and havnt been in one in a while. Although me and my buddys do like to box a lil bit just to mesure our egos I reckon. Usally on a friday or saturday night after a few cold one go down. Its all in fun and we shake hands when the gloves come off.

YARDDOG(1)
May 18, 2011, 01:53 PM
IF I'm to fight someone, I'll make my own rules :D
Y/D

ChrisJ715
May 18, 2011, 02:04 PM
Well said everyone. No rules in a real fight. As my martial arts teacher is fond of saying, Making it home to your family alive, that is what counts.

Ronbert
May 18, 2011, 02:26 PM
But you have to keep in mind the jury fight for your freedom later.

This means that if you've put the guy out for a bit you still can't kill him. Even if you're still really, really angry and he really, really deserves it.

When the fight hits pause, it's time to run away/get help/call 911.

markj
May 18, 2011, 02:29 PM
How hard and dirty are you willing to fight in a street fight?

Most folks wont fight me, they get hurt too bad. Heck I could trip and fall on someone and darn near kill em. Grew up fighting nasty, rip off a ear guy will leave you alone, or make em do the chicken, they will leave you alone. (To learn about the chicken, read the choirboys)
Better leave the nice stuff to the ring guys, in the street there is no ref to stop it once someone gets hurt.

old bear
May 18, 2011, 02:37 PM
At my age anyone who attempts to fight fair, what ever that is, is a fool. The last fight I was in was 10 + years ago, we ended up on the ground and it was not ending as fast as I had hoped for, so I bit the son of a bitch on his right arm. I mean BIT drew blood and all. That ended the fight then. Cops arrived he called me a sissy for biting and I called him lefty.

Naby
May 19, 2011, 07:48 AM
If you are involved in a fight of any kind where your (or somebody your defending's) life even appears to be at stake I believe in using every method possible and as much force as I have available to me to viciously and quickly win the fight and incapacitate and stop the attacker(s). This follows many other opinions, just stated in a different way.

jhenry
May 19, 2011, 08:15 AM
A wise man once said "There is no second place winner" Any real fight is going to find me getting as dirty and underhanded as I can possibly manage.

Daugherty16
May 19, 2011, 08:49 AM
However, when it is time to fight, or pull the gun, you must be first on the draw.

As a kid, in the schoolyard, there was "reputation" to think of. In an assault, there is only survival to consider. There are no rules except blitzkreig.

I'm older, a little heavier, and not as strong as i used to be, but i can still grapple someone and strike them in the adams apple two or three times, a several nasty uppercuts to the chin and nose, locked thumb gouged into an eye - all this in a furious flurry of about 2 seconds or less. Then destroy their knee or break down an elbow or distend the shoulder joint as i'm spinning away. Then i'm running away, as fast as my carcass can wobble down the street.

People don't keep fighting when they:
a) cant breathe
b) can't see
c) cant stand up
d) can't feel their arm
e) are in excruciating pain (not always, but it definitely detracts from their concentration).

In a multiple attacker situation, you have to do this to the biggest toughest guy there - and fast - and you're still probably gonna get a bad beating. But maybe not. If you've just destroyed the "leader" in a mere couple of seconds, the next one may hesitate to jump in.

I'm thinking seriously about buying a cane - that has a 1 million volt stun gun built in. There are distinct advantages to carrying a striking weapon, especially one that has the ability to incapacitate an attacker. Either that or a sjambok - a very useful piece of plastic. The south African riot squads used them to great effect in the past. Of course theirs were rhino skin, but the plastic ones are pretty devastating too. Check them out.

http://www.donrearic.com/mightysjambok.html

irish52084
May 19, 2011, 10:37 AM
It's good to hear everyone's wiling to do what's necessary to survive.

I've always been a big guy and physically imposing, but I'm not an aggressive or confrontational person. I have rarely had people mess with me or want any sort of altercation, especially since I was about 14 and I really grew into my body. I was 6' and 200 lbs by 14 and had been grappling with adults since 11, so I got pretty strong pretty quick and I leaned how to get beat about 100 times over. lol That was a great lesson in humility and just how bad of an idea it is to fight unless you absolutely have to.

I'm growing more and more fond of getting some more serious training with a knife. I carry one most of the time anyway and my basic knife training could use some serious sharpening. See what I did there?:D

Mike38
May 19, 2011, 10:52 AM
My father told me when I was a teen, never get into a fight with someone over the age of 50. At that age, you have nothing to loose. A guy 50+ will do anything to win. Anything. Groin shots, gouge eyes, pull hair, scratch, bite, you name it they will do it and do it quickly. I have always remembered that, and now that I’m over 50, I realize my father was right. The only fair fight is the one you win. Not that I’m looking for a fight, because pain hurts. But if I had no choice, no chance to flee, and was convinced my life was in danger, I’d do anything to survive.

EastKY_DO
May 19, 2011, 11:07 AM
Whatever it takes to win is fair in a fight. If there are rules to follow, then it's not a fight, but a sporting event.

Sporting events occur between willing participants. Fights occur between a perpetrator & a defender.

Couzin
May 19, 2011, 11:37 AM
I'm 50 and disabled, and yes, if I can't get to my weapon I through. I have a dislocated fractured vertebrae in my neck and plagued with chronic pain, I'm easy to give an asswhip'n too.

BS! 62 and disabled - but it ain't gonna be a 'fair fight' - I will be fighting to save my life - there will be no 'rules'!! I have been fortunate enough to have had a background of both street brawls as a youth and formal defensive/offensive training later. There are lots of ways to take the 'fight' outta someone with minimal effort. I suggest some training (it can be done even if creaky and disabled - trust me). Maybe some krav maga (we never had a name for it, it was just eye gougin, ear peelin, finger breakin, etc.).

"If you find yourself in a fair fight, your tactics suck." — John Steinbeck

MLeake
May 19, 2011, 11:58 AM
I'm not even sure why this is a question. Off the mat, or outside the ring, the issue isn't about "winning," it's about survival.

Fight with rules when it's a sport. Fight to survive when it's a battle.

Pretty simple, really.

m17s_guy
May 19, 2011, 12:10 PM
and the general consensus is:

1. Don't mess with the older guys, they don't have enough energy left to fight you. They will just shoot you.

2. Watch out for the younger guys, they bite :D


Plain and simple in a street fight/ assault situation, first thoughts should be to disable your opponent. Striking joints to make them bend in directions that they are not supposed to is a great tactic. When someones knee bends left or right, when it is supposed to be forward/backward puts them on the ground, no matter how much adrenaline they have. As for kicking someone while they are one the ground, in most states that goes beyond the use of justified force for self defense. At that point you should be retreating and calling LE for backup. If the assailant gets up and comes to assault you again you should already be condition 1 and draw down while the police are en-route. Showing a little restraint will keep you from being charged with assault in a self defense situation.

JerryM
May 19, 2011, 03:23 PM
Fighting in the street is not a game. For me it is an attack that is likely to take my life so guess what?

I cannot imagine why I would get in a "street fight." Even in my youth I never thought I was tough, and never saw any reason to prove I wasn't. A lot of young guys have to learn that the hard way or by "The schools of hard knocks."

By staying away from bars and tough areas I never had a single fight. How do some of you get in them and where do they happen?

Regards,
Jerry

BeachHead
May 19, 2011, 04:24 PM
Wrong place, wrong time?

Someone mentioned that staying fit and learning basic self-defense would put you above 90% of would-be assailants (not sure what exactly the user stated, but you get the gist).

I'd have to disagree, at least a little. I took Muay Thai and BJJ for 4 years and honestly some of the guys in the gym weren't very good people. With the popularization of MMA, more and more people are learning to fight, even if for the wrong reasons. That's why I say to win at all costs -- within reasonable self-defense parameters, of course. No one wants to die or be put in a coma. I'm sure we all agree on that.

MLeake
May 19, 2011, 07:43 PM
JerryM,

Last physical altercation I thought I would be in, that did not involve a bar, involved a man assaulting a woman outside the downtown Federal building. I parked the car at the first safe spot and sprinted over... it only took seconds to find somewhere to put the car, but the guy had run off. I tried to talk to the woman, see if she was ok, asked her if she needed a ride to the local PD, or a shelter, when the guy came back.

Turned out to be her husband.

Thought I was going to be in a big fight, in the middle of a domestic dispute, right in front of the Federal building. You'd be amazed how many people had just walked on by (most appeared to be attorneys; business suits and attaché cases).

I remember thinking, "She's going to stab me in the back if I hit him..." when she very quietly said, "it's ok, I'm just going to go with him."

Point is, I wasn't at a bar; I wasn't anyplace one would expect a problem. In fact, I was there for an appointment with the Navy officer recruiting office.

But it almost was a fight, and it wasn't much fun wondering if either of them had a knife, and how things might go. (I was unarmed, of course, heading to a government office place.)

Edit: Modify that statement. I've talked down a couple of drunks, while I was on active duty, in situations that could have gone south. One of the guys had assaulted some enlisted personnel; the other ended up assaulting a Chief later that night. I got a chewing out by my Senior Chief, though - he pointed out that if either the sailor or the Marine had swung at me, they'd have been in huge trouble for assaulting an officer. Better to let the NCO's handle things. (Both the guys involved in the separate incidents were drunk; I was at work.)

Dre_sa
May 19, 2011, 09:51 PM
I will use what ever is at my disposal to match the level of the threat. perhaps even escalate a little bit. I will not lose a fight if I can help it. And my firearm is there as a last resort.

I will, however, avoid a fight with all I've got first. I do not desire to be in a fight, but if it is inevitable, I'm not going down if I can help it.

Remember, the only unfair fight is the one you lose :rolleyes:

scar_47
May 26, 2011, 12:02 AM
The only "dirty" fight is the one you lose, if its not a competition the only thing that matters to me is being able to walk away.

moose_nukelz
May 26, 2011, 12:23 AM
Do what you can to defuse the situation. If that fails use violence of action to get the job done quickly so you can break away and call law enforcement.

Edward429451
May 26, 2011, 12:30 AM
What a refreshing thread! Not much debate here, is there? I feel surrounded by true Americans right now.:D

Alls fair in Love and War. War's on the street, Exhibition Matches are in a ring.

LockedBreech
May 26, 2011, 01:08 AM
Just another voice in the choir.

I will apologize, digress, avert my eyes, keep my voice low, and do everything possible to avoid any conflict. As holder of a lethal weapon, this is an absolutely necessary responsibility.

However...once battle is joined, there are no depths I will not stoop too, and no viciousness I will not unleash on my opponents to neutralize a threat to myself and others.

No fairness. No apology. Eyes, teeth, groin, throat. Fingernails, kneecaps, elbows, toes.

MikeNice81
May 26, 2011, 01:23 AM
"If you ain't cheating, you ain't trying hard enough."

The only rule in a street fight is to stay alive at all cost.

SocialAnarchist
May 26, 2011, 03:42 AM
I am 52 years old and have used this line plenty of times to explain my attitude about fighting anymore.

If I am involved in a fight now, it isn't because someone said my wife is fat or my car isn't cool. It is because I am fighting to save my life or the life of a loved one. I may not win but my oponent will be blind or ball-less when we are done. Fight dirty? Is there any other way when your life is on the line?

The best answer is situational awareness, avoid confrontation unless it simply is not possible. But if a fight breaks out use whatever means available to make sure you win, once your opponent is down, LEAVE the area and call the police.


I have what I think is a funny story about the last bar fight I avoided about 20 years ago. I was sitting in a bar just having a beer and talking when some obnoxious **** started arguing and trying to **** people off. I said calm down and have a beer. His reaction was let's go, right now, outside. I looked him right in the eye and said okay, but keep this in mind, if we fight, one of us is going to die and I don't care which one. He cocked his head and said what does that mean. I said it means I will fight you, but I don't give a **** if I kill you or you kill me, but one of us is going to die. He stepped back looking really puzzled and said never mind and walked away. Stupid bravado on my part but it did eliminate the threat!

BGutzman
May 26, 2011, 08:11 AM
So long as my life is under direct and immediate threat (or that of my loved ones) and the intent and ability of cause grevious bodily harm or death is clear then there is no such thing as dirty fighting.

I will use any amount of force necessary to stop the threat, any techniques and weapons and whatever so long as I deem it necessary and the least amount of force necessary to bring the attack to a stop.

When its your life there is no such thing as honorable fighting.. An old unattributed chinese say goes: When two tigers fight one will get mauled, the other will die...

Dwight55
May 27, 2011, 08:18 AM
You can usually find out who the loser was when you figure out who did not get bad enough, . . . fast enough.

At 66, . . . heart condition, . . . one bad shoulder, hip, and knee, . . . I'll probably get .45 caliber bad just as quickly as I can get to it.

I'm not taking a whoopin' from some smart alek 1/2 or 1/3 my age just so he can get my billfold or brag to his buddies. I break to easily, and it takes far too long to mend.

May God bless,
Dwight

Eghad
May 27, 2011, 09:49 AM
When I was younger I got into a few physical altercations defending other people. Now I try to avoid them at all costs and defuse the situation or call 911 and let law enforcement handle it if nobody is in imminent danger. I plan ahead to stay out of places where I would be in this situation.

MLeake
May 27, 2011, 12:09 PM
Eghad, my ex got into a potential situation at the changing house at a public beach. Some dirtbag was beating and choking his girlfriend. My ex intervened, all 5'3" of her, in a bikini.

Should she have avoided a public beach, in broad daylight?

Or perhaps she should have just not gotten involved...

As I noted earlier, I had another confrontation outside the Federal building, in view of the front doors, in a downtown area. Another domestic violence case, as it turned out, although at first I thought it was a mugging.

My point is, it's fine to avoid known problem, or even likely problem areas. But if you think that nothing will ever happen because you only go to "nice" areas, you may find yourself getting some nasty surprises.

Eghad
May 27, 2011, 01:20 PM
I believe I said if no imminent danger to a person is involved

I agree that there is no such thing as a safe place anywhere not even your own home. Why I keep my 12 guage handy at home and at least have a means of self defense on my person at all times. You should be aware at all times.

I was deployed overseas to a Muslim Country that was our ally. All I could carry was a pocket knife. I had to go off the post into the population on a regular basis. I sat down and planned my trips to avoid certain areas based on the intelligence and some of the alphabet soup guys advice.

Our local paper has crime maps available. I take a peek at em and plan accordingly if they are between point A and B.

If it is something that law enforcment can handle I let them handle it.

If someone is imminent danger then I will help them out. If I can defuse a situaion verbally I will do that. Force should be the last or only option.

MLeake
May 27, 2011, 01:56 PM
Eghad, those are all sound practices. And it's also good that you realize bad things can happen in nice places, too. Some people seem to think "nice neighborhoods" are magic talismans. (Then again, some seem to think guns are, too.)

You obviously don't fall into that crowd.

Cheers,

M

redstategunnut
May 27, 2011, 02:04 PM
If I'm in a fight, I'm going to do whatever it takes to win.

hogdogs
May 27, 2011, 02:13 PM
"The only unfair fight is the one I lose!"
"The only fair fight is the one I win!"

I have ZERO personal morals or rules limiting my self defense!
I am 100% a self preservationist.

I was the tiniest kid in every grade with the exception of a couple girls above 8th grade level. It was scrap or die for me as I was a "Bully Target".

Later in life and having run in a number of colorful circles there were numerous times where big ol' fellas (not all were my personal friends) would warn a possible adversary that "Brent ain't the guy you want to be messin' with..." One buddy once told a guy, "He will feed you your jewels so fast you won't even know what you are eating."

Eyeballs, ears, and any other body parts I can get a hold of can be removed... one way or other...

I am no where near as physically able as I once was and for that I tend to bring implements to bear to assist in my victory.

Brent

markj
May 27, 2011, 02:47 PM
I was the tiniest kid in every grade with the exception of a couple girls above 8th grade level. It was scrap or die for me as I was a "Bully Target".

Just the opposite here, I was always the biggest, everyone made fun of me, too tall, too fat, etc till Iput a beating on em. I found that isnt the best way. In high school I often stopped the idiots from getting after some one smaller than they were. I am still friends wit ha few, one is a lawyer for a entire town out west in case he is reading this :)

I was raised up fightin, Dad pitted my brother and I almost every night till first blood was drawn. Then he got us into boxing, wrestling, football all the contact stuff he could get us into. I also bounced at his 2 bars. Been a lot of fights I hate to say. Nothing good ever came from a fight.

I recommend avoiding them. I wont let someone get beat too bad, there is a time to step in.

Eghad
May 27, 2011, 02:49 PM
The way I look at it the best weapon you have is your brain. When I was in high school one of my history teachers told me I had a good brain and I should try using it sometimes. lol

she was right.

Lawyer Daggit
May 27, 2011, 07:20 PM
First rule of a gun fight- bring a gun
Second rule-incoming fire has right of way
Third rule- fight dirty

kozak6
May 27, 2011, 07:45 PM
What? Touch gloves, and come out fighting, just like the ref says.

Keep it clean. It's not worth risking point deductions or disqualification.

dabo
May 28, 2011, 01:36 AM
Is there really such a thing as a fair fight? Just askin'...:rolleyes:

Steviewonder1
May 28, 2011, 07:48 PM
At 63 YO I have taken 5 Gunfighting Courses in the last 18 months. I already have shot IPSC for 19 years and these courses honed my Street Skills even more including how to handle the street before and after shot are fired. I have never had a street brawl and do not intend to get into hand to hand fighting. I do not go to "Stupid Places" with "Stupid People" at "Stupid Times". This gets rid of more than 99% of the issues unless you live in Cabrini Green in Chicago. I am not going to go man on man with some idiot that has an issue with the world. I do not have time to answer questions from street urchins and put up the Fence with them, this usually takes care of them. Those will get a large quantity of die loaded Mace in the face and body if they move to offensive mode. I am always in orange mode when walking on the street and yellow in the car. If there are two who threaten that is a disparity in force and I am permitted to draw, then I will give one verbal loud warning and if they proceed, will shoot the loudest one first with as much as it takes to shut him up and then the next, then repeat as necessary. This is why I carry high capacity guns and very good "Social Ammo". I train to shoot very good and do in close range combat. I go to the range and do street drills every week.

Boberama
May 28, 2011, 07:51 PM
Depends on who's attacking.

kaylorinhi
May 28, 2011, 07:59 PM
Hit fast, Hit hard, Hit often!

DRBoyle
May 28, 2011, 09:09 PM
Technically that women who fought her way to her .22 firearm fought dirty. There was/is a thread here about her. From memory she was in her bathroom?Eitherway a fight for your life is just that.

Edit;
Here's the thread with story
http://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=450911

seeker_two
May 28, 2011, 09:34 PM
I made a decision a long time ago....I may not land the first blow, but I will land the last blow....

irish52084
May 28, 2011, 11:33 PM
Steviewonder1: I think you made some very good points. That awareness keeps you out of 99% of situations, but sometimes it just happens. Know your limits and use what you have to survive.

Sensai
May 29, 2011, 08:19 AM
If you ever find yourself in a fair fight, you need to re-evaluate your tactics!

Carne Frio
May 29, 2011, 08:52 AM
The first rule in fighting:

1. There are no rules.

Tyrant
May 29, 2011, 12:13 PM
Fighting is something children do unless its in the ring. If some one approaches me aggressively then I am defending my life. End of story.

jct61765
May 29, 2011, 12:46 PM
You dont fight to fight, you fight to win!

fightingbard
May 29, 2011, 01:00 PM
It is my understanding that, for some people "to get into a fight" is actually a state of mind, rather than the physical act itself triggered by instinct.
People who are trained in fighting sports, and people are who trained to "survive, no matter what", can enter this state of mind quite easily. For they are trained to do so. Then follow the steps. Try and control the fight etc. etc.

For the average person it is not a decision. Both the survival instinct and the physical act itself comes to be at the time of the actual fight. Therefore desperate.

However, I believe either one will fight "dirty", if taken by surprise. That is no question at all...:)



All the best

Old Wanderer
May 29, 2011, 02:16 PM
The title of this thread caught my eye. Being an "old guy" but one who still travels a lot internationally, I am from time to time faced with the usual assaults and muggings that are part of our world today.

I suppose I look like easy prey, an old grey haired foreigner, to the street punks.

I know I cannot turn back the clock 40 years, so I start a 30 second timer in my head. IF I have not won this engagement in that 30 seconds, I will loose...pretty good motivator to do what it takes. 40 years ago, I was an instructor in a dojo, in Korea Town (Los Angeles), my main clients were cops and hookers, both wanted the same training, how to put the maximum amount of pain on somebody, in the shortest time possible. (The cops wanted it without marks, the hookers did not care).

When I am faced with these situations, (and it seems it happens at least once a year), when I have done what I will do, I just walk away. There is absolutely no reason to stay and discusses the mess you left behind. In the case of multiple attackers, choose one and get him screaming, I have never had a situation, that the rest did not retreat out of my reach, rather than press the attack.

I try to attend a 2 day edge weapons class, or a Krav Maga refresher every year. (Boy does that remind me how old I am). But if you do not train, you are at a huge disadvantage, and if you cannot accept pain, your chances of walking away are cut 75%. I am a natural born competitor, so my reaction to anyone trying to make me submit is suck it up and win.

One of my favorite says used to be:

Sex and violence, you cannot enjoy one if you don't survive the other

Eghad
May 29, 2011, 02:24 PM
The term fighting dirty probably came from the losers.

Webleymkv
May 29, 2011, 02:37 PM
A "fair fight" is something of sports, fantasy, and the whinings of the losers. I do not fight for sport or fun, I will only fight if I'm given no other recourse. If someone is willing to put me into a situation that I have no other option but fighting my way out of, then that person had better be ready to face the most dire consequences of his actions. As George Patton once said, "May God have mercy on my enemies because I won't."

BlackFeather
May 29, 2011, 03:01 PM
I love how so many of you say you've never been in an actual fight. Many say you train hard in "gunfighting". Some of the older guys say they don't want to be caught in a fight they know they'll lose, so the gun comes into play. Only one mentioned Mace.

Ideal situations get ideal solutions. Yes, the gun may even your odds. Even, because they may have the jump on you with someone behind you. For all you know, they aren't even the "young punks" most of you mentioned. It could be a husband and wife in their 40's. Practicing against people who are afraid to wrench a gun from your hand, or no one at all won't help you much either.

It seems a lot of people forget that martial arts training was built on necessity, not sport with rules. For modern times it's not always the best choice, but it's all in how it's applied. Kicking the knee, groin strikes, stomping the toes, and hitting the throat were all taught by my instructors.

Me personally, I enjoy a good fight. However, if attacked, I will do what I practice to eliminate the threat. If a weapon is presented, or there are multiple opponents I may consider bringing my knife into play. I don't carry a gun 99% of the time. As far as I'm concerned, if they draw a gun on me from a distance I can't defend against, I'm dead no matter what.

zombie666
May 29, 2011, 04:12 PM
I will do anything, and I do mean anything to defend myself, my family, pets, and home. If that involves the bad guy being killed, maimed, mutilated, I don't care. I'll worry about the legal and ethical aspects later.

sigxder
May 30, 2011, 10:48 AM
"shoot him in the balls". LOL! Jelly Bryce a famous F.B.I. agent of the mobster era once gave a young man the following advice, "son if you shoot a man in the balls he won't bother you no more"! He knew from experience.

carprivershooter
May 30, 2011, 10:55 PM
I fight to win I fight to survive. I equate survival as winning.

wolfrage
May 30, 2011, 11:08 PM
No such thing as fighting dirty. Do what it takes to survive.

Sent from my Droid using Tapatalk and Red Bulls

HK Jake
May 30, 2011, 11:13 PM
If you show up prepared for a fair fight, you aren't prepared!

goose13
June 6, 2011, 12:25 AM
I was always taught that there is no such thing as a fair fight, you simply do what you have to to win. This is what I was taught and even though its been quite a few years since I have been in a fight this is what I believe in. I always try to do my best to avoid physical confrontation, however if a situation arises that I can not avoid I am prepared to do what it takes to win. Now obviously if the guy is unarmed I would never bring a firearm in to the situation.

MikeNice81
June 6, 2011, 02:25 AM
When I was little I said to my dad, "but you aren't supposed to kick a guy when he 's down."

Dad, "Why not? If he can't get back up he can't fight."

"But it isn't nice."

"Nice will get you killed or worse. If they want to fight, make sure they tell all of their friends it was a bad idea."

Ozhuntsman
June 6, 2011, 04:17 AM
A fight isn't over until you've won. You just need to remember the other guy might be thinking the same thing and he might have a long memory.

Mike Irwin
June 6, 2011, 05:54 AM
When you're fighting for your life, there's no such thing as fighting dirty.

There's only fighting to survive.

And to survive, I'm willing to do anything it takes to win.

BlueTrain
June 6, 2011, 06:22 AM
I can't think of a better place to say this but here. Sometimes you have to fight even when there seems little chance of winning. You used to hear it a lot in the movies, with lines like "they won't take me without a fight," or "I'm at least going to go down fighting." This isn't the same thing and in real life, which some people live, there are other things. Sometimes you have to fight simply for the sake of your honor. That generally amounts to street fighting, sort of, when you're younger and trying to make (or keep) your place in the world. In the situation I'm speaking of, it isn't a question of fighting, it is a question of behavior under what are less than nice circumstances. It usually isn't a matter of protecting someone else, either, it's all about "standing up for yourself." You may get beat up a few times, as I was, but your self-respect and the respect you get from others goes up a few notches. And it isn't about making someone afraid of you either, by no means. As the song says, "The bad guys know us and they leave us alone."

Nanuk
June 6, 2011, 02:30 PM
No such thing, I fight to win.

markj
June 6, 2011, 03:54 PM
The term fighting dirty probably came from the losers.

Way back when I was younger, guys didnt fight dirty, gentelmen fought fair. Why get a tv and watch ol John tell it right in McLintock before the guy gets a fight on with the uncle of a guy he whupped. No hair pulling, no kicking, no eye gouging etc. John doing every one to the uncle :) guy playing the kid was his real life son too.

If I was getting into it and someone did any of those it got real bad real quick cause my cousins taught me every foul bad gross thing to do to a person is tryiong to beat on ya. I was arrested age 12 for doing one to a guy was 17 and was taking my money and beating on me every day. My cousin said do this and he will never bother you again, it worked and is my secret, I wont tell. But if you really need to find out come over and we will get it going, after, you will never wish to fight anyone ever again. Expect a lot of pain too, it really really hurts.

Hawg Haggen
June 6, 2011, 04:01 PM
I haven't fought in a long time. I've recently in the last couple of years avoided a few by sheer bravado. If pushed into it I will use any means at my disposal to hurt you as badly as I can as fast as I can with the least amount of pain to myself. I will kick you in your balls or knees, punch you in the throat and if I get you down I will repeatedly kick you in the balls and head till I'm sure you're no longer a threat. I will use any object I can get my hands on to hurt you as badly as I can. I will throw sand or gravel in your eyes. If I find a 2x4 I will try to break it on your face. If I find a stick I will try to put your eyes out. FAIR? A fair is where you go to buy cotton candy and watch pretty girls.

BlueTrain
June 6, 2011, 04:07 PM
I never said you shouldn't fight to win. I said that sometimes you have to fight whether or not you have a chance of winning. Sometimes that makes all the difference.

Rachen
June 6, 2011, 04:10 PM
If I ever get into a fight, it will not be one that I started. Therefore, I will perveive it as an immediate danger and take immediate action.

One word will summarize what will be involved if I cannot get to my firearm: KHANJAR

Or two words: BOWIE KNIFE

These are constantly worn on my belt and easily accessible.

Jeep Driver
June 6, 2011, 04:27 PM
The only fair fight, is the one you win.

sigxder
June 12, 2011, 02:15 AM
When fighting for your life their is no dirty fighting. And yes you should get some type of empty handed fighting training. Often you nmay have to fight to get to your gun or prevent a gun grab. And if their is time yes you do adjust to the situation. If a drunk says something smart to you walk away. If you are truly "jumped" then you have no choice. The only way to beat a ruthless criminal is to become more ruthless.
Also if you're carrying gun you are under greater pressure to not fight unless you have to. If you could walk away and the fight goes on and escalates to the point you have to shoot someone you could be in trouble. Even if it got to the point where you were justified to shoot. If you could of walked away or somehow gotten out of the fight you may end up with charges against you.

Stevie-Ray
June 12, 2011, 01:58 PM
I'd like to think that there is one more good fight left in me but some mornings, I really question that. ...... Same here. I got into many bar scrapes and the like over the years, but nothing that took long enough to declare a winner, thank God. Last time I did anything like that was ten years ago at the age of 45, I broke up a fight on my lawn. Two adult kids, (18-20 or so) well dressed like they were at a party were pummeling hell out of each other, but one getting the best the other as he was on top of him. I yelled for them to break it up, they ignored me. I went down and grabbed the top one by the collar and yanked him off, sending him hard on his ass. He stared up at me stunned. I screamed "I said break it to **** up!" The underdog had taken this opportunity to make a break for it and took off like his pants were on fire. The other one followed a few seconds later looking over his shoulder occasionally. Of course I figured he was getting a good look to retaliate later. Needless to say, I didn't get much sleep that night and spent most of it on the porch. Nothing ever happened. I was actually surprised how easy it was to throw the kid around, though I was easily at the strongest of my life then. My boxing and grappling days were over at that point, but I had been weightlifting pretty much non-stop for over 10 years. This occasion, and the obvious health benefits, have caused me to continue with the workouts to this day. But it's definitely getting tougher.

bikerbill
June 12, 2011, 02:23 PM
my last fight was in 1966 when a bunch of townies jumped me and several of my zoomie friends in Monterey while we were stationed at the Defense Language Institute ... still got a scar on my thumb where I knocked one of the punk's front teeth out ... those days of course are long gone and I agree with others here; if I'm attacked, at 66 I'm in fear of my life and I will do whatever it takes to keep ticking ... if you are worried about dirty tactics in a street fight, you're already dead ...

irish52084
June 12, 2011, 02:24 PM
Stevie-Ray, you bring up a great point about physical fitness. You don't have to be out of shape solely due to aging. It may get tougher to do and you may not make big gains, but you can be strong and fit at any age. That extra edge of fitness makes a difference in everything you do. You don't have to be a bodybuilder or string man competitor to be functionally strong and healthy.

Another big part for me is training, both firearms training and hand to hand defense. I like to think my situational awareness is darn good, but things happen and mistakes get made. I know from training that I can come out on top of 99%+ of 1 vs 1 struggles. I also know from training that 2 or more determined attackers are pretty much going to ruin my day and a gun or knife might be my only choice at that point. Then it's a matter of making sure I can get to my gun or knife with someone trying to beat on me or prevent me from getting my weapon.

If you need to gouge eyes, bite or whatever else to save yourself, you need the mentality to just do it and not have to think about it.

MLeake
June 12, 2011, 02:43 PM
One of the things I find the hardest, with new students at a dojo, is to get them to actually try to hit me.

Most aikido training is done as paired drills. The attacker launches the specified attack, and the defender uses the specified counter. (Note: at higher levels, this becomes less structured - attacker has a choice of attacks, or defender has a choice of counters, or there are multiple attackers, etc - but at basic levels, it's kept simple.)

Problem is, most new people are afraid to throw a real punch. If they miss on purpose, the defender doesn't get to learn how to actually do the counter.

It's not easy to convince them to punch at and through my solar plexus or my face, or to get them to strike at my throat or collar-bone. Most people, even the ones who decide to train, are afraid they'll hurt the other person. It takes work to get them to strike like they mean it.

Probably a good thing they get over that BEFORE something happens outside the dojo.

Old Wanderer
June 12, 2011, 04:46 PM
MLeake:

You are exactly right. Many years ago when I was instructing, no only did people have a great reluctance to striking, most had never been hit with any force.

One of my students was a very attractive hooker. She had been studying for almost a year at the dojo. One day while training she unloaded 6 very heavy kicks to my mid section. I returned 1 kick about about 50% the force she was using. She collapsed to the ground and started crying and trying to catch her breath. Other than not being prepared to receive a blow, and having some air knocked out of her, there was nothing physically wrong with her. Yet her psychic lost the "fight". She quit training that day, saying I was a monster, a ghoul, and had no respect for women.

You must be willing to accept pain, and know it is only the bodies warning system to keep you from injury. you can choose to respond or ignore it.

The hardest hitting/kicking person I ever encountered was my Sensi. A 135# Chinese man who it seemed like he could just look at you, and it hurt.

MLeake
June 12, 2011, 04:54 PM
Old Wanderer, that is definitely the other side of the coin. Somehow, there are people who have managed to go through life without ever getting hit, let alone getting cut or breaking a bone.

I've been knocked out twice, if only momentarily. Walked into a straight right, right between the eyebrows, and found myself on my back for a few seconds. The other involved a wrestling match, the other guy's stellar Navy takedown, and my own knee hitting me in the eye socket...

Otherwise, I have taken a lot of hits that hurt, or took out my wind, but none that I couldn't fight through. (This is not to say I won all the time, just that I kept trying.)

Before I had ever taken a real punch, I was afraid to get hit. Now, I don't worry about it so much, but in all honesty I tend to relax more AFTER I've been hit a time or two - it reminds me that most can be shrugged off.

irish52084
June 12, 2011, 05:52 PM
MLeake, Your story of being knocked out reminded me of the only time I've been knocked out. I was a teenager and attempting to dunk a basketball 2 handed when my momentum carried my body out from underneath me and I landed on the concrete. Bounced my head off the ground and woke up a few seconds later.

I never seem to get hurt with a manly story behind it. I tore my MCL basically sitting on the couch. Dislocated my shoulder and tore my labrum doing bench press warm-ups. Tore my MCL again by using butterfly guard in Brazilian jiu-jitsu. Sprained my ankle pretty bad bowling and somehow managed to get a strike out of it., I'm a terrible bowler if that wasn't an indication already.

I've been really lucky with broken bones too, never had a break.

As far as getting hit and how it affects people, it's all mental to me. Once I'm in that mode of conflict or training it doesn't seem to hurt as bad as it does when I don't expect it. I've managed to get kicked square in the head twice when I wasn't expecting it and both times it hurt like that warm fiery place. Been kneed or kick in the head many times while sparring and it doesn't seem nearly as bad.:D

bullethole1
June 13, 2011, 01:17 PM
The way I see it,you gotta do what you gotta do,also for me it depends on how angry i am and how scared i am of my life or my loved ones life or lives the would or are being threatened

Tengu01
June 22, 2011, 03:05 PM
Love this thread . The saying " if you find yourself in a fair fight , you havn't trained properly " has been pounded ( literaly , at times ) into me while studying Budo Taijutsu . Criminals don't " fight by the rules " , why should we , as respectable citizens ? Do whatever it takes to get home . ALIVE !

Mr. James
July 26, 2011, 09:26 PM
You are exactly right. Many years ago when I was instructing, no only did people have a great reluctance to striking, most had never been hit with any force.

I have a good friend who insists that what's most ailing our society is that not enough people have been on the receiving end of an incoming fist. Playing rugby for twenty some years, that was never my problem; I've been knocked out so many times it's a wonder I can type these words.

As to the original thread, as just about everyone else here has said, I'm using whatever tactics and tools are at my disposal to take out my attacker as quickly as possible.

And now I have to go out and get a sjambok! :D

claymore1500
July 26, 2011, 10:19 PM
Simple words will never bring me to fight, but if I am attacked, my attacker would do well to know two things. One: I do not fear pain, Two: I do not fear death.

He would also do well to keep his head covered, because if I get to it, I'm breaking it off.

I'm 56 years old, 6'4" 240 lbs. I work on heavy trucks 6 days a week and have been known to dead lift over 500 lbs. I can and will hold my own.

bsheets20061
July 26, 2011, 10:29 PM
if its a matter of life and death there is no fighting dirty or fair fight, my life matters more than the person trying to kill me. Ill do whatever it takes to survive.

jborushko
July 27, 2011, 05:00 AM
if its a true fight for my life. then its No holds barred. pure and simple i'll use every possible thing at my disposal to gain advantage and keep it. cause the most pain/damage the fastest way.

but lesser degrees of fight warent lesser responces. a bar fight with a drunken fool= take advantage with reasonable levels of pain inflicted

just like anything its all based on degrees of responce.


I'm 56 years old, 6'4" 240 lbs. I work on heavy trucks 6 days a week and have been known to dead lift over 500 lbs. I can and will hold my own.

thats what as know as "old man strenght".... you dont mess around with old man strenght

BlueTrain
July 27, 2011, 05:33 AM
Not about fighting dirty or not but just about fighting: it is said that a boxer might be the most difficult person to fight hand to hand because a boxer is accustomed to pain and to being hit. That sounds reasonable and believable and I suppose the point is that a lot of people have a low tolerance for pain or more likely, a fear of getting hurt. But I can understand that.

When I was still in grade school and junior high, fighting in the neighborhood where I lived was not an uncommon thing and it didn't attract police attention the way it might today. This is not to say it was a friendly fight, what ever that might be, or anything like that. But a fight nonetheless. You might end up in the hospital like I did once and you may never be able to lick the big guys but you develop a different attitude and a different sense of self as a result of those experiences. I know it sounds a lot like something out of a Norman Rockwell setting with a "you shoulda seen the other guy" kind of results but I almost feel like kids are missing a part of growing up by not having such experiences. I'm not saying any particular outcome is inevitable because sometimes real tragedies can result--and none of this has anything to do with guns. Girls, of course, were totally absent from all of this and would have no idea what I'm talking about and probably a lot of the guys here, too.

I have no idea what the guys were like on the other side of town either.

40caljustice
July 27, 2011, 05:50 AM
I grew up getting whipped until I was 11 years old. Finally my dad decided to enroll me in a boxing gym. I got around to whipping some of the bully's that whipped me. And I put a better whippin down then they did. When I was younger (teens and early 20's. I'm only 26) I liked getting hit and beat on a little bit. I could take a beating like I could give one. I still attempt to box today but its more to sweat than to learn and strategise.

Alot of folks can't fight for 3 mins. Heck even 1:30 mins. That's alot of time to go full blast. So expect that that person on the other end is fighting dirty also.

I will not fight unless I am or my family is physically assaulted. I have lost my head in the past and could have very well gotten in some trouble but not anymore. I have too much to lose now.

However, if someone is attacking me then I'll do everything in my power to make him regret making such a foolish decision. I will give my all to protect myself and family.

Another thing. I joke and tease with my father and his friends all the time. I jab at them and poke them. Call them old and make comments about gerital and viagra. These fellas know I'm kidding but one day a guy told me this piece of advice. "You better watch how you bully an old man. We have already lived. Most of us are on the way out anyway. We can't scrap. We have to make it as quick as possible so we can save energy to get away." "Life in prison for me is liable to be only a couple months or years." I believe every word this fella told me.

Fighting Dirty = Fighting. I've never heard of clean fighting.

40caljustice
July 27, 2011, 06:05 AM
Perfectly said BlueTrain. Sometimes I would fight the same guy twice in one day. Or a few times a week. It was something every kid our age went through. We played king of the hill and smear the (guy with the ball). We would rattle each others heads on a daily basis. Alot of us thought it was cool, me included, to win a fight. Now we know its all stupid unless its paying your bills.

If I had of taken the energy I put into smashing knuckles and put it into school, I would be an aerospace engineer working for NASA. I wouldn't wear this blue collar everyday.

Micahweeks
July 27, 2011, 06:14 AM
If you aren't fighting dirty, you either have no good reason to be fighting or your tactics suck.

BlueTrain
July 27, 2011, 08:40 AM
Clean and dirty in fighting is pretty much like clean and dirty in language. It's what someone else says it is. Nothing more, nothing less.

What I was trying to say, among other things, about fighting when you're still a schoolboy, is that you have to stand up for yourself and sometimes for others whether or not you have much of a chance of overcoming the other guy. It's apparently a difficult concept to understand for some people and there is a cultural slant to it, at least for adults. Supposedly American Indians might not fight one day because, as my father might have said (in speaking of something altogether different), the signs weren't right. And supposedly other Indians understood and did not think less of them for it. But for some "primative" people, there came a point when they had to go out and prove themselves by doing something like killing a lion with a spear.

I wonder if people like that got into fights among themselves like we do?

TylerD45ACP
July 27, 2011, 01:06 PM
I havent been in a fight in a while. However my fighting mindset was much like my SD one is now. I want the threat to go away as fast as possible and that involves hitting them as hard and fast in the 'button' (Open Jaw or Nose) FIRST. If you want to get the edge just like in SD you got to hit 1st. You want an immediate incapacitation knockout like SD, unfortunatley, unless its a lined up shot its hard to do. So when people run there mouth and threaten you up close in your face, DROP THEM.

Mr Dish
July 27, 2011, 02:35 PM
Isn't the goal of a fight to win? If its a matter of life and death who cares how you win?

Ringolevio
July 27, 2011, 02:50 PM
Mr. James:
I have a good friend who insists that what's most ailing our society is that not enough people have been on the receiving end of an incoming fist.

Man, I couldn't agree more! Consider what passes for "leadership" today: I'm thinking of one guy in particular, who loves to talk about "kicking a**" and "knowing whose a** to kick", but take one look at the guy and you can tell that
a) He's never kicked anybody's a**, and
b) He's probably never even had his own a** kicked!

Deaf Smith
July 27, 2011, 06:22 PM
How hard and dirty are you willing to fight in a street fight?

Now if we are talking fighting for my life, well as dirty as I can!

Kicks to the knees, groin kicks, eye gouges, elbows, thumbs in eyes, palm slapping the ears, throat punches, biting, stomping on feet, knees in groin, any useful object as a weapon, sand/dirt thrown in face, and much much more!

If we are talking about actually accepting an offer to fight, HECK NO!

I've seen plenty of people who got into fights after arguments in a bar and they 'took it outside', and then someone gets knifed. The other one gets manslaughter charge!

No. I fight only if forced to, and then I fight wicked.

Deaf

TylerD45ACP
July 27, 2011, 06:28 PM
Nice Post, Ringolevio people need fights. It gives them valuable experience on winning and defeat. Every person needs to win a hard fight and get their A$$ kicked in their life, both have happened to me. I believe it has helped my general outlook on life. I think I might know who that 1 GUY is and Id like to teach him :D.

JerryM
July 27, 2011, 07:02 PM
This is an incredibly strange thread. In a life or death situation what is dirty, and who is concerned about it???
Jerry

TylerD45ACP
July 27, 2011, 07:11 PM
It is a strange thread, you fight to survive. No such thing as dirty in life or death.

pvt.Long
July 27, 2011, 07:37 PM
I always carry one of my Kabars just in case, Better to have it and not need it then need it and not have it. I was trained by TDCJ and I wont resist using any technique, and or hitting any pressure point if I need to.

TylerD45ACP
July 27, 2011, 07:46 PM
I carry a Buck Quickfire 2 3/4" blade on me at all times, especially when I dont have my piece. It's a handy knife for cutting things and would work if I needed it for something serious, springs out in a flash.

Gregmat
July 27, 2011, 07:50 PM
The only people who think some tactics are dirty are those who on the losing end!

TylerD45ACP
July 27, 2011, 08:03 PM
Yep

kaylorinhi
July 27, 2011, 08:36 PM
History is written by the winner.

irish52084
July 28, 2011, 09:50 AM
It's seems like a strange thread, because it is. I started it because I have heard some talk about how you should conduct yourself during a fight and I found it rather absurd that people would limit themselves under serious threat of injury or death.

I find it ludicrous to not fight dirty and I have since I was young. I got some good early lessons in fighting and how to approach it, hit first, hit hard and make sure they stay down. I also learned what it's like to lose and win, got that lesson weekly for a few years while training with grown men at the age of 11-14. It's tough to win against men when you're a boy, but it taught me some valuable lessons.

BlueTrain
July 28, 2011, 10:36 AM
History may be written by the winner but different histories are written by the different elements in the story. Right after the way, the generals write their stories. The privates write their stories another 30 or 40 years later. But Churchill said, "History will be kind to me, because I intend to write it."

TylerD45ACP
July 29, 2011, 10:59 PM
@Irish52084 I completley agree and believe every person should have one good whoopin in their life time. I have had more than one and it did teach me valuable lessons. I have grown up alot since those days but have learned a lot from them too. Now I can put my knowledge to good intellegent use for SD.

egor20
July 29, 2011, 11:16 PM
IMHO a "fair" is a place to look at horses, sheep and goats, eat cotton candy and ride the ferris wheel. A fight is a bit different. I prefer fairs myself.


Had my Nieces kid over the other day, he likes horses, sheep, not so much goats.

dang near put me down, he's taking Kung /Tia/ chung something other.

I'm an old and sneaky Bosun, I won, the kids got 3" and 40lbs on me.

I'll teach him the Not-So-Fair stuff later. :)

ojibweindian
July 31, 2011, 11:05 AM
I don't know how many of us have thought about this, so I thought I'd bring it up.

How hard and dirty are you willing to fight in a street fight? ...

I don't fight. I haven't been in a fight for decades. I just want to be left alone.

SilentHitz
July 31, 2011, 12:14 PM
I'm 57 years old, and have been in a wheelchair since I was 28...I don't mess with anyone and expect the same. My fist fighting ended years ago, so if anyone is stupid enough to grab or hit me they get shot...period.

If they have arms and legs that work, they are armed as far as I'm concerned. A jury can do whatever the hell they want to do with me...I'm too old to give a crap. I never fought "fair" anyways, Dad told me to never start a fight and if some one else did, do whatever it takes to get him off ur ass. If he's bigger get a damn baseball bat, brick bat, or anything else you can get your hands on. I did and not many people made the same mistake their buddies did.

Gossettc68
July 31, 2011, 03:15 PM
Like most other posters have stated " No rules "

I try to avoid confrontation at all costs, I don't want to get hurt and I hate seeing other people hurt...That being said if I am forced into a physical altercation I will probably be sued and have to buy the guy a new set of eyes, ears balls and whatever else I rip off.

But I will try to avoid fighting at all costs.

Mike Wazowski
August 4, 2011, 06:49 PM
Like most of the replies up to this point, at 55 years old - "I ain't as good as I once was".

I have been fortunate enough to stay away from trouble, but should some one persist to the point of endangering me and mine, I will oblige with everything at my disposal, to my end, or theirs.

EMB135Driver
August 7, 2011, 08:26 PM
If you're forced to fight, fight to win. Do more damage to your opponent in a shorter time than he does to you, using any means necessary.

Detachment Charlie
August 12, 2011, 10:52 PM
I am officially disabled (S.S).
Years ago, I'd fight you just for the satisfaction of beating your bleeding ass into the ground.
Today, I adhere to Robert Heinlen's Advice:
"Don't fight an old man. He's too old to fight; he'll just kill you."
Seriously.
You know you're in trouble when he pulls out his 1911, and in real deep **** when he pulls a 6" blade to carve your ass up and smiles at you.:eek: