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View Full Version : For the AR-15, which is the better flash hider, the A1 or the A2?


MMcfpd
December 12, 2010, 05:42 PM
There are plenty of alternatives, but the question here is limited to the A1 and A2 flash hiders.

While the A2's closed bottom eliminates the dust signature when firing prone, and might provide somewhat of a compensator effect, its lack of the exhaust ports on the bottom seems like it would mean that the A2 would disperse more flashing gas into the shooter's field of vision than the A1.

So for flash hiding alone, which is superior? Are there any accessible test results?

Dfariswheel
December 12, 2010, 08:15 PM
I'm not aware of any testing, but you can bet that testing was done, probably both by Colt and the military before it was adopted.

Other than the closed bottom the A1 and A2 are the same, so I'd guess the A2 might have more anti-rise effect on the muzzle.
I'd also guess that more muzzle flash would be diverted upward and to the sides. Whether this is really noticeable to the shooter is probably subjective.

HorseSoldier
December 13, 2010, 02:12 AM
Never tried shooting an A1 and an A2 next to each other, but my experience with firing various weapons at night is that pretty much any muzzle flash will screw with your night vision, so they may have decided it wasn't enough of a downside to disregard the benefits of the closed bottom A2 style.

Ridge_Runner_5
December 13, 2010, 03:06 AM
Smith Enterprise Vortex :D

YouTube comparison (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8NXTLoK7wEg)

bigghoss
December 13, 2010, 03:08 AM
I haven't shot both side by side but I have shot both. I don't recall any difference.

demigod
December 13, 2010, 09:08 AM
The A2 is more of a compensation thing. I guarantee you, it does ZERO for dust signature. The A1 is probably a smidge better, but the A2 works so good.... who cares?

I even run the A2 on my SBRs and it's more than adequate.

tirod
December 13, 2010, 09:24 AM
There are flash hider videos on youtube.

The A2 doesn't direct all the flash up, a lot goes forward. In daylight it's nil. Dust suppression is better, but again, depends on what is in front of the shooter. A rising berm will catch the forward gas and still make a cloud. In a fixed position you do something for it, on the move, you won't be there long.

The point of a flash hider is to minimize what the enemy sees. It reduces the ability to sight at the flash. If you plan on being on a two way range, don't bother with flash hiders, get a suppressor. They reduce the visible light and sound signature.

For a plinking/hunting AR, either the A1 or A2 will do as a muzzle protector, all it's worth on a civilian gun. If I was building an AR I wouldn't care which was used, price would be more important.

demigod
December 13, 2010, 10:32 AM
If you plan on being on a two way range, don't bother with flash hiders, get a suppressor. They reduce the visible light and sound signature.

Wrong. Silencers don't completely mask flash. In fact, the flash can be bigger with the silencer than the flash hider alone. Even AAC's pictures of their blackout flash hider compared to the M4-2000 silencer illustrate this.

I see flash coming out of my silencer all the time in low light.

Do you actually ever post anything that isn't factually INCORRECT??? There's so much more wrong with your nonsense reply, but I don't have all day so I picked the main error to correct.

SR420
December 13, 2010, 12:38 PM
Good sound suppressors will in fact eliminate all flash and the DC Vortex has
proven itself again and again to be an invaluable asset on today's battlefields.




.

demigod
December 13, 2010, 12:48 PM
I guess the M4-2000 and M4-1000 aren't good sound supressors then!!! :D

Even R_Silvers of AAC posts pics of their M4-2000 with flamage coming out of the end cap. And I've seen it FIRST HAND with both the M4-2000 and M4-1000 silencers. Installing the silencer negates the flash hider's ability to hide flash.

If flash suppression was your biggest concern. Removing the silencer would be wise. ESPECIALLY for the first round when the can is still full of plain old air.

SR420
December 13, 2010, 12:56 PM
A bit of what AAC says about their M4-2000 Mod 8:

By eliminating approximately 97% of the muzzle report, the M4-2000 Mod 08 preserves the hearing of the shooter and nearby support
personnel, facilitates communication, and masks the location of the weapon. Eliminating muzzle flash in combat saves lives.

Maybe R_Silvers didn't get the memo.

http://www.advanced-armament.com/product.aspx?pid=197

KChen986
December 13, 2010, 01:09 PM
I seem to recall flash being more pronounced during high rates of fire. Is that what you're talking about Demigod?

tirod
December 13, 2010, 01:57 PM
Do you actually ever post anything that isn't factually INCORRECT??? There's so much more wrong with your nonsense reply, but I don't have all day so I picked the main error to correct.

I've shot the A1 and A2 in service. It's what I've actually seen. I've also seen real non hollywood suppressors in use. In a single shot mode, they don't spew a flame out the front. They are designed to contain and control gas emission, with baffles, packing, and venting, plus a muzzle wipe that closes behind the bullet. I've even seen homemade suppressors built for .22's that were packed with shell casings, and they didn't blow a tongue of flame out the front of them either.

Read what suppressor owners say on their subforums, if anything, the can contains so much gas it blows back down the barrel into their face, especially with the AR. There are specific fixes for it, including a gas buster charging handle. In operation, the main noise is the bolt clanking back and forth. A jet of flame out the front would be noticeable in it own right, contrary to the whole purpose. It's releasing the sudden gas impulse, rather than suppressing it.

Back on track, either the A1 or A2 will do, they don't work 100%, it's '60's technology. The newer comps can do a lot more, again, the vids are on youtube.

MMcfpd
December 13, 2010, 06:47 PM
The point of a flash hider is to minimize what the enemy sees.

That's contrary to my understanding, that being that the point of a flash hider is to minimize the effect of muzzle flash on the shooter's vision in low light or dark conditions.

cornbush
December 13, 2010, 06:52 PM
That's contrary to my understanding, that being that the point of a flash hider is to minimize the effect of muzzle flash on the shooter's vision in low light or dark conditions.


Ding, Ding, Ding.....We have a winner!!!!!

WoofersInc
December 14, 2010, 09:23 PM
Wrong. Silencers don't completely mask flash. In fact, the flash can be bigger with the silencer than the flash hider alone. Even AAC's pictures of their blackout flash hider compared to the M4-2000 silencer illustrate this.

I see flash coming out of my silencer all the time in low light.

Which suppressor are you using? I run a GemTech Halo on my AR's and a YHM 7.62 QD Stainless on my FS2000 and Remington 700. There is no noticable flash coming out of either of these suppressors.

Volucris
December 14, 2010, 11:12 PM
I've never seen flash from the end of a suppressor. lol.


The A1 and A2 flash hiders both suck but are better than nothing at all. Get an AAC Blackout.