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SAA GunSlinger
February 20, 2011, 06:39 PM
Hello, im new to the cowboy action shooting scene. Ive always adored schofield revolvers and had finally saved up to buy a pair from Uberti. I was very excited to get them but i was shocked to see that with in 12 bullets one of them broke! When you would break the top of the gun open to reload the star ejector would get jammed in the open postion and not close, preventing you from closing or loading the gun. I took it inside, took it apart, cleaned it and then put it back togther. I then went back outside and fired it agian and it did the same thing. The star ejector jammed in the open postion and i was unable to close the revolver. Im extremely upset with this, i payed $1,766 dollars for brand new uberti schofields only to have one of them break with in 12 bullets. I have bought guns from uberti before and they were great but i didnt expect this kind of poor craftmanship from their company. I sent the firearm to the company for repairs and the gunsmith i sent the gun back through said it would take a good long time to get the gun back. When paying almost $1,800 dollars on their schofields i shouldnt have to do this. Has this problem happen to anyone else with their schofields??? Thank you for your time.

napp
February 20, 2011, 07:06 PM
No, I haven't had such an experience as yours. All I can do is agree with how you must be feeling. If I had a new gun break that quickly, I wouldn't want it repaired...I would want it replaced with another gun. If it was part of a matched set, I would want both guns replaced with a new matched set. I don't know anything about Uberti customer service. Maybe some of the old hands here can chime in on that.

Have you lived a good clean life? It just doesn't seem fair that someone would have to be assigned to Fort Riley and have something like this happen to them at the same time. :D

Thanks for your service. Keep on cocking those cannons.

pmeisel
February 20, 2011, 07:49 PM
Please let us know how this is addressed by your vendor...

hickstick_10
February 20, 2011, 08:19 PM
were these loads BP?

SAA GunSlinger
February 20, 2011, 09:03 PM
They were cowboy action rounds. They worked fine with one of them but not with the other schofield.

Foto Joe
February 20, 2011, 11:14 PM
I feel your pain.

I'm on my second Uberti Schofield, the first was a Russian that was bad out of the box and wouldn't even rotate when loaded, too little clearance between the cylinder and the recoil shield.

The one that Uberti replaced it with was a Model 3 and in 44-40 and has an indexing problem due to the locating pin on the star ejector being too far out. Once that was fixed, I found that the ratchet had been prematurely worn because of it. Uberti now has it to replace the ratchet/ejector.

If it's of any comfort, Uberti customer service is top notch. The should only have the gun for a couple of weeks but...you need to have the shop follow up on it with phone calls. Uberti isn't too hot when it comes to keeping you informed.

I'm not overly impressed by the workmanship on the new Uberiti's. I've got a 30 year old ASM that still has the original nipples on it that I have more faith in.

Just for reference, if you've ever got to do this again, deal directly with Uberti and skip the gun shop. Let us know how this pans out.

SAA GunSlinger
February 21, 2011, 02:15 AM
Im sorry to hear that your schofields have also been troublesome as well. Thanks for the advice and i will keep ya updated on what happens.

arcticap
February 21, 2011, 09:03 PM
I know of a fellow who bought one and after several attempts by Uberti to fix it were unsuccessful, he asked them if they would let him trade it towards other guns of comparable value. They said yes so he chose several BP revolvers which he sold off to recoup his losses.

sewerman
February 22, 2011, 08:53 AM
my friend had one years ago and he had problems with a tiny flat spring that kept breaking when he opened it and then released the trigger.

after a couple of breaks and repairs he sold it, fixed of course.

other than that problem it was like a women.... ya love it, but can't live with it!

and as usual he wishes he had it back now!:):rolleyes:

S.M.

Foto Joe
February 22, 2011, 11:08 AM
I just got off the phone with Uberti regarding my Schofield which I sent in to them directly last week. Turns out, they say this one is also unrepairable. I've got a sneaking suspicion that they DO NOT ever repair guns, they just replace them. They will be sending me another Model 3 in 44-40 with a 5" barrel. Hopefully this one will work the way it was intended. 3rd time's a charm right?

I will say that Uberti customer service is VERY good, even if their guns come up a bit short. If I was you, I would contact the gunshop that sent yours in and lean on them to call Uberti and check the status of your gun. Chances are they will be receiving a replacement but I know from experience that once you call Uberti, things tend to happen faster. Squeaky wheel and all that don't ya know.

Good luck and keep us up to date on the progress. When my next "New" one gets here I'll let ya know if I finally get a Schofield that will work.

Tanker6
February 22, 2011, 04:34 PM
...the "replacement" they're sending FotoJoe is SAA Gunslinger's returned piece.....meanwhile, they're working on Joe's piece so they can ship something back to SAA Gunslinger.....:eek:


For goodness sakes, I HOPE it ain't that bad.....:rolleyes:

Foto Joe
February 22, 2011, 10:15 PM
Tanker6,

I certainly hope you're wrong!!! In reality, the "New" replacement gun I got the last time was indeed "New". At this point in time though, nothing would surprise me.

I called them back this afternoon thinking maybe I could work Uberti a little bit since I've had such a bad consumer experience. I was thinkin' I'd try to talk them out of a nickle/pearl model. They were good for it, except they only make them in 45 Colt and 38 Special and I'm standing for a 44-40. 45 Colt, come on, it wasn't even an original caliber!! But they sure are purdy!!

SAA GunSlinger
March 4, 2011, 02:10 AM
Ive been doing like you all said Im calling them everyday and asking them the status. Mostly because im angered for the pistol being broken out of box and i want my pistol back asap. Ive wanted these pistols for 6 years and i finally got them and i have to constantly remind them of my sorrow of one them being broken when i got it. I have a shooting match coming up in april and i told them i would like it back by mid march so i could get ready for the match. You guys are right the customer service is great and they do make sure you are satisfied before the call ends. I wish they put as much effort into their firearms as they do their customer service. Im praying like hell that my schofield doesnt come back with the same problem that i had when i sent it in. I will be all sorts of angery if i have to send it back in and wait for another 4 weeks. I know im doing alot of whining but ive been wanting these schofields for a long time and you go with a company that ya trust and then are utterly dissapointed, its rather upsetting. It also turns my gut to hear yall having problems with your schofields as well. Ya think paying 1,000 dollars for a handgun you would get high quality craftsmanship. Not 1,000 dollars paperweight. I wish the best of luck with everyone else and their schofields as well because this is some utter bull crap. I will keep yall updated on what happens and how it is handeled through uberti. Thanks for everything :D

radom
March 4, 2011, 06:15 AM
Is that a gun issue or operator issue having the spent brass stick under the star?

gyvel
March 4, 2011, 07:47 AM
I, too, purchased a couple of Uberti top breaks. One was a pre-Beretta Schofield in .38 Special and the other is a post-Beretta S&W Model 3 in .45 Colt. While I haven't had anything "break" yet, I can see that the metal used is very soft and these guns aren't going to take a lot of hard use before they wear out. They are pretty to look at and fun to occasionally play with, but, in retrospect, I wish I had used the money for something else.

Oh yeah, I almost forgot: The hammer block safety on the Schofield .38 hasn't worked properly since day one.

Foto Joe
March 4, 2011, 11:12 AM
Well, I got my 3rd "New" Schofield back a few days ago. Once again, they sent me a "New In Box" replacement. It would be nice if there was a decent resale price for empty Schofield boxes, I might be able to recoup some of my shipping costs for the replacement guns.

This last new one seems to be much better assembled. No drag mark on the cylinder the first time you cock it, star ejector locator pin not protruding and it indexes properly both loaded and empty. I took it out to my favorite box canyon the day before yesterday for a little walk. I had 30 rounds of 44-40 in smokeless and 7 rounds in Black Powder.

I fired the smokeless first and there were no problems, then put the Black Powder rounds through it also with no problems. I'm thinking that I will probably stuff a couple of hundred smokeless rounds through it though before I start shooting too many properly loaded (Black Powder) 44-40's. It's a little stiff as I would expect a new gun to be.

People may fawn over Uberti Black Powder guns but I'm not impressed. I've got Uberti, Pietta, ASM and Dakota. Uberti is nowhere near the top of the quality list in my opinion. But they are proud of their stuff!!

Jim Watson
March 4, 2011, 11:24 AM
A friend and I bought ASM Schofields based on a gunzine report saying they were better than Ubertis. They weren't. One would not work out of the box in the store. It was returned and replaced. The first gun and the replacement would function and fire, but hit far off the POA on target.

Ammo, sandbags, different shooters had no effect. The local gunsmith put a range rod down the barrels and it would not even go all the way to the other end. Literally crooked barrels. So back they went. After six months and no results, we inquired with the importer. They agreed to refund the wholesale price of the guns. We had special ordered them so all we were out was the $25 each charged for registration by the FFL.

I put my refund into a SAA repro which does fine.
My friend upgraded to a Colt.

SAA GunSlinger
March 4, 2011, 04:24 PM
"Is that a gun issue or operator issue having the spent brass stick under the star? "

No it was not operator error, once the gun had opened their was no way of closing it short of taking the whole gun apart and cleaning it, the star ejector would tighten up as stiff as a drum and would not retract back into the cylinder no matter what you did.
I HAVE SOME GOOD NEWS THOUGH! I called the company today and they told me that they are going to replace my broken one with a brand new firearm. I was very pleased to hear this! They told me that the problem with the revolver was that their was a gap problem with the cylinder. I should have my brand new schofield in 2 weeks! I must say im very pleased with the customer service. When i get the new schofield back and if it works perfectly. They will still have my buisness.

Foto Joe
March 4, 2011, 04:54 PM
I wouldn't think it's going to take two weeks. They'll probably have the paperwork done by Tuesday morning and it will leave that afternoon or the next morning. In my experience when they say they are going to replace the gun, I've got it in my hands in less than 7 days.

Good Luck

SAA GunSlinger
March 5, 2011, 02:01 AM
I certainly hope that your right, if i could get it that soon that would be fantastic. Funny how you mention paper work because when i asked the company how long it would take to get here they said they were already working on the paper work to get it ready to go! Thanks for all the help everybody! I greatly appreciate it!...ill keep ya updated on how the new revolver works when i get it!

SAA GunSlinger
March 11, 2011, 07:11 PM
Well i got the schofield back a couple days ago, i was very pleased with the customer service. This schofield is different from my other one, this one will not let the firing pin rest all the way forward. It seems to be a new safety on this new one that i got back. My other schofield will let the firing pin rest all the way in. It looks like a new saftey feature to prevent the firing pin from resting on a loaded chamber. I think is a rather nice feature instead of leaving a chamber unloaded to rest your hammer on, this new safety lets you load all 6 chambers with out the worry of the firing pin resting on a primer. Anywho, i went out to shoot it and it shot rather well, i put half a box of ammo through it. The accuracey was great and everything worked well beside one thing. After i got done shooting and ejected my empty shells i noticed one of the shells were not shot. I shrugged my shoulders and thought it to be a dud and picked it up but the firing pin didnt even strike it. I didnt really think anything of it, After a few more cylinders of firing it happened once agian. I was concerned with it happening agian so i quickly loaded it up once agian and began firing. All 6 rounds fired just fine. Im rather puzzeled. I put almost 30rnds through it and it seem to jump a chamber 2 times while doing it but as soon as i noticed the problem, it began to shoot just fine. I think it might of been operator error because of it was mechanical it would of kept repeating itself and also i think i may have not been cocking it properly. Other then that, i have no complaints. It works rather well, ill be going out tommorow to shoot to see if the problem occurs agian. I certainly hope you guys can also keep me up to date on how your schofields are working as well and i do greatly appreciate all the help that has been given. Thanks a bunch and keep your powder dry :D

Foto Joe
March 12, 2011, 09:23 AM
It sounds like you may not be done yet. Having had three Uberti Schofields in the last four months has made somewhat of a cynic.

My last one did what you are describing with the firing pin. The hammer would not fall all the way to firing position unless the trigger was pulled from full cock and it was allowed to fall under spring pressure. Releasing the hammer from half cock by drawing it back and pulling the trigger while easing the hammer down would cause it to rest at a quarter cock position. Same went for full cock, if you eased it down to resting position it would stop at quarter cock. This is not normal.

The safe position for the gun is with the firing pin rested "between" the cartridge heads all the way down. My first one (Russian) and my last one (No. 3 - 2nd Model) both rest the hammer all the way down. The Russian was replaced because there was not enough room between the cylinder and the recoil shield to allow it to index the cylinder when it was loaded.

Look closely at the firing pin. You are looking for galling or rub marks against the frame. It's possible that the firing pin is hitting the firing pin orifice off center and not going through it or loosing so much energy when it strikes off center that it won't detonate a primer. I have noted on my last one that it has a rub mark from hitting the side of that orifice just slightly off center. Mine does not miss fire and the hammer will rest all the way down. I will probably dress the firing pin with a jewelers file and smooth it out when I get back home.

Also, check to make sure that the locating pin on the star ejector is flush with the ejector. It should not be protruding up between the ratchets. If it is, use a drift/punch to drive it down flush or eventually the hardness of the hand hitting just the top of the ratchet will round off the ratchet and it will fail to index on that cylinder properly. This has nothing to do with the hammer falling, it's just one of those quality control issues that Uberti has.

Operator error is probably in your head (no offense intended). If you pull that hammer back to full cock and then pull the trigger, a properly functioning gun will go bang. I just don't think that there is a way to get it to full cock "sort of". From full cock you should also be able to ease the hammer to rest with the firing pin through that orifice.

SAA GunSlinger
March 13, 2011, 01:58 PM
Hmmm thats rather intresting. I compared my schofields last night and their firing pins and one of them did have rub marks and wasent exactly centered. Earlier that day i went out agian and took the new one out to shoot to see if the misfires would continue. My first cylinder through it misfired, i examined it and i noticed that the safety block (that new safety feature i was talking about before) activated and stopped my firing pin from striking the round. I placed the unfired round back into the gun and began to fire once agian misfire but this this time it actaully struck the primer but no bang. The 3rd time was a charm, after that i put a box 50 rnds through the schofield with out a problem and it shot great. What would you suggest i do? Should i send it back to the company?, Ignore it?, or is their anything personally i can do to fix it? Im honestly content with the gun, i fear if i send it back that i will get something back thats alot worse but any suggestions would be greatly appreciated. FotoJoe? How have your schofields been worken for ya lately? and thanks for all your help these pass weeks. :D (darn i was hoping it was operator error, thats alot easier and cheaper to fix lol) :D

SAA GunSlinger
March 13, 2011, 11:22 PM
FotoJoe you were right....I took the new schofields trigger and firing mechanism apart and noticed that the safety block was malfunctioning. I compared it to my other schofield that works great and i immediately noticed the internal problem. With the safety block malfunctioning the gun misfires constantly. I am through with uberti!!!!:mad: I cant believe they would send me another broken gun! Im taking it to a gunsmith and having them fix it...i do not dare send it back to uberti because ill probably get another gun returned to me with more problems then the last. For the price we pay for these guns i am disgusted with them. Hopefully this safetl block mechanism problem will be fixed with ease but until then its back to the drawing board:(:mad::(

Foto Joe
March 14, 2011, 10:36 AM
If the GS can fix the gun, go for it. Keep in mind though that if he can't, you might own it. I don't know how good of an inspection Uberti does when they receive one back, but if they find that someone tinkered with it, the warranty is void.

Now here's an interesting question, you say you dis-assembled the trigger mechanism. How scary is it in there? I took my second one to the gunshop and asked them to break the screws loose so I could take it apart for cleaning. I didn't want to risk dinging up the screws as some giant with an impact put the things in there at the factory.

The guy at the gunshop told me that he wouldn't loosen the screws and that I didn't want to take it apart, period. I was told that it was much to complicated for me (a mere mortal). I have no fear of pulling a Colt's pattern gun down to the frame other than having a screw roll off into nowhere, they're simple. It would be my assumption that Schofield's being made in the same time period were also manufactured so that they could easily be dis-assembled by the user for cleaning.

It appears that the cover on the side of the frame is machined with extremely tight clearances, does this thing pop off when you pull the screws. I was also told that the trigger mechanism is held in by a "through-pin" that is pressed in. If you could shoot a video of taking one apart, I promise you it would be the only one on YouTube and I'm betting I'm not the only one out there that is interested.

As far as how mine is running, I haven't fired it again yet. I just got 100 44-40 Starline brass in from MidwayUSA on Saturday and my press is set up on the picnic table outside the 5th Wheel as of yesterday. The brass I was using was mixed head stamp and a pain to load because of a few thousands difference in length, but they were shorter than my case gauge so they wouldn't trim. I've got a couple hundred 9mm to load before I change the powder dispenser over for 44-40's.

maillemaker
March 14, 2011, 10:58 AM
Hi folks. Sorry to hear about your gun problems. Here is what I have started doing to deal with customer service issues:

In today's corporate environment, you are wasting your time working your way from the bottom up. If you work from the bottom up, you will be starting out with the lowest-paid, lowest-motivated employees at the company. These people are nothing but functionaries - all they can do is follow a script, and they never have any authority to actually help a customer except with the most trivial of problems.

You will end up simply working your way up the chain of command, having to tell your same story to a new person each time you are transferred. And even then, you will likely come across the brick wall of "sorry, we can't help you".

Instead, for all customer service issues of serious nature, I now work from the top down. For whatever company you are dealing with, do a Google search on the company name plus the word "CEO" or "President" or "Owner". Find out who the top person is in the company. If you are lucky, you will find their email address. If not, start guessing at it. The usual convention for email addresses is first.last@example.com, or first-initial_last@example.com.

Write a very polite, very short letter to this person, explaining your problem. Apologize for contacting him directly, but explain that the customer service people are not empowered to help customers and ask if they could forward your email on to someone with the authority to help you. Concisely explain what your problem is and what resolution you want to see.

It is important to be polite, professional, and short and to-the-point.

I have yet to not receive satisfaction when going this route.

The last time I did this was for my mother. She had switched from DSL internet from her phone company to cable internet from her cable-TV provider. Because she had requested service on her DSL some several months before, apparently she was on a "promotional program" for her DSL service. So they wanted to charge her $600 for canceling her DSL service. $400 for something and $200 for early-termination. Now bear in mind my mother was a 21-year customer of this phone company.

After my mother got nothing but stonewalling through the usual customer service phone numbers, I emailed the CEO, and she got me to regional VP who canceled all the fees.

Always start at the top.

Foto Joe
March 14, 2011, 11:11 AM
I agree with what you've said above, unfortunately it isn't relevant to this thread because customer service has been great for both of us. The problem has been the product sucks. CS is more than happy to send us as many crappy guns as they've got on the shelf.

No complaints here about Uberti Customer Service at all. It's just that their Schofield guns are from my experience about 67% paperweights.

maillemaker
March 14, 2011, 01:14 PM
I agree with what you've said above, unfortunately it isn't relevant to this thread because customer service has been great for both of us. The problem has been the product sucks. CS is more than happy to send us as many crappy guns as they've got on the shelf.

If their "great customer service" has been for some shipping clerk to box up another "crappy" firearm and send it to you, I'd say that wasn't very great.

What I'd want is for someone to send me not just a replacement, but an exceptional replacement. You aren't going to get that by "going through channels", as you have found out.

Steve

SAA GunSlinger
March 14, 2011, 02:52 PM
I havent completely stripped it down, i took it apart and looked inside to see what was not doing what it should but before you take the side cover off you have to take the top break release latch off, this will allow you to take the side cover off but that top break release latch on the top of the gun has a leaf spring which latches it, it wont fly out or anything so dont worry about that but its a pain to put back in, the spring sits all the way inside the gun and just a small part of it pokes out and goes into a small little groove on the right side of the top break release latch. If you look you will see what i am talking about, after that take the side screws off the side cover. Its pretty stiff so you might have to do some light taping on it to get it off but after that comes off you will be able to look inside it. Ill be honest it doesnt look terribly complicated. Theres some little parts that my big clumsy hands didnt want to loose. I sent it to a gunsmith to fix it because i dont feel like dealing with uberti agian. He said its a timing problem that im having, so i hope to the Good Lord that it will be a simple fix or its back to the factory it goes.:( I called that company and gave them a piece of my mind and also told them how alot of other people are having these problems too. I certainly hope they take that into consideration. The schofield is a fair design, its not fair that people will loose faith in it because crappy craftsmanship.

SAA GunSlinger
March 14, 2011, 03:03 PM
I agree the customer service is good but i am rather upset that they send another broken gun back. Ive lost faith in uberti :( When i dropped off my schofields for repair, i saw a very pretty lever action yellowboy in 45 LC. I really need one for cowboy action shooting and i picked it up, and fell in love with it. It felt great, mechanically smooth and they let me put some dummy rounds through it to see how it would function and it worked great. I was seriously considering buying it, i looked at the price and it wasnt too bad and then i looked at the maker.......uberti:(....i just put it back up on the shelf and walked away from it. I already have enough pot iron from them giving me problems, i dont need anymore. I think ill put my money in a marlin 1894 cowboy.

Foto Joe
March 21, 2011, 04:54 PM
You have to take the top break release latch off, this will allow you to take the side cover off but that top break release latch on the top of the gun has a leaf spring which latches it, it wont fly out or anything so dont worry about that but its a pain to put back in.

For no other reason that to see what was inside, I pulled the side plate on my Schofield. SAA GunSlinger did warn me about that spring, but I'm not bright enough to heed each and every warning someone gives me, unfortunately.

I spent the better part of an hour getting that stupid latch back on, all the while mentally kicking myself for having to look inside!!! Granted, I now know how to get it back together reasonably easily, but I had my doubts for a while.

For some idiotic reason the 100+ year old design that S&W came up with for this gun was far ahead of its time in complexity. You would think that S&W would have designed a gun that was much more user servicable back then. Maybe that's why Colt's captured the market. You can fully dis-assemble the things with one screwdriver and a stick to clean out the hand channel!!

I shall now finish my rant but striking the "Submit Reply" button and go have an adult beverage to calm my nerves.;)

SAA GunSlinger
March 22, 2011, 05:42 PM
I have some really bad news:( The Gunsmiths could not fix the schofield so i have to send it back to the company for now what would be my third replacement from them. I called them up and told them how much trouble i was having and they agreed to send me a brand new schofield with in 2 days time! I was very impressed by this but i certainly hope that this 3rd one will finally work. Im so tired of this, i just want a working schofield!!!!. Sorry to hear that the Schofield gave ya some trouble when ya took it apart Fotojoe. Ill keep yall updated on what happens.

poppa59hd
March 23, 2011, 11:09 AM
SAA Gunslinger: Just browsed thru this Uberti problem you're having and I'm surprised to read about all the problems you're having. I've never owned an Uberti cartridge pistol, but the Rems and '51&'60 Colts I've had were all Timex watches. But, I've had them for a number of years, too, so maybe their craftmanship and/or quality control has gone downhill dramatically. You have my sympathies.

Being sent to Fort Riley and leading a good life is an oxymoron if there ever was one. Fort Riley may not be the end of the world, but it's just down the road if you take a right at Custer Hill! Welcome to Kanz-azz!

Always Remember: Rebels-0 Yankees-1 Halftime

SAA GunSlinger
March 23, 2011, 11:41 AM
I would have to agree with you poppa59hd, i have owned a 1858 new army, 1851 colt navy, 3rd model dragoon, and a colt walker all produced by uberti. I bought those all almost 6 years ago and they were fantastic. I figured buying a really high end gun from them would be flawless but as i can see quality has gone down a bit since i last bought firearms from them. I must say there customer service was great. The manager that i was connected too was doing everything in her power to make sure i was a happy customer. When calling them they said they would have me a new replacement in 2 days time and also are sending me some uberti, hats, t-shirts and gifts for all that i had to deal with. I was extremely impressed by this. The very next day they called me bright and early and wanted to insure me that they had a new gun that had been properly inspected and tested and on its way to me. This also impressed me. This show of great customer service has made me put some faith back into the uberti name. I also told them that other people were having these problems with their firearms and that alot of cowboy action shooters were not pleased with malfunctioning schofields. They took what i said into consideration. There customer service is fantastic, if the craftsmanship on there products improve they will still have my buisness.

Foto Joe
March 24, 2011, 10:51 AM
With any luck you'll get a working model in the next couple of days. So far I've run just over 100 rounds of 44-40 smokeless through mine. I've only pushed a half dozen Black Powder rounds through it though. I'm hoping to get it sort of "Broken In" before trying to put more than one cylinder of the good stuff down the barrel.

I've heard and experienced that modern Schofields DO NOT like Black Powder very much. If nothing else, I'd like to have it loaded with Black Powder for up in the mountains when I'm part of the food chain. The ballistics I've seen for smokeless 44-40 versus Black Powder aren't very complimentary of the smokeless rounds.

SAA GunSlinger
March 24, 2011, 09:57 PM
Thats very intresting and i never new that blackpower could out perform smokeless. Wish me luck i pick it up tommorow and hopefully they dont make me do another 3 day waiting period. Ill keep ya updated! I have my fingers crossed;)

radom
March 24, 2011, 11:09 PM
No, black powder does not out perform smokless loads. But a case full of BP will out perform reduced power cowboy action type smokless loads.

Hawg Haggen
March 24, 2011, 11:46 PM
I'm hoping to get it sort of "Broken In" before trying to put more than one cylinder of the good stuff down the barrel.

Don't waste your time, use smokeless. The problem is the Schofield clones have longer cylinders so they can use the same frames for cartridges longer than the original .45 S&W. To do that they eliminated the gas ring that helped prevent powder fouling from seizing the cylinder.

Foto Joe
March 25, 2011, 11:20 AM
Don't waste your time, use smokeless. The problem is the Schofield clones have longer cylinders so they can use the same frames for cartridges longer than the original .45 S&W. To do that they eliminated the gas ring that helped prevent powder fouling from seizing the cylinder.

And don't I know it!!

Typically, this gun won't be used for more than one cylinder of the real stuff, unfortunately. It's a shame really that the repro's can't fire the appropriate ammunition. My original quest when I got the Schofield bug was to have one in 45 Schofield, good luck with that unless you find an original. I settled for a Russian in the appropriate caliber but unfortunately it was junk from the production line, it was a nice gun though, it just wouldn't fire. It's for that reason that I switched over to 44-40 since it was one of the original chamberings for Schofield and Uberti didn't have any more Russians on hand.

This thing would be a hoot with the right ammo and once I get tired of shooting smokeless out of it, she'll go on the For Sale list. Interestingly enough, I took my late 1970's SAA Clone out for some exercise the other day. Normally I will pull the cylinder pin about every three loads, wipe the pin and put a little Ballistol on it before putting it back in. This time, I had forgotten my oil can so the pin was not pulled to wipe down or oil. I fired just over 80 45 Colt Gallery Loads with no maintenance. She did drag a couple of times but never failed to index. When I got home the pin was a little stubborn but came out without too much effort.

There's a LOT to be said for that "blast ring", it's there for a VERY good reason.

Bishop Creek
March 25, 2011, 11:29 AM
The lack of a gas ring was the reason that I sold my Schofield a few years back. It was a very nice piece, and it shot very well with smokeless, but I prefer black powder and my pistol just fouled up too much using .45 Schofield BP rounds.

SAA GunSlinger
March 27, 2011, 02:14 PM
Foto Joe i have a question for ya and this also goes out to anyone else who has had schofield problems. When you recieved your schofield and it was broken what color were the grips? Were they light colored wood or dark colored wood? I bought 2 schofields, the dark wood one worked great but the light wood one was broke, i returned it and recieved another one broken and it also had light wood grips. Then i recieved my 3rd one and it has dark wood grips, i inspected every inch of it to make sure there were no flaws and even had the gunsmith test fire it. It seems to work great, im still waiting to shoot it because we have a waiting period up here for handguns. My hunch is that ones with light wood are of lower quality compared to the dark wood ones. I know you could probably tell this alot easier with serial #'s but like a fool i didnt write down my last 2 serial #'s on my broken firearms that they sent me. Were any of your schofields that you recieved broken have light wood grips on them? Like i said its just a hunch. I really like hearing yall conversing about these schofields and the ammo to use with them. I sure learn alot even with the side conversations.:D

Bishop Creek
March 27, 2011, 04:33 PM
Is this what you mean by dark grips? Though I no longer own it, mine was perfect with no problems (except for shooting black power). Serial range was in the four digits.

http://i56.tinypic.com/dfw2ki.jpg

SAA GunSlinger
March 27, 2011, 04:45 PM
Yours has light colored grips and from what ya say it works just fine. Which cancels out my hunch. :D Thank you for sending the picture.:D

Foto Joe
March 27, 2011, 07:20 PM
SAA Gunslinger,

All of mine had dark wood grips including the Russian.

Interestingly enough, I went to a gun show yesterday (very small but a good showing of 19th Century arms) and came across an original Schofield. I once knew what it was but have forgotten. It had a Russian style release on it but was chambered in 44-40 and had a different trigger guard than a Russian. The trigger guard was huge by comparison to what we normally associate with a Schofield. Since my memorie isn't working on who S&W made these for, maybe somebody subscribed to this thread can remember. I didn't get a chance to fondle it so I can't say about any markings, I don't think the Wells Fargo models had any differences other than a stamping, but I could be wrong.

What caught my eye most was the blast ring on the cylinder, the thing was at least a quarter of inch long!! If only our Italian friends had thought to duplicate "that" part of the gun, they'd sell a lot more of them.

Hawg Haggen
March 27, 2011, 07:41 PM
Most Well's Fargo marked guns are fake.

Foto Joe
March 27, 2011, 07:56 PM
I realize that Wells Fargo Schofields have a bad rap brought about by unscrupulous people. I don't think this one was a WF though. I seem to remember something about those extra large trigger guard models being made for a foreign country other than Russia.

Unfortunately, I've got too much "Cliff Claven" trivia in my brain and some of the important stuff gets bumped out of the way to make room once in a while.

SAA GunSlinger
March 28, 2011, 01:26 PM
Correct me if im wrong but i thought most wells fargo schofields were 5inch barrels, they were cut down after being released from the army. Wouldnt a wells fargo model have US military markings, Serial #'s and 5inch barrel?

Foto Joe
March 28, 2011, 03:47 PM
Correct me if im wrong but i thought most wells fargo schofields were 5inch barrels, they were cut down after being released from the army. Wouldnt a wells fargo model have US military markings, Serial #'s and 5inch barrel?

Correct. I think 1887 is when the government gave up on them and dumped the lot as surplus to distributors.

=================================================

Also, I figured out what I was looking at on Saturday at that gun show. It WAS NOT a Schofield but an S&W Top Break Double Action. Like I said, I didn't fondle it, I only got to look, shows how much I know about S&W's huh?

It was driving me nuts as to exactly what it was so I've been scouring the info on Al Gore's internet for the answer. It was found at "The History of Smith & Wesson Firearms" (http://books.google.com/books?id=5jnqqkW85u8C&pg=PA33&lpg=PA33#v=onepage&q&f=false) by Dean K. Boorman, scroll down to page 37 for the model I was looking at.

Hawg Haggen
March 28, 2011, 04:14 PM
Wells Fargo didn't buy many guns. Employees furnished their own for the most part. What guns they did buy were from whatever the local purveyor had in stock.

SAA GunSlinger
March 28, 2011, 11:00 PM
I know that the Schofield was a partial success but i dont understand why the military gave up on it. This is just opinion but i think the schofield design is much better then the peacemaker design. Im not discrediting the peacemaker at all, its a fine firearm but unloading and loading of the schofield is so amazing to me and im surprised that the military didnt see its potential as well. Yes i know that the military didnt like that they couldnt use the normal 45.colt in the schofield which was chambered for the shorter 45. S&W but it was good to see that their were some people out there that took notice to the schofield such as, the james brothers, the earp brothers, john wesley hardin and Theodore roosevelt. Its just too bad that Mr.Schofield took his life with one at Fort Apache.:( I know it may be cheesey to say but at least the firearm was recognized enough to be mentioned in the movies, Unforgiven, The quick and the dead, and 3:10 to yuma.:D I know that i may be off topic but it is nice to chit chat about this historic firearm until i can pick up my new replacement and test fire it.

pmeisel
March 29, 2011, 06:51 AM
I've been considering one for the wife's coffee table gun when I travel. Simpler to her to reload than a normal side opening DA.

Foto Joe
March 29, 2011, 09:58 AM
It's my understanding from the reading I've done about it that the Schofield got dropped simply because of supply problems. It's hard to use 'em when there ain't no bullets left.

Smith & Wessons attitude was similar to Colt's in that we don't need to do what that other company did, we're S&W!! Therefore the 45 S&W cartridge. I think that it also had to do with the fact that S&W and Colt's were not buddies. Sam Colt was the type of business owner that would protect his patent rights with a vengence and even after his death the company continued to frown on anyone who they perceived as a threat. It's possible that introducing the Model 3 chambered in the competitors cartridge could have led to a law suit thus slowing its introduction. This is purely speculation on my part, but I know from my reading that those two companies were brutally competitive with each other on research and development.

Personally, I think that Uberti blew it when they made the decision to not chamber their gun in 45 Schofield but that's just my opinion and I like historic cartridges, even though there are much better rounds out there than that one.

I agree with you whole heartedly that the Model 3 is a superior weapon when it comes to unloading and loading. That and it feels right in the hand. As far as being a "Fight Stopper", the 45 Schofield was a distant second to the 45 Colt round though. I don't know if you've ever gotten the chance, but if you do, stuff 40gr of 3f into a modern 45 Colt brass and top it off with a 235-250gr RNFP bullet. Depending on the gun, it might not be very accurate, but what a whollop those babies make when the firing pin hits the primer. The downside of course is that with that much powder the gun will be so hot after two or three cylinders you'll have to let it cool off before you can even unload it.

SAA GunSlinger
March 29, 2011, 02:42 PM
That is extremely interesting Fotojoe. We could only wish that the companies back then could of put there differences aside and produce a fantastic firearm. Unfortunately that was not to be. I am saving up all my brass, i do not reload but im slowly but surely buying my equipment to do so. I need your advice, what would be a good powder to reload with? Something really good and safe i dont want my schofields to get damaged :D lol there my babies. Also do you think that the 44-40 out performs the 45 colt? I was thinking about getting another schofield chambered in it or a nice marlin 1894 chambered in it. Thanks agian:D Oh and one last thing, have you ever had the privilege to shoot 45.S&W if yes, Whats your take on the cartridge?

Foto Joe
March 29, 2011, 04:12 PM
I need your advice, what would be a good powder to reload with?

I am by no means ANY type of authority on smokeless powders or reloading. I don't think that you've ever mentioned what caliber your guns are but I'll make the assumption that they are 45 Colt. What I would suggest is that you hit the Reloading Section of THR (http://www.thehighroad.org/forumdisplay.php?f=15) for information regarding powders. Personally, I use Universal simply because that was a powder that Lee loading dies had information for in their data sheets. It works well for me on 44-40, 38 Special and 9mm, but from what I understand it's not as well suited to the low pressure loads associated with original Black Powder cartridges like 45 Colt and 38 Special, I could be wrong though.

As far as which cartridge out performs the other, I don't have any personal data on that, because all my 45 Colt loads are Black Powder and my 44-40 loads are smokeless right now.

I will say that 45 Colt is a pistol cartridge that some manufacturers are chambering rifles for. The 45 Colt cartridge is a straight wall that back in the day wasn't as popular for rifle as the tapered 44-40 round. The straight wall brass doesn't eject as easily after firing as a tapered cartridge. Of course if my facts are incorrect on this somebody will most probably take me to task on it.

In my opinion, the 44-40 is probably ballistically more potent, especially when fired from a rifle. I know that loading a 44 Special with 26gr 3f and sending it down the barrel of a '94 Marlin produces a just barely sub-sonic round. Adding another 14gr to get to the 40gr load of a 44-40 would probably be VERY impressive in a rifle. Of course if you're going to mash 40gr of 3f into a 45 Colt brass and do the same, the bullet will be 235-255gr instead of 200-210 so the range won't be as good, but the impact energy at the muzzle will undoubtedly be pretty huge. I know that a 235gr with 40gr 3f behind it fired out of my SAA with a 12" barrel produces an average MV of 1,065 fps at 592 ft.lb., so it's probably higher with a longer barrel. Whereas the 44 Special with 26gr 3f and a 200gr RNFP gets 1,079 fps and 517 ft.lb. out of the Marlin. My money would be on the 44-40!!:D

The downside to 44-40 is finding the brass. Starline now has it, but the stuff isn't easy to come by in a hurry, but it is available. From a historical standpoint, I'd prefer the 44-40 simply for the WOW factor when you let one fly.

As far as shooting 45 S&W (Schofield), no. But I used to load 44 Russian which is slightly longer brass. If I recall the 45 S&W only held 23gr of powder and didn't really have the poop that the 45 Colt had even after it was downloaded to 30gr.

SAA GunSlinger
April 1, 2011, 06:53 PM
Thanks for all the info it really helped when i was maken purchases. Another question for you guys. I got my schofield back and i went out and shot it. It worked great but it shoots to the left!!! How do i fix this? Is there someway that i can possibly adjust the sights on it?:confused:

arcticap
April 2, 2011, 12:25 AM
For reference, here's a photo of the Uberti's rear sight:

http://gun-specifications.findthebest.com/sites/default/files/495/media/images/2_203.jpg

Here's the Uberti parts diagram showing the replacement sight part:

http://www.vtigunparts.com/store/shopdisplayproducts.asp?id=35&cat=Uberti+Schofield

That's always a potential problem with fixed sights and sometimes even with an adjustable rear sight if it does not have enough range for adjustment.

There's only so many options for making windage adjustments. Either the rear sight notch needs to be opened up on the same side as the impact is needed to be moved to. Or the front sight needs to be moved in the opposite direct of where the impact is needed to be moved to.

For the rear, that involves filing or milling the existing notch, or installing a replacement rear sight with an improved notch.
I suppose that someone could fill in the original notch entirely, either with molten metal or an insert, and then recreate a better notch that way.
For the front, that involves either making a dovetail for a new front sight so that the new sight can be drifted into alignment. But that entails removing the original front sight.
Or sometimes it's possible to bend the front sight enough to obtain the correct alignment.

SAA GunSlinger
April 2, 2011, 06:51 PM
Thanks for the tip, i bent the front sight a little and tinkered a little with the back sight and what do you know! TA DA!!! I was shooting soda cans from 35 yards away!!! Finally I HAVE SCHOFIELDS THAT FUNCTION PROPERLY!!! I bought them in February and finally in April i have finally got them working right. After 3 returns, shipping cost, and tinkering and a whole lot of cussing i finally have 2 working schofields. Thank you all for your help i greatly appreciate it! Lets hope they hold up when i begin shooting in the SASS. I wish the best of luck to the rest of everyone and there schofield issues as well and feel free to ask me any questions. Ive gained a little knowledge since i had to tinker with so many of them. Thanks agian all and keep your powder dry:D