View Full Version : Remington 770 vs. Savage (non-accu trigger) both are package deals
September 24, 2009, 02:36 PM
Is the Remington 770 really that bad? The Savage is the superior rifle here? The caliber is 30.06.
What's the reason that the Remington 770 has such a bad reputation?:eek:
September 24, 2009, 08:18 PM
The 770 was designed to be cheap to manufacture and it has many shortcuts such as a press fit barrel instead of a barrel screwed into the receiver. It cannot be upgraded. The 770 is trying to survive on the Remington name alone. The 770's previous incarnation was the model 710 and it didn't have a good reputation either. If all you care about is making loud noises and occasionally hitting a deer sized target, then the 770 may be for you (if you happen to get a good one).
The Savage has a reputation for accuracy straight out-of-the-box and it can be upgraded.
Another alternative is to find a Howa hunter's package.
September 24, 2009, 08:58 PM
Too cheaply made. The plastic trigger guard has a tendency to break. The scope is junk. I hate package deals. And of all the package deals, the Remington 770 is the worst one. The 450 dollars that one costs would be much better spent on this:
with one of these:
September 24, 2009, 10:36 PM
The savage can be upgraded, rebuilt if ever needed, and is a decent rifle. The other is disposable. A package deal is not as bad as people make it sound. I have bought them and never had a scope fail on me. The clarity isnt great but it works for hunting on these inexpensive scopes.
September 25, 2009, 01:50 AM
I didn't accept delivery of the Rem 770 and got a refund. To reassure myself on this decision I played with the bolt action and it isn't smooth and would be terrible for follow up shots. It's a heavy rifle too. I checked out two versions of the Savage both in 30.06 one for $399 and the other for $499 and the actions were superior to the Remington 770.
I have decided to go with the Baretta T-3 it has the smoothest action and you can see the quality in it. If I didn't know about the Baretta then I would have got one of those Savages which are readily available though I'm in no hurry as I have all the time in the world pending price increases and availability of these rifles.
If memory serves me correct when I compared these guns a few months ago:
The Baretta T-3, Savage, Remington, CZ and Vanguard,
the Baretta really shined in the bolt action over all of them being so smooth for follow up shots.
The heavier Remington clearly the bolt kept getting hung up. The Savage was a little better but didn't hang up as much as the Rem 770.
The only thing I remember about the CZ was that it was a larger heavier gun with nice wood stock for $549 made in CZech. Same thing with the Vanguard priced at $649 great looking wood stock but a large rifle made in Japan.
Both of these rifles are loaded via floor plate which is slower and more difficult to load than pre-loaded detachable clips like on the Baretta.
I don't think the smoothness of the bolt actions got my attention on the Vanguard and CZ like the Baretta T-3 did where it really stood out as well as the lighter weight of rifle which means more recoil.
I have found a place that has both of these guns but you have to pre-pay for the CZ and then they can take 10% of the price of $689 so in this case I would be buying a gun with a great reputation but not really knowing how it felt which would be a poor basis to make a decision for purchase but at a great price.
The Baretta I already know how that rifle feels and it is more obtainable to find but I know now that's the one I want and but price difference is only 30.00 between Baretta and the CZ in this case.
I would still want to give the CZ the benefit of a doubt since it has a great reputation and see what that feels like because at 689 minus 10% is the best price I have found so far on a CZ but again as previously mentioned you have to prepay for a rifle that I can't be as sure of like the Baretta.
Maybe I should get both of them?:D
Or get the CZ first since the opportunity is there:confused:
I have a gun collecting friend that said If he were only able to have one rifle it would be the Mauser and the CZ is the closest to it. All the others are pushers.:confused:
September 25, 2009, 07:14 AM
Price, in the absence of value, is not a consideration.
September 25, 2009, 11:25 AM
September 25, 2009, 12:26 PM
I would go CZ. They have an outstanding reputation for a reason. They also come with a lot of options that normally aren't standard: set trigger, nice wood, and my favorite- iron sights. There are also a lot of upgrades available for them and there are even people who specialize in customizing them, like AHR.
A detachable mag isn't a necessity in a hunting rifle and I wouldn't let that be the selling point for buying the Beretta. You will likely never get into a situation where you will need to change mags. When I got out with a bolt action I fill it up and put a spare round in each pocket. I've never needed more than 1 or 2 shots total.
If I ever quit buying old guns a CZ FS in 6.5x55 is on top of my list.
September 25, 2009, 12:57 PM
Wow! The CZ is really getting high marks I just wish there was a way I could get a hold of one to make a final decision. As far as the loading goes do you mean one shot one kill usually follow up shots aren't needed but it is the accuracy to begin with?:confused:
I gather it is the CZ 550 American that's the most accurate out of the selection?
September 26, 2009, 07:35 AM
In the price range you've listed so far I have to say that the CZ is the winner for accuracy, although a Vanguard or Savage isn't far behind.
And you don't load a rifle through the floorplate you load by putting the bolt to the rear and loading the rounds from the top. The floorplate is only there to allow you to unload the rifle if something goes wrong with the bolt and you need to empty the magazine.
September 26, 2009, 08:35 AM
If you were to give me a Rem 770 and I couldn't sell it I wouldn't take it, not worth the room in my safe's. Savage or Stevens are far superior.
September 26, 2009, 09:58 AM
The 770 sucks hugely. Of those two I'd get the Savage. I'd also look at a Howa and a Weatherby Varguard.
September 26, 2009, 10:49 AM
Jimro my mistake I meant that the two rifles have different loading systems the top feed with the built in magazine if that's what you call it and then the detachable clip which I'm used to.:D
September 26, 2009, 10:51 AM
GarryC:eek:that's pretty bad:eek: I mean the 770 is that bad:eek:
September 26, 2009, 11:06 AM
The Remington 770 is a disgrace to everything done in the name of engineering. I saw one come into the local shop with the bold handle broken off- turns out Remington is essentially soldering them on....
September 26, 2009, 11:51 AM
I have owned several Savage rifles, and in regards to value recieved- price, performance and overall quality- noone compares, IMO. I own a 110 package rifle (have since replaced the scope), and it is my best shooter, bar none. I don't know your reasons for purchasing a package gun specifically, but I would consider Marlin Mr-7 or XR-7 if price is the primary consideration. I own an MR-7 in .270, and am very pleased with everything about it. I saw a XR-7 at the gun shop last week for $319, brand new. It had a very nice camo stock. That, coupled with a Tasco World Class (a better scope than the package scopes, by far) and scope bases and rings would put you around $380 plus tax and fees. This is just another suggestion to further cloud your decision-making ability;) The reason I suggest it is that is what I would do now if I were in the market with a similar budget.
September 26, 2009, 11:59 AM
As far as the loading goes do you mean one shot one kill usually follow up shots aren't needed but it is the accuracy to begin with?
It depends on shot placement, bullet selection, etc. Accuracy does play a part in that too. And yes, if you don't think you can kill the animal in one shot, you shouldn't take it. It doesn't happen every time and sometimes you need a follow up but it should be the goal. I once had to make a follow up on a sow who pretty much had jelly for lungs, just to prove to her she was dead. If it takes you a whole mag to put down any animal you are either using the wrong gun or you don't need to be hunting. And odds are, if you miss with the first shot, the animal won't be there for the second.
September 27, 2009, 05:31 AM
Biggfats the follow up shots are for the range. One shot one kill what I mean by that is I would like to get the bulls eye with the first shot.:D
September 27, 2009, 02:08 PM
The Savage combo is excellent! Removable mag, sweet butt pad, and a solid performing rifle for $450. It is no problem to upgrade to a accutrigger but I shot this combo in .270 the other day and made a few raggedy single-hole 100 yard groups. The scope is a cheap simmons but it worked fine. It was actually the same scope I got for $50 to put on my .22, hahaha.
Oh, and I have held the 770. It sucked.
September 27, 2009, 03:21 PM
Out of those two Savage. No question.
September 27, 2009, 08:34 PM
Both the local Scheel's and Cabela's will not take 710 and 770 guns on trade-in. They do not sell and are serious liabilities from a legal standpoint. They have virtually no resale value.
I used to work in the gun department at Wal-mart and sold quite a few of both.
The worst we got back from a Savage was a busted scope, another with a poorly fitted stock, and another that was market 30-06, but really had a 270 Winchester chambered barrel.
With the 710 and 770 we had broken triggers, several broken bold handles, one that still had a live round in the chamber.:eek: One with a safety that would sometimes fire the gun when disengaged. One that appeared to have developed excessive head space, but I'm not sure on that one. The plastic insert in the receiver that the bold ran on dissolved when someone used brake cleaner or something to clean up the gun. Another had the insert damaged by the locking lugs shaving material off the insert.
The department manager had several 710s and loved them, but considering that for $50 more you could get a Savage WITH Accu-trigger they were a poor value. The only reason we sold so many was because they had a detachable box magazine and the Savage rifles we had on hand did not. The scopes on both were in the low-end, but good enough for most deer hunting and of course that can be easily upgraded later.
September 28, 2009, 11:05 AM
I actually checked again and liked the Savage better. The Remington 770 is heavy and the bolt action is not smooth.
But I think I will end up getting the Baretta Tikka 3 Lite as that had the smoothest bolt action over all of them including Vanguard and CZ-550 American. Plus it's light and easy to handle and move around.:D
September 29, 2009, 06:54 PM
The 770 scope is terrible, screws loosen up, trigger guard breaks, etc.
I know of more than one person with the 770 and both have always had problems keeping the gun accurate.
September 29, 2009, 08:22 PM
CZ's are hard to find on display or see what they feel like. I have a chance to go down to view one in .308 if they haven't sold it yet.
Even though not a 30.06 I would think it would be almost the same rifle as the 30.06 rifle other than caliber.:confused:
If not I'm already pretty sure about the Baretta T-3 Lite in stainless steel and composite stock will be the one I get:D
September 29, 2009, 08:40 PM
Locally we have these 770's sitting right next to Savages, Weatherbys and even marlins new bolts all the same price. I'm really not sure who would buy such a rifle and don't understand how Remington can put they're name on such a POS product.
September 29, 2009, 08:46 PM
Out those two you mention, the Savage would definitely be my first choice.
Far superior rifle in all respects, especially accuracy.
September 29, 2009, 08:56 PM
That seems to be the majority on here that many think Remington shouldn't put their name on that 770.:eek:
September 29, 2009, 08:57 PM
Skydiver3346 what do you think about the Savage vs. the Baretta Tikki 3 Lite?:confused:
December 2, 2009, 10:14 AM
This review is to whom may be interested. I can not consider myself a gun expert even though I have a respectable experience with firearms. A couple of weeks ago I got a Remington 770 in 308 (packaged with a pre-mounted, bore-sighted Bushnell® Sharpshooter® 3-9x40 scope) despite its bad reviews I was reading in the internet because the reviews from who actually owned it said it actually shot well. I do not know their experience with firearms but I have some gunsmithing both bolt actions and semis of different calibers from 8mm Mauser, 7.65x53 Mauser, 30-06, 7.62x51 NATO (very similar to .308W) just to mention some. To be fair on the review, I just finisher to test (and zeroing) at the range. Before shooting, I clean very carefully the action and the bore and pre-zero it (at 100 yds) using a laser bullet. Even it seems that breaking-in is not necessary, I did it initially with 10 rounds (cleaning in between rounds), and then every 3 round’s groups (five in total) using Remington UMC ammo. I noticed that the shorter 60-degree bolt throw makes a more handy loading and unloading, as well as faster follow-up shots. Zeroing was really easy, requiring only few shots (actually I accomplished that during the break-in in process). After just three 3-shots groups, group size was 1” at 100 yards (pretty decent for factory regular ammo). Same results when I started using 150gr Remington Core-Lokt ammo (the one I use for deer hunting).
Bottom line, the rifle delivered very well for what is was intended for: HUNTING at mid-range. If I am looking for accuracy at long range, I will spend several hundreds of dollars (is not thousands) in a sniper-type of rifle and not less than $300 as I paid for it.
December 3, 2009, 02:08 AM
The Tikka 3 30.06 makes the same claim of 3 rounds at 100 yards within 1 inch.:eek:
December 3, 2009, 03:18 AM
The T-3, and the Savage, I think both have some advantages, the only things I see going for the T-3 is the barrel and the trigger, the bolt isn't solid, I don't like plastic trigger guards, and the ejection port is just wrong, the the receiver/recoil lug is cut in an unusual way, making stock swapping very difficult. Both rifles have cut corners to make them affordable, and still accurate. I shoot Weatherby rounds, and want a rifle that is as overengineered as I can get. Both the T-3 and Savage have some ingenious features, and are as accurate as modern CAD and robotics can make them, remarkably accurate really, and both actions are probably as strong as they need to be. If these are your only choices I would choose the Savage, because of it's versatility, aftermarket parts, and barrel changes W/O a gunsmith. The Savage isn't perfect either. I'm not a fan of washered receiver/recoil lug and plastic mags on a really high powered rifle. All said though, you would probably be satisfied with either of them. I bought A Vanguard in 300 WBY, already own a MKV, 340WBY, I believe both to be stronger actions than those. I reload, so I want as much solid steel in an action as I can get. The factory target is .7", on the Vanguard, and I'm getting closer to that, gradually.
December 3, 2009, 01:00 PM
I have been looking at both the Tikka T-3 and the Savage myself. I have quite a bit of experience with Savage rifles, dad had a 110FP in 25-06 (tack driver, 5 shots, 1/2inch at 200 yards) Grandfather has a Savage 110 in 270 and it will do sub-moa groups at 100 yards, etc. My problem is that I want a rifle in 6.5x55 and Savage doesn't offer a factory rifle in said caliber while Tikka does. I also wouldn't mind trying something new. As far was the OP question is concerned, Savage hands down. Dicks Sporting Goods currently has the 111FCXP3 package on sale for $330 after rebate - heck of a deal on a good rifle. Might pick one up in .270 meself and buy a barrel in 6.5 later in '010 :)
December 3, 2009, 01:15 PM
You would be best served by going to a large shop and shouldering durn near every rifle model. I would encourage you to avoid scope combos. They may not be all that bad, but with one rare exception they are not good.
Definately shoulder the Ruger Hawkeye, Howa, Win 70 in addition to the ones you have listed.
December 3, 2009, 09:26 PM
The Tikka 3 has the smoothest action of all. Even over the CZ-550:D
.300 Weatherby Mag
December 3, 2009, 10:43 PM
The Tikka 3 has the smoothest action of all.
December 4, 2009, 06:44 PM
Sako had a smoother bolt throw last I checked, but that's not really a fair comparison.
Actions tend to smooth with use (and even more with a little raceway polishing).
If you find the gun that fits you best you will probably be happier in the long run.
Does the T-3 have a plastic trigger guard? That would drive me nuts.
December 5, 2009, 04:59 PM
I've had an opportunity to shoot several Tikka T3s and I would put them right there with the Savage as far as accuracy. I personally lean towards the Savage because I just like them better (I own 4 Savages now) - plus there's more aftermarket parts, stocks, etc. available. I also own a Remington 710 (what the 770 used to be, bought before I got turned on to Savage) and it shoots well, but it is butt ugly and the bolt is not smooth at all to operate - it feels muddy to me due to the nylon insert. I don't really like the 60 degree bolt throw either. Go with the Savage or the T3, you won't be sorry.
December 5, 2009, 07:54 PM
If you have to have a remington, and it has to be bold action, then the 700 is the only answer. I personally dont care much for the 700, but I do like the 742 and 760.
December 5, 2009, 08:05 PM
Hey Stinger. I had assumed you were working with a tight budget when you originally posted that you were trying do decide between Rem. 770 and Savage packages. It appears that may not be the case when you start discussing Tikkas, CZs, etc. You haven't mentioned Winchester model 70 or Remington 700. You are probably best served by going to the biggest gunshop within an hour or two of home, and looking all of the guns over you can afford. The upper end Savages are incredible guns now. I don't know if they outshoot the Sav. 110s or not, but the are nice, well-designed guns. I wouldn't buy a gun on-line, unless I was completely familiar the model. Even then, they can vary from gun-to-gun... at least to a small degree. Good luck and I hope you find a gun you fall in love with.
P.S. The Marlin Model 7s have a nice action and small price tag. I forgot to mention that.
December 6, 2009, 06:01 AM
In thta price range, I'd look at the Stevens 200 (which is the old Savage non- Accu-trigger line) or the Marlin XR-7 line (but right now that line is caliber restricted( They only make it in 3-4 offerings I think (but it has an adjustible trigger for under $300! Mossberg changed their budget rifle ATR (It now has and adjustible trigger "Lightening" trigger, but it appears to be a 770 clone from the looks of it! Haven't seen one inperson. I would really check into the Marlin XR-7 series....seems well built and loaded for the $$
December 6, 2009, 03:53 PM
I have the 770 in .300WM, it was rough when I got it at first, changed out the cheap package scope:barf:, polished the bolt so the action smoothed out, replaced the recoil pad with a limbsaver, it's better now. Groups are pretty decent out of the box with off the shelf core-lokt ammo (1.1-1.3), enough for my hunting needs.
Although I wouldn't buy another one by choice if looking in that price range, I'd look at a Marlin or a T/C Venture for an affordable economy rifle package.
December 24, 2009, 05:57 PM
I am glad I got rid of that Rem 700 acutally I didn't purchase it I paid for it but didn't take order of it and got refund and got Baretta Tikka 3 instead.:D
.300 Weatherby Mag
December 24, 2009, 05:58 PM
Baretta Tikka 3
We will train you eventually.... It's like typing "Camero" instead camaro... It just aint right......
December 24, 2009, 06:16 PM
:D ok...hang in there with me...but it isn't Camaro it's Z/28 or even better Pontiac Trans-Am or the Ultimate Corvette.:D
December 25, 2009, 01:19 AM
Definetly Savage. Please consider the Model 10 in .308 or 7-08. The shorter action helps take the play out of the bolt. I've shot the Tika and CZ and don't care for either. I only recommend guns that I own and shoot regularly. I don't like either the CZ or Tika because the bolt spacing is uncomfortable to me. I prefer to buy American!
From your original post and starting at the price range suggested for accuracy and dependability I reccomend the following:
- Savage/Stevens 200 in .308
- Savage 10 in .308 or 7-08
- Remington 700 ADL (the older model that includes open sights) in either
.243, 7-08, or .308. Academy Outdoors still has a few of the old one in stock.
I've got at least 3 of each in various calibers and they are sub MOA out of the box. Just my input.
December 25, 2009, 03:48 AM
Savage rifles are pretty much all I use. Never had a single problem.
March 20, 2010, 08:57 AM
I have a Remington 770 and have never had a problem with it great accuracy dead on with 7mm mag 300 yds no prob 320$ brand new at cabelas
I shoot hornady Custom GMX 139gr
Guess i got lucky
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