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View Full Version : Best current deals C&R pistols


zxcvbob
August 27, 2009, 12:46 PM
Starting a new thread because I really didn't mean to hijack that other one.

I just sent in my C&R to SOG, Century Arms, and J&G Sales this morning. I'm looking for a TT-33 or TTC, and maybe some kind of Makarov (and a turn of the century S&W top-break .38 revolver)

Who has the best deals for a good shooter? Are there any guns I should avoid because they are just junk? Are there other suppliers I need to look at?

BobbyT
August 27, 2009, 03:12 PM
Any particular reason for being CZ-52-averse? It felt a bit hefty once my Tokarev arrived but it's solidly built and uses the same cheap ammo so I wouldn't be so quick to cull it from your list.

zxcvbob
August 27, 2009, 03:47 PM
Any particular reason for being CZ-52-averse? It felt a bit hefty once my Tokarev arrived but it's solidly built and uses the same cheap ammo so I wouldn't be so quick to cull it from your list. I want to be able to shoot surplus hot Bulgarian SMG ammo without worrying about the gun blowing up in my hand. CZ-52 has very thin chamber walls at the bottom, the TT-33 is stronger.

BobbyT
August 28, 2009, 02:04 AM
I've seen the hot "SMG ammo" claim attributed to Polish, and Romanian, and Bulgarian ammo. They claim also refers to ammo in stripper clips, so if you're buying boxes or cases of boxes with loose ammo that wouldn't apply.

More importantly, I found multiple posts from guys actually chrono-ing rounds from various countries refuting this claim as a myth (I have both pistols, and didn't want to have to keep track of which ammo was which or be finicky when shopping, so I Googled like a fiend).

raftman
August 28, 2009, 02:21 AM
Maybe it's cuz the CZ-52 is so ugly? Not that the Tokarev is gorgeous, but seriously, dunno what those CZ folks were thinkin.'

jsmaye
August 28, 2009, 07:35 AM
Have to disagree - the vz. 52 has great rakish lines to it.

As far as bargains go, how about the CZ vz. 82?

noelf2
August 28, 2009, 08:55 AM
+1 on the CZ 82. That will also "amost" meet your makarov need as well "same ammo and same dependability". I have a Tok but want a CZ 52 as well, but like you, the Tok was first on my list. Shame, because when I got the Tok, the CZ 52's were a lot cheaper than they are now.

Now as a true C&R collector, you will evenually have to get a Nagant revolver. What a fine piece of work and history, however, it's kind of useless. Still a must have though (for me), and I doubt they'll be less than $100 forever.

zxcvbob
August 28, 2009, 11:21 AM
Now as a true C&R collector, you will evenually have to get a Nagant revolver. What a fine piece of work and history, however, it's kind of useless. Still a must have though I've seen those and yes they are on the wishlist, just farther down :) (They'll shoot .32-20 ammo reloaded with .30 Carbine dies, won't they? Or are the rims too thick?)

kab37
August 28, 2009, 11:30 AM
Don't forget a Star Modello Super. Great shooter, looks like 1911, ammo available - 9mm largo.

kab

CowTowner
August 28, 2009, 12:48 PM
Don't forget a Star Modello Super. Great shooter, looks like 1911, ammo available - 9mm largo.
+1

Add http://www.sarcoinc.com to your list of C&R dealers.

noelf2
August 28, 2009, 01:23 PM
I've seen those and yes they are on the wishlist, just farther down (They'll shoot .32-20 ammo reloaded with .30 Carbine dies, won't they? Or are the rims too thick?)

Some people reload for them but they rarely reload in a way that takes advantage of the gas seal between the cylinder and barrel. I shoot hotshot Nagant ammo (preferred), or 32 s&w long with mine. 32 s&w long isn't ideal though, but is safe and works well (splits the case and doesn't gas seal). Fun at the range and more accurate than you'd expect. Can't go wrong for the money, but that's my opinion. I reload 32 s&w long so after I used a case 5 or 6 times in my other 32s, I'll load them up for the nagant to officially ruin them. :D

I got my Romanian Tok from Century (I recommend you only get VG or Excellent condition from them), the Nagant(s) from AIM Surplus, and the CZ82 at a gun show. I want a CZ52 but I guess I don't want it bad enough or I'd have it already.

zxcvbob
August 28, 2009, 02:07 PM
It would be fun to qualify for CCW using a Nagant -- freak everybody out. :D

zxcvbob
August 28, 2009, 04:47 PM
I found directions for making Nagant brass out of cut-down .223's
http://shootersforum.com/showthread.htm?t=1327

That might bump it up a spot or two on my "list".

B. Lahey
August 28, 2009, 04:50 PM
the TT-33 is stronger.

Sorry, that's just wrong.

Reed's Custom makes a variety of CZ52-only ammunition that would turn a Tokarev into flying fragments. It's a stronger action and much more suitable for heavily loaded ammunition.

BobbyT
August 29, 2009, 03:27 AM
Star Modelo guys, I have a question. I've seen those for cheap but the deal breaker for me is the ammo. Right now I'm only interested in stuff that is either common, or if out of common use then so plentiful it's dirt cheap (ie 7.62x25).

Are there any .45s available?
I haven't come across anywhere that actually has a Sistema or Ballester-Molina, but those are the two I know of. I've heard of a Ballester-Rigaud, but never seen one.

Have they just all been grabbed up (understandably), or are there any C&R 1911s left?

zxcvbob
August 29, 2009, 08:44 AM
CZ52 has a stronger mechanism, but the barrel and chamber are severely weakened by the cut out made on the bottom for the rollers:
http://www.thehighroad.org/showpost.php?p=4889597&postcount=21

I'm not trying to start a p***ing match, just saying I'm looking for a TT33 or TTC rather than a '52. :cool:

B. Lahey
August 29, 2009, 04:41 PM
No worries, everyone should have both.:)

rick983
August 30, 2009, 12:37 PM
I want to be able to shoot surplus hot Bulgarian SMG ammo without worrying about the gun blowing up in my hand. CZ-52 has very thin chamber walls at the bottom, the TT-33 is stronger.

Bob;
Your above statement is not correct. Do not run hot loads thru the TT33, they are good guns but don't come close to the strength of the CZ52. The 7.62x25 represents one of the best shooting values around and is a blast to shoot. :)

AmmoSphere
August 30, 2009, 03:08 PM
I would get a .40 Cal, more power than a 9mm and not the recoil of a .45, it has that perfect balance.

jsmaye
August 31, 2009, 07:48 AM
The OP asked about C&R deals. There are no .40 caliber C&R weapons.

carguychris
August 31, 2009, 05:17 PM
I just sent in my C&R to SOG, Century Arms, and J&G Sales this morning. I'm looking for... a turn of the century S&W top-break .38 revolver
You can't order .38 top-breaks from major suppliers because they weren't used by any large military forces as a service sidearm on a large-scale basis. (.44s and .45s were, but I digress.) OTOH many top-breaks are considered legal Antiques and can be bought and sold without a FFL at all. :) More info here:

http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=358013

zxcvbob
August 31, 2009, 05:22 PM
I'm watching gunbroker.com for the top-break revolver. There are some nice H&R's there now. Not sure if I should get one, or wait for a S&W (I'm getting it for an occasional shooter, not just to hang on the wall)

jdscholer
September 4, 2009, 08:03 AM
With the top breaks, if you look at the Smiths along side almost any of the others you'll want the Smith. jd

Chris_B
September 11, 2009, 07:48 PM
Don't forget a Star Modello Super. Great shooter, looks like 1911, ammo available - 9mm largo.

kab

Got to say I agree with my Pop. I've shot his Star many times and it is overall a high quality pistol, very 'tight', and quite accurate. My only complaint is that some of the fiddly screws seem to be soft metal- poor heat treat cycle on some of the replacement fasteners maybe? Well two complaints- the grip threads have no bushings like a 1911 and if they strip its a PITA

Dimensionally it is the same as my 1911A1 in .45 ACP...and it was less than half the price of my 45

Tom2
September 11, 2009, 09:04 PM
Toks seem to me to have sort of a bizarro grip angle with an odd shape in the grip frame, or at least to me it feels like it is not just a great grip frame design. At least the CZ has a better feel to me. I have fired a Tok but not a CZ though, and that might be the difference. Some Toks had modified grips on the frames that fit the hand better, like for the Egyptian models. I would not buy another Tok myself. And the Russian revolvers, well they are kinda neat but up close most of them just look nasty.