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View Full Version : I think it is a Mauser 98


bowhunter79
December 9, 2009, 08:20 PM
I have a riffle that was handed down through the generations. It is a Mauser 98 action as far as I can tell. It has had custom work done to it. It was originally a 300 savage it is now a 308 win. I would like to find out some more on it. I want to get rid of the wood stock and get a Hogue stock and want to make sure it will fit this gun. Hogue has a stock for a Mauser 98. Im planning on handing it down to my son just as my Grandfather and Father did. Just want to update it a little. I have pics but they are not that good. On the bolt release side It has a bird,2067y and Kar 98 stamped on it. On the bolt side it has B Sc and a M all with crowns stamped above them. The B is the only one Im sure of the Sc and M Im just guessing on. Thats what it looks like but I cant make the exact symbols on the computer. Thanks for your time.

Scorch
December 9, 2009, 08:30 PM
You have a small-ring Mauser 98 rifle. Probably one of the many imported after WW2 and sporterized from the 50s-70s. The small ring M98 variant is a little uncommon, but not at all rare.

bowhunter79
December 9, 2009, 10:00 PM
What are you referring to when you say small ring? Any idea of the country of mfg and aprox year of mfg? Thanks

Scorch
December 10, 2009, 12:52 PM
What are you referring to when you say small ring?
"Small ring" refers to the front of the receiver where the barrel is screwed in. In small ring actions, the sides of the action are the same size from rear to fron on the receiver. In large ring actions, the forward portion of the receiver flares out and is about 1/8" larger in diameter than the receiver immediately behind the barrel attachment. If you held two Mauser 98 actions side by side, one large ring, one small ring, you would see that the receiver ring on one is noticeably larger on the front portion of the receiver.

Any idea of the country of mfg and aprox year of mfg?Country of origin is Germany. There were also small ring Mauser 98s made in Mexico for the Mexican military Modelo 1937 rifle, but from the proofmarks, your was made in Germany. Most small ring Mauser 98s made in Germany were made between WW1 and WW2 and primarily directed to civilian market sales.

mapsjanhere
December 10, 2009, 01:10 PM
Most of the proof marks are probably hidden under the wood. Unfortunately, usually the most information is on the barrel (which has been changed). But if you can get pictures of the marks we can probably narrow down the time and origin a lot.

bowhunter79
December 11, 2009, 02:09 PM
I took the scope and rings off today and took the barrel and action out. I got a pic of some stamping that is on the front ring. I have been taken some measurements and this is a mix between the small ring and large ring Mausers. The trigger guard measurements are that of a large ring while its a small ring gun. If my research is correct its because its a Kar 98. Is this correct? There is some random stuff stamped under the front ring but it is really random upside down sideways single letters and #s. I dont know what that means. Im really want to put a new stock on this gun is there anyone who makes one for this half and half rifle or am I going to have to go custom? The pic says 1920 then under that a crown then ERI_RT (The missing letter is where the hole is drilled for my scope base)Then under that 1915. Thanks for all the help on this guys.

mapsjanhere
December 11, 2009, 02:27 PM
The drilled though word is Erfurt. The gun was probably refurbished for use with the Reichswehr in 1920 when they shortened a lot of the older Gewehr 98 to the B carbine model (as opposed to the later 98k of the Wehrmacht).

James K
December 12, 2009, 12:53 PM
The 1920 indicates that the rifle was issued to the Reichswehr or the police under the 1920 law, which incorporated the restrictions of the Versailles Treaty. Military weapons not so marked were illegal. That kind of "double dating" is common in Luger pistols, also.

Jim

bamafan4life
December 12, 2009, 01:13 PM
a small ring mauser in .308 winchester? thats dangerous them acticons where not made to handle that kind of power.

Jim Watson
December 12, 2009, 01:53 PM
bama, if that gun held up to European 8mm, it will handle .308.
Kimber rebarrelled a bunch of '96 Swedish Mausers to .308 and other "hot" rounds with no failures reported.

A small ring action is not going to fit a drop-in large ring stock. I doubt Hogue makes a small ring '98 stock, but you might call and ask them what to do about it.

bowhunter79
December 12, 2009, 02:45 PM
This rifle has been shooting the 308 round for 3 generations soon to be 4. I have not had any issues.
The issue with the stock is not only is it a small ring but it has large ring bolt spacing on the trigger guard. (7 7/8) Verses the 7 5/8 on the small ring. Is this because of it being a Kar 98 model or is there other 98 mausers like this? Im looking into Richards Microfit for the stock. Ill call them and see if they can fit the half and half gun.
Thanks guys for the help. Between you guys and Mausercentral.com I have learned a lot about my riffle the last couple days.

James K
December 24, 2009, 08:43 PM
That carbine is the Karabiner Modell 98a, and is something of an anomaly. It was chambered for the standard 8x57. It was designed as a lightweight carbine, and the small ring was one way to save weight. But in all other aspects, it is a Model 98 Mauser, having the internal improvements as well as cock on opening, three position safety, bolt sleeve lock, etc. That explains the trigger guard dimensions. But if fitted into a standard Model 98 stock, there will be a gap at the receiver ring. On the other hand, the receiver won't fit into a stock for a Model 93 or 95.

After WWI, many thousands of those carbines were bought by Turkey. After various reworks and removal of the original markings, they lost their identity as German rifles and are often called "small ring Turkish 98's", even though Turkey never made any rifles pre-WWII. If stockmakers list a stock for a "small ring Turkish Mauser" it will probably be right for that rifle.

The normal marking on the left side is "Kar 98" (the German "r" looks like an "X"); the original official name was Kar 98AZ, later changed to Kar 98a.

Jim

PetahW
January 2, 2010, 09:04 PM
There are "small ring Mausers", and then, there are Small Ring Mausers" - and not all were created equal.

Pre-98 Mausers with small front receiver rings are all easily identified by their cock-on-closing feature - and are NOT safe for .308 Win class cartridges.

The cock-on-opening M98 Mausers with small front receiver rings are fully the equivalent, pressure & safety wise. of large ring Model 98 Mausers - the only difference is that the small ring limits the size of the barrel shank, thereby ruling out conversion to many cartridges that the large ring M98 can utilize.


FWIW, I have successfully used aftermarket stocks, meant for M93 small ring Mausers on M98 small ring Mausers - the inletting isn't much different than as if fitting any other semi-inletted stock.
I know of at least one stockmaker, who lists that info on their website, under ordering information.

It sounds like someone might have installed different bottom metal on your small ring 98 - if it was original, it should be stamped with the last few digits of the receiver's SN.
IF you choose to use that bottom metal ILO a replacement, the stock inletting can usually be slightly enlarged so that it will fit.

Great American Gunstock lists some specifically for a M98 small ring Mauser:

http://www.gunstocks.com/gallery2/main.php?g2_itemId=5001&g2_page=2

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