View Full Version : 12ga questions & help
August 15, 2009, 02:12 PM
Ok Im looking for a 12ga shotgun new or used and I have a localy shop that is willing to work with me and help me out.
I have been looking at used ones on the net and have found a few Mossbergs for 229-269 from J&G sales. I like those but I think im not far off from a price of a new Mossberg 500.
I wanted to konw what other brands would you recomend in the price range of $300-$400 with the model name?
The guys that are going to help me find one are just now openning up shop and it will be a few months before they are open for FFL sales. Im fine with that as Im still working on putting the funds together.
The one guy told me that he bought a Mossberg pistol grip one due to it being cheaper and he could go ahead and spend the extra on the stock he wanted. I fine with doing that as well.
I like the good old plane stocks to the pistol grip six postion stocks.
So give me some advice on what to look for and what models. Im leaning heavy on Mossberg due to the price and all the accessories that are out there for them.
August 15, 2009, 02:42 PM
For the price i dont think the Mossberg 500 can be beat, i own the 12 and 20ga models. my 12 is fairly stock, it came with the wood furniture but i changed it to a pistol grip with buttstock, and synthetic forend. my 20ga is my HD gun, 18.5in barrel, pistol grip w/ top folding stock and flashlight laser combo. the 12ga model is extremely customizable, still in the $250 range and quality made. i also like them for their easy field stip ability, without the pistol grips you could easily take the gun down to bare bones in under 40 seconds
August 15, 2009, 03:00 PM
My suggestion is to buy a new field gun from walmart. Either cut that barrel to 18.5 if you want a dedicated house gun or buy a short barrel and keep the long one if you wish to hunt. The mossberg barrels are 90-120 new. I like a standard stock as it will do more for me than any other option. Right now the PG and PGO guns are selling for more than a standard stock equipped guns due to tacticool demand.
Often times a combo with a field barrel (usually 28 inch) and a 18.5 HD or 20-22 brush barrel will show up for under 300.
Model 500 is all you need.
August 15, 2009, 03:11 PM
also the amount of options for stocks and such that are available to you for a mossberg 500 are outstanding, the only thing is if you get a stock with a pistol grip I had some issues with the Knoxx stock that I put on mine
1) with the pistol grip on the stock actuating the safety is a pain in the rear gets some getting used to.
2) I had to put a file to one side of the aluminum block that seats the receiver to the stock because the powder coating on it caused the slide release to stick when you pressed it.
August 15, 2009, 04:10 PM
do you have an academy near you?
mossberg and remington 2 value pump shotguns. They are cheapies and since theres so many, you can find parts, accessories, etc, and people love them. not me. i hate them. but i understand why everyone else loves them though. so its ok to reccomend them
although, for $350 you can get one of these babies
August 15, 2009, 04:31 PM
Those are good prices just wish they where in VA. Im looking to make this my HD gun and just an all around battle shotgun.
Im looking at 20' & 18.5' barrels. I might check Wal-Mart and see what they have and see about changing the barrel out.
I want to work with the guys openning up shop as they are good guys and have helped me with other projects. Also I would like to help out the home town guys.
August 16, 2009, 09:13 AM
Check out the Pardner Protector (Rem 870 clone). $200 NIB and it's built like a tank.
All Remington 870 parts fit except the barrel.
I love mine.
August 16, 2009, 01:01 PM
Hey I will have to check that out. So is the gun an exact copy of the Remington 870 or is there differnces in it.
I know the Maveric 88 is differnt then the Mossberg 500. The safty is on the bottom where the Mossberg is on the top and parts for the most part differnt.
I will look into the Remington 870 copy as I would love to have an 870 but just can not go that high.
I guess if anyone has more info on the Pardner Protector 12ga copy please tell me more.
The guys at the shop are moving into a new building and they are keeping busy so when I have enough info and some more facts I will go in and see what they can find and help me on.
I like the net sell prices but would like to help a good set of guys and a good shop out. We have a few shops in our area but all are rude and these guys go back to the old ways of doing things.
August 16, 2009, 01:38 PM
Mossberg and their cheap little step daughter "Maverick", remington and their cheap little step daughter "Express" are the 2 low dough AMERICAN made guns. The pardner and all the 870 clones will be turkish or chinese KNOCK OFFS! Good? maybe? Imported knockoff crap? YEP!
August 16, 2009, 05:51 PM
I read as many reviews as I could before I bought my Pardner Protector.
What I found from countless hands-on experiences was that it has a better finish, stronger metal and better trigger guard than the 870 Express.
To my knowledge, the barrel and receiver, plus some other parts, are machined in China (under H&R specifications), the parts are then shipped over here and assembled.
If you look around even a little, you’ll see that the only real issue anyone has with this brand is that it’s not 100% American made (as you see in the fine example above). But you’ll have a hard time finding anyone that has an actual operational issue with the Pardner. Most everyone that has one will tell you that they have put 1,000’s of rounds through their Pardner and haven’t had one ‘failure to fire’ or ‘failure to extract’.
They range quite a bit in price depending on area. Some can go into their local store and pick one up for $140. I got mine for just over $200 out the door. Some have claimed they are $300+ in their area. Bud’s gun shop sells them online fairly regularly for $167 shipped (but you’ll need to pay an FFL to pick it up).
My decision was:
870 Express + 18” barrel
…actually, for the price of the Express and new barrel, I could have bought two Protectors. So, it was an easy choice for a cheap guy like me.
I ended up getting a Pardner Protector and a Knoxx SpecOps stock (look into those as well) and still ended up spending about $40 less than an 870 Express by itself.
Do as much research as you can. Use all of the models you’re considering if you can. And buy what’s best for you.
August 16, 2009, 07:20 PM
I can build a Chinese Harley clone kit of 126 cubes (factory is 80 or 102 inch)
Claiming 135 horses... For 12-15 k for various style. Or I can build the same type bike with american castings for 17-22K... Anyone willing to bet I depend on a chinese motor to to race others and do 3rd 4th or 5th gear burnouts? NOT ON MY LIFE!!!! I don't wanna feel 6 ounces of high velocity aluminum under high heat enter my chest when it frags... Sorry but my guns gotta be tuffer than the bikes!
August 16, 2009, 07:58 PM
Topic creator, do as much research as possible and get whats best for you.
Like I said, I think you'll find the Pardner is built like a tank (at least play with one in a store).
You can read countless positive reviews from people that have actually used them, or you can try to follow hotdogs well thought out metaphors.
No matter what, I wish you luck.
August 16, 2009, 08:08 PM
As long as the same folks who decry the demise of their town, American mfg., etc., all realize that when things are made to a really cheap price point, Americans lose jobs, and the typical products are really crap.....if you're comfortable and happy with that, then buy all the Chinese stuff you want......but PLEASE, do NOT come here and complain about how your gun broke, how Americans, trying to compete with that crap, turn out crap, or anything similar...........
August 16, 2009, 08:34 PM
Get a used 870 for about what that Chinese copy costs.
Buy ammo,use up repeat.
Or get a used 37, 1300 or even an old High Standard.
American made pump shotguns like these last generations, not years.
And the cost per use is fractions of a cent.
August 16, 2009, 11:36 PM
Im here just trying to get enough info and find a great shotgun at a good price. I like Remingtons and Mossberg models so Im looking there and looking at others that given.
I cant find any good deals in my area on used shotguns they will run the price of a new one.
I think I can get a Mossberg 500 from the local shop for 300-350 range. I did find one at J&G that was 229 and another one that is 269.
The used 12ga here will run over that. I did find an old sears model cant remember the name on it and it was 175. That was back at christmas time and I should have bought it. They now run right at 300 used around here.
Im leaning heavy to Mossberg and not only due to the parts out on the market but the price.
August 17, 2009, 04:39 AM
I prefer the mossberg 500 for the safety location as well as action release tab location.
August 17, 2009, 09:18 AM
A shotgun is a point and shoot weapon, and how it fits you is important. I have no experience with the Pardner pump but have owned and shot a lot of different shotguns (trap, skeet, and hunting) try as many as possible and get a quality one that fits you and it should last a life time. Good luck : Bill :cool:
August 17, 2009, 10:52 AM
A Mossberg 500 or a Remington 870 Express, very reasonable priced for the quality and dependability you get. You may save a few bucks with Chinese knock-offs but your life may depend on it someday....ain't worth the gamble to me.
August 17, 2009, 01:10 PM
Im going to look at all that I can and get a hands on feel for them as well. Im also reading and looking around and reading as much as I can.
I know you guys will not like the CD shotguns but tell me any ways.
I think im going to go with the Mossberg 500 and if its cheaper I might get the pistol grip one and then order the stock I want.
Tell me about the folding stocks side and top folding ones. Also tell me about the six postion stocks.
I have seen these stocks at I think centerfire systems. I think they range in price 39-59 not bad but probly not the best.
I do like the rifle stock and I like the ones that hold extra shells. I cant think right now what they are called. I think speed feed?
Well more info guys you are giving me a lot to look at and if you know of more brands that would be great as well.
This will be a home deffense gun and one for if the shtf lol I want a solid gun.
I do have a Winchester 1300 in 20ga its the last of the real winchester and I wish it would have been a 12ga but I cant look back.
August 17, 2009, 01:28 PM
this is the top folding stock i have used in the past, its really solid and easy to use, im ordering another pretty soon for one of my new guns. http://www.combatstocks.com/Choate_Mossberg_500_600_590_Top_folder.cfm
this stock is solid but its not much for dampening recoil
August 18, 2009, 11:36 AM
Mossbergs are very nice guns, I think you’ll be happy with it.
Regarding stocks, specifically six-position stocks, I would suggest you pass on the ATI version and spend a little extra on the Knoxx SpecOps ($100) or if you've got the money, the Mesa Tactical stock ($250+).
I have the Knoxx (Rem 870) on my Pardner Protector and couldn’t be happier with it. The adjustable LOP is great for me (3rd position at the range, 1st position for home defense) and my wife (1st position at all times). And the recoil-reduction takes off enough that you can go through 100+ shells without feeling it in the morning. It’s not going to feel like your shooting a .22 like some people claim, but it takes the edge off and reduces muzzle jump. The pistol grip is great on it and I like the look of the forend it comes with.
But if you don't have the same need I do with a stock that has to adjust between two people, you might be better off with a speed-feed stock with a limbsaver pad. I haven't priced it, but that may be a cheaper option for you.
August 18, 2009, 11:56 AM
CAS shooters fire more rounds per month than most do per year. A lot of them use Chinese guns. I have a Norinco 97 and it's just as good as anything made here. Don't bash'em til you try'em.
August 18, 2009, 12:08 PM
Clay target shooters tend to shoot in the thousands, most averaging 2,000 or more per month. Cheap Chinese stuff wouldn't last. There's a reason you see the guns you do at those shoots - because they work, over and over and over without fail
August 18, 2009, 12:20 PM
+1 on what OneOunce said - and the same goes for anything else made in China ( like major woodworking tools - say an 18" bandsaw ) ..... in general they are crap ..... bad steel, bad castings, supect motors, poor electrical switches, etc .....
Nobody I know has put 100,000 shells thru a gun made in China ( or Turkey, etc on these low end guns ) that has held up - compared to anything made by Miroku for Browning like a Citori XS Skeet that only retails for around $ 3K / its a heck of a lot of gun for the money ( its not a Perazzi, or a Kolar or Krieghoff ) but its a good value. And its a 3 generation gun at least -even after its fired 100,000 shells in my opinion.
I don't need to buy a chinese or turkish made gun - to see how many of them break around the clubs I frequent .....way before 100,000 shells.
August 18, 2009, 03:45 PM
Im looking at all ideas and info on them all made in the US or not. I have looked at a few its not much more to go with a Mossberg made in the US.
I like the looks of them all and Im sure no matter what they are good guns that are made outside the US.
I think Im going to go with a Mossberg 500 when I buy unless I find something differnt.
August 18, 2009, 04:02 PM
is there a place where you can live that you buy guns locally? like a classifieds? id comb the pawn shops, gun shops and local online classifieds and look for a good Mossberg 500. Expect to pay around 185-250. I wouldn't pay anymore for a used 500. Then get a ton of shells, download a Mossberg 500 owner's manual and go shoot. Shoot the hell out of it. Then go on youtube and learn how to disassemble and re-assemble your gun. Repeat. Then decide where you want to go from there. I wouldn't bother with any tactical accessories until you've familiarized yourself pretty heavily with how the gun is operated and maintained.
August 18, 2009, 04:29 PM
Florida is such a place... FTF sales require no paperwork...
August 18, 2009, 05:52 PM
Im in Virginia ane we can do face to face but most of the time the guns have all the bells on it and its over what I want to pay.
The local shop that is going to be open for FFL sales soon are friends of mine so they will help me find what Im looking for and at a good deal.
These are good guys that have worked in shops before and are ex-military. The one guy bought a pistol grip shotgun and then got the stock he wanted. That was his cheapest way at the time to get what he wanted.
I do order off the net a lot and use pawn shops. The pawn shops for used guns are high right now.
I went in before the election and their was a used AR I came close to buying it had all the retro parts on it. I say this was a early 80s maybe late 70s AR-15 for like 600 bucks. I went in right after the election 900 bucks and it sold.
They are not getting that the feeding frenzy is over they still think its like that.
I like the mossberg and will go with one I think. Thanks everyone and keep the info coming.
August 18, 2009, 06:08 PM
You can't go wrong with an 870 or 500. There are other brands and great guns don't get me wrong, btu those are far and away the easiest to find parts and support for. I prefer the Mosssberg because of it's ergonomics/layout and because it's the most convenient for me to take down. They also have the edge on remington in customer service imo, and Remington has VERY good customer service. I would not turn down an 870 and may own another one in the future.
August 21, 2009, 12:04 AM
If you are looking at a Mossberg 500, I would highly, Highly, HIGHLY recommend the Mossberg 835 Ultimag. I have it and am VERY happy with it. Check it out, and talk to your buddies about getting you one. I definitely think it's worth any difference in price from the 500.
I like the option of shooting 3 1/2" shells when needed, and the reliability is unmatched in any of my friends' shotguns. Look into it, and I can vouch for it's performance!!!
August 21, 2009, 12:43 AM
870 Tactical. It comes with a rifled barrell, folding or full stock w/ pistol grip. Ive put every shell known to man from magnum upland game shot to slugs it will chew on anything. The 870 is a staple of americana.....how could the cops be wrong!
August 21, 2009, 12:49 PM
The 500 fits my budget right now and I love the Remington as well but the 500 is right in my budget.
Im still looking around for used as well as new but no such luck as of right now. I can find used on the net but still Mossberg is in my range.
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