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Six_Rounds
March 26, 2011, 09:40 AM
I just got this little revolver in a trade. I know already that it is an Iver Johnson Safety Automatic Hammerless in .38S&W. From what I've read online, I'm thinking its a late 2nd model, from between 1896 and 1908, not suitable for smokeless loads.

http://i54.tinypic.com/mcq5tw.jpg
http://i56.tinypic.com/1q1p44.jpg

This is the barrel top rib with the patent date info.
http://i56.tinypic.com/rlmgw8.jpg

The patent dates are April 6, 1886, February 15, 1887, May 10, 1887 and August 25, 1896.

Serial number under the left side of the grip frame is D-41703, and the only other place its repeated is the underside of the top-strap. There are no other markings on the gun.

Does anyone have an idea of a more precise date of manufacture? What is a good value to put on the gun if it has about 75-80% of the original bluing?

Gbro
March 26, 2011, 10:35 AM
When you posted this I had my Cartridges of the World books open to one page away from this cartridge.
This is reloaded with smokless powders and the Factory Load Data (FL) do not list a black powder load for this cartridge
Here are some loads,
145 gr. bullet, 2.2 grs Bull's Eye = Muz Vel 730 FPS Muz Energy 173 Ft.Lbs
150 " " 4.7 " Unique 890 268
200 " " 3.1 " 620 172
200 " " FL 630 176

gyvel
March 26, 2011, 04:27 PM
According to what I could find in Goforth's book on IJ revolvers, you have an "1896 Second Model, '1897 Second Variation With Separate Shroud.' "

The "1896 Second Model, '1898 Third Variation' " had another patent date added (Mar. 13, 88) which is absent on your example.

However, there is a conflict in the book where Goforth states that the 1898 Third Variation serial number range is D33001 to D66500. Per his information, though, your gun is supposed to be a Second Variation (according to the barrel markings) whose serial range is D00001 to D33000.

So your gun was made in either 1897 or 1898, but only it knows for sure. ;)

Your gun is definitely not suitable for smokeless powder; It also qualifies as an antique (pre-1899) and is not considered an FFL firearm under Federal law.

Gbro
March 26, 2011, 09:36 PM
This is the internet so take everything you learn here under advisement.

In my Old blue book the value is $125.00 tops.

This web site will give you some good information to work with. (http://www.american-firearms.com/american-firearms/z-html/company-I/Iver%20Johnson%27s%20Arms%20&%20Cycle%20Works/Iver%20Johnson%27s%20Arms%20&%20Cycle%20Works.html)
Just scroll down to your Revolver.
Very interesting to read on that Iver site that a 1909 revolver was still a Black powder cartridge gun. :confused:
Another link of interest; (http://www.chuckhawks.com/38sw.htm)