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GUNNER336
December 20, 2009, 03:52 AM
Looking for ammo, brass, components for sharps 45-90 black powder Pedersoli.

Pukindog
December 20, 2009, 08:17 PM
Starline produces brass for the .45-90 Sharps. Buffalo Arms has loaded cartridges for the .45-90. Any .45-70 components will work for the .45-90.
Load data can be found in the Lyman books and other load data sources.

Jeff

TomADC
December 20, 2009, 08:48 PM
These are great people to deal with a bought all my 45-70 ammo from them and as I shoot it up it will become my reloading stock.

http://www.powderinc.com/

longranger
December 23, 2009, 09:16 AM
www.buffaloarms.com Perhaps your best bet for a one stop shop.You will eventually need to reload or be wealthy.

GUNNER336
December 23, 2009, 03:51 PM
I can see that. I was told you can shoot 45-70 black powder in the 45-90 as the only difference was in the length of the case. like shooting 38 spec in a 357 mag. Any idea's on that anyone.

TomADC
December 23, 2009, 04:21 PM
Yeah I say $38.50 for a box of 20 is steep, and that's overstock ammo, I was happy with the 45-70 at $20.00 box of 20, sorry can't answer the case length question.
How about a picture of the rifle?

Jim Watson
December 23, 2009, 04:58 PM
I can see that. I was told you can shoot 45-70 black powder in the 45-90 as the only difference was in the length of the case. like shooting 38 spec in a 357 mag. Any idea's on that anyone.

It is physically possible and not actively dangerous. A lot of .45-XX have been shot with .45-70 either for hunting or just to say "we shot Grandpa's rifle" but I can't think accuracy would be very good.

No need to improvise, .45-90 brass is readily available and you will not wear it out very fast with black powder or light smokeless.

c.robertson
December 23, 2009, 06:28 PM
I have a 1978 made Browning Creedmoor in .45-90 and regularly shoot .45-70 in it with NO discernable difference in accuracy. Yes, I do have .45-90 brass and do shoot it, but have LOTS more .45-70.
Again, I can't tell any difference between the two.

Mike Irwin
December 23, 2009, 07:27 PM
I, too, have fired 45-70 rounds in a rifle chambered for .45-90 and achieved excellent accuracy.

GUNNER336
December 24, 2009, 12:12 AM
Tom

I have the Quigley Sharps by Cimarron Pedersoli. It was given to me but with no ammo or instruction book. Has all the fancy sights with the bubble level at the front sight and big folding ajustible at the rear. It is marker Black Powder only 45-90. Can you shoot light smokeless in this or is that a NO NO ?????

TomADC
December 24, 2009, 12:16 PM
That rifle is high on my want list but I want 45-70 for my Sharps, mainly because I have a lot of loaded rounds and a set of dies. Keep it simple my motto.
I have a H&R Officers model trapdoor I only shoot BP in mine and if I had your Sharps that's all I'd use.
http://pic20.picturetrail.com/VOL174/1021972/18168454/370401695.jpg

bobn
December 24, 2009, 04:26 PM
gunner.,,,,too much empty air space in my opinion. bobn

Jim Watson
December 24, 2009, 05:06 PM
There is no reason not to shoot "light smokeless" in .45-90; IF you have the data. I think Lyman #49 lists it but don't know for sure.

c.robertson
December 24, 2009, 07:30 PM
Yes, Lyman #49 DOES list a lot of smokeless loads for the .45-90, but only for CAST bullets. There is no reason at all not to substitute .45-70 jacketed loads for the .45-90, assuming your using .45-90 brass. I just shoot .45-70 ammo in the .45-90 with just as good results.

Merry Christmas y'all

Pukindog
December 24, 2009, 08:15 PM
Here is mine. C. Sharps Boss gun. Grade II. .45-90, 34" barrel, long range sights. I use both BP and smokeless. Accurate Arms 5744 works great.

Jeff

Jim Watson
December 24, 2009, 08:58 PM
Nice rig.
I am a traditionalist. I have not shot smokeless in my .40-65 Browning since I got it and doubt the previous owner did. My .38-55 Winchester has not seen nitro for 12-15 years and even then no jacketed bullets, although I did have some gas checks when using it for CAS sidematches before I got into BPCR..

GUNNER336
December 25, 2009, 02:56 AM
Thanks guys for all the info. I was given this gun and I am learning about it. I am a pistol shooter never have been a BP shooter but it seems like fun.
I maybe asking for more info later.

I have no 45-90 ammo except some factory 45-70 and wanted to ask this.

It is PMC " Precision Made Cartridges" It is a commercial load in boxs marked like old cowboy ammo. It say " PMC Smokeless 45-70 Gov't cartridge faithfully reproduces the original , which was the official US Military Cartridge from 1873 to 1892. It is loaded with 406 Gr. Flat nose hard cast lead bullet with a velocity of 1250 per second ".

Box says made in Boulder City, Nevada

I dont know if he shot this in the Pedersoli as he also had a Marlin Limited in 45-70.

Thanks, and Merry Xmas to all on the boards.

noyes
December 25, 2009, 03:55 AM
NICE real mens rifles.

c.robertson
December 25, 2009, 08:02 AM
This is my collection of BPCR's, minus a cut down 1874 Trapdoor purchased after photo taken. All are .45-70 except the bottom High Wall, it is a Browning Creedmoor in .45-90

Photo quality not the best.

Pukindog
December 25, 2009, 08:17 AM
Nice collection.

Jeff

robhof
December 25, 2009, 08:39 AM
An elderly gent at out outdoor range built a 45-120 on a Ruger 45-70 frame, it was a gorgeous piece of work, wish I had my camera the day he had it out there. He stated that he paid $2.55 each for his brass. His had a burl stock and forearm that he made and he had the frame case hardened, it was a beaute.

fineredmist
December 25, 2009, 09:30 AM
Gunner 336

That PMC ammo will be just fine in either gun as it is a replica (low pressure) load. Shoot it and enjoy it.

c.robertson
December 25, 2009, 04:44 PM
Kinda feel guilty about posting this link. But this is what I REALLY want to add to the collection.

http://www.collectorsfirearms.com/admin/product_details.php?itemID=28744

Chick
December 26, 2009, 08:26 AM
You can shoot true black powder if you want too, but it can ruin a fine firearm if you don't immediately go throughly clean the firearm when you are through. Plus, when you are through shooting, you stink of the sulphur. I have shot my last load of black powder, and that was a good 20 years ago.

GUNNER336
December 28, 2009, 03:58 AM
Yes will try it once I think. But will probably go modern. I am not as serious a shooter of BP as some.But I do enjoy watching what some traditionalists can do with the old BP loads and weapons. some really impress and some long range shooters just astond me with what they can do with the old BP loads.

Pukindog
December 28, 2009, 07:58 AM
Let us not forget Billy Dixon and the Battle Of Adobe Walls. Using the "Big .50 " ( .50-90 ) Sharps he made a shot at about 1275 yards. Iron sights.

Jeff

Jim Watson
December 28, 2009, 09:13 AM
You can shoot true black powder if you want too, but it can ruin a fine firearm if you don't immediately go throughly clean the firearm when you are through.


I clean my BPCR on the range. Takes about ten minutes. I reclean at home just to be sure but the sulfur smell is gone and it doesn't take long. I think it is easier to get the soot out of my .40-65 than to get the copper out of my .308.

You do have to clean the brass, too. I decap on the range and drop the shells in a jug of soapy water. At home, rinse and transfer to the rotary tumbler charged with wet ceramic. Tumble 3 or 4 hours, drain, rinse, and dry in the sun or a low oven. It takes longer to clean the brass than the gun, but that is just part of what it takes to do good work with the old style guns.

longranger
December 31, 2009, 02:23 PM
Would like to see the targets from those who shoot 45-70 out of 45-90 chambered rifles."Good accuracy" what is good accuracy? at what yardage?
Shoot's good @ 10 feet? Besides the heavy leading on the leade,good luck getting that out.Go ahead and shoot 45-70's out of your 45-90 then try and chamber a 45-90.That bullet from the 45-70 will slump and scrape huge amounts of lead and deposit it right in front of your 45-70.
Either cartridge is capable of fine accuracy in their perspective chambers.You are not going to even get good 45-70 performance.Waste of ammo and a what is probably a decent barrel.Some folks are just happy to hit paper @25yds and call it good accuracy.

sundance44s
December 31, 2009, 03:44 PM
I would have to see it to beleive it also .
Shooting a 45/70 out of a 45/90 ...talk about freebore ...wow
Maybe it would shoot min of horse at 100 yards ..

davem
January 2, 2010, 05:48 PM
Okay- I may not have things right so I'm asking those that know. :eek: The 45/70 and the 45/90- it seems a lot of buffalo hunters in the old west really liked the 45/90- I think Frank Mayer used it. In any event if you shoot a 45/70 in a 45/90 chamber the bullet has to jump a little to engage the rifling and I always thought in re-loading you seat a smoked bullet in ever longer settings until the rifling shows up and then back down about .003" and you are good to go.
so......
Why can't you use 45/70 brass and just seat the bullet farther out? Unless such a thing exposed a grease groove or the like it doesn't seem you would have a problem. Years ago Phil Sharp wrote a reloading book. I think Sharp was the guy that developed the .357 Magnum. In any event he claimed pressure was the result of space in the case, the deeper you seated the bullet- the more pressure. I think he had one load using lead bullets with an OAL that was for the 357 but he used 38 brass. The only question I have on this concept it whether the shorter case means hot gas around the throat of the chamber- causing excess wear. In any event- any comments welcomed.

TomADC
January 2, 2010, 05:53 PM
I'm no expert but doesn't BP have to have some sort of compression on it? Wouldn't moving a bullet out far enough to make the length same as a 45-90 leave a big gap between the bullet and powder charge?

Jim Watson
January 2, 2010, 06:02 PM
Yes, but I feel confident that anybody resorting to shooting .45-70 in a .45-90 is using smokeless.

davem
January 3, 2010, 12:57 PM
Yeah- I was thinking smokeless but the issue of black powder raises some questions. In a muzzle loading pistol you can put a filler like cream of wheat over the powder and under the ball- the idea is to have the ball close to the end of the cylinder so it doesn't travel that far before entering the barrel. On a black powder cartridge- could you use a filler over the powder and under the bullet to get rid of air space?
And- I use black powder in a muzzle loader but by and large you swab out the bore and the drum area and you are pretty much done. On a black powder cartridge rifle- does the residue get into a lot of nooks and crannies where clearing is a chore?

GUNNER336
January 4, 2010, 02:44 AM
Thus is what is so good about these boards. you pick up and learn so many different aspects of the questions that are asked. Learned alot about this gun of mine.

Gator_Weiss
January 16, 2010, 07:32 AM
Shooting 45-70 in the 45-90 may create chamber erosion.

sundance44s
January 16, 2010, 01:41 PM
You will get chamber ringing shooting a 45/70 in a chamber made for 45/90
I shoot the shorter 45 Schofield rounds out of my 45 LC pistols and it has ringed the chambers in them .

You can seat the bullet to a longer OAL useing B/P ..but you would still get the chamber ringing where the shorter 45/70 brass ends in the chamber ( but it would shoot more accurate with the longer OAL )

With Smokeless powder your loading data OAL MAX for the smokeless charges would be off the charts and be dangerous to shoot ....
Smokeless powders have a Min and Max OAL .

With B/P you just need to fill in all the airspace with fillers or powder ....and seat you bullets at what ever OAL you wish .

GUNNER336
January 20, 2010, 12:25 AM
thanks guys. good info. i have a lot to learn about the 45-90 but it sounds like fun.