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View Full Version : New to IPSC, looking for entry level set up, please help a Newb


HKFan9
June 1, 2009, 10:55 AM
Well I'm going to be 23 and I have basically given up rifle shooting for my new found love pistol shooting. I was recently invited to go to a local IPSC match that is coming up. I don't know too much about it, and obviously never have been. I've been reading up and found you can go with a service pistol and 4 mags. I'm am currently listing to sell my USP so I asked a buddy if I could borrow his M&P 9mm with 4 mags and he said its no problem. So I was thinking of shooting the M&P this first time to get a feel for things and it definitely looks like something I want to pursue further. So here are my questions.

Firearms: personally I prefer 9mm, keeps the cost and the recoil down, I was thinking the Springfield 1911 in 9mm, but the question was if 4 mags of single stack would hold enough rounds for these competitions, again, I don't know how it works really. I see these guys running around with custom double stack pistols so I wasn't sure if a single stack 9mm would hold enough rounds.

Also was considering a CZ -75 maybe, I've also heard good and bad things about the EAA's, good being their entry level MATCH gun.

I'm not looking to drop 1000's on a custom 1911, but I would prefer to have a nice steel framed 9mm, any thoughts or opinions would be great.:rolleyes:

oldkim
June 1, 2009, 07:19 PM
Don't worry about getting a gun right now. As you are new you might want to just do what you have planned - use your buddies 9mm and have fun. Focus right now how the game is played and what niche you want to go for.

Look and see what the "experts or masters" are shooting. Just know to bring lots of ammo. Focus on safety and what the game plan is for each scenario. Watch and learn.

Before committing to a gun and spending your hard earned money play it out. Go to a few matches before deciding. You may be sorry about your choice if you buy one now as it may not "fit" what you need to do with it.

Overall, have fun and enjoy!

Strick
June 1, 2009, 07:38 PM
There are so many choices in classes to shoot, Production, Single Stack, Limited, Limited 10, Open, then you have majpr or minor power factor. You also have IDPA if that is available in your area and they have multiple classes as well (ESP, SSP, CDP).

With all those choices and possibilities you are better off going to a few matches and get an understanding of the rules and classes before you start thinking about buying something. If ou run out now to get something I can almost guarantee you will not e happy with it in 6 months.

If you can borrow a M&P for now that is a great choice to shoot IPSC Production (4 mags might be a little tight though) since everybody gets scored minor. It is also a very good pistol for IDPA. Go shoot, have fun, ask questions and get hooked.

rduckwor
June 2, 2009, 11:40 AM
Get your buddy's M&P and go for it. Most USPSA stages have a 32 round limit. My son shoots an M&P 9MM and gets by with four mags typically.

You should find an IDPA match and try it as well. The stages are typically shorter, less complicated and specify defensive cover use.

Both are great fun.

RMD

RickB
June 2, 2009, 02:18 PM
The M&P is becoming a pretty popular option in USPSA Production division. You may find that it's the gun for you. Another gun that is not really all that popular in USPSA Production (yet), but which I see most often in the hands of better shooters, is the CZ SP01. It can be used in Production, Limited, or Limited 10 (as can the M&P, for that matter).
The 9mm 1911 is sort of niche competition gun, as it's really only the hot ticket in IDPA Enhanced Service Pistol division, where minor power factor (9mm) is not a shortcoming. For USPSA Single Stack or Limited 10, you really want to be shooting major (.40 or .45).
Four, ten-round mags on the belt is usually enough, so a total of five mags mags is good, and six is better; one in the gun, four on the belt, and the "barney mag" in your pocket.

Steviewonder1
June 2, 2009, 09:58 PM
The gun and mags sound fine, however unless you can hit and knock down steel easily and accurately, you may need more than 4 mags. In a 32 round course, there could be 6-10 steel targets. That is fine, but if you miss some you may be out of ammo at the end of the course of fire. Years ago in my beginning, I could go thru 30-40 rounds to get thru a long field course. In IDPA you will not need more than 18 rounds per course. In IPSC I use either a Para 16-40 with 5 18 round mags or a G35 with 5 19 round mags.
Good Luck and Have Fun, I have and continue to do so!

lmccrock
June 3, 2009, 09:10 AM
For USPSA Single Stack or Limited 10, you really want to be shooting major (.40 or .45).
While USPSA Single Stack was created to allow a standard single stack 1911 a place to compete, they allow a capacity of 10 rounds for minor (9mm or lightly loaded 40), but only 8 rounds for major (typically 40 or 45 loaded up). So there is a place for a 9mm 1911 because you do get the extra rounds.

Not sure which M&P model, but if it has mags with capacity greater than 10 rounds, in USPSA, you can load them up, shoot in Limited, and not worry about running out. 9mm is not ideal for Limited, but for your first match, load up the mags and have fun.

Lee

Don Gwinn
June 3, 2009, 11:08 AM
Shoot the M&P and have fun. Don't bother trying to game the rules; it isn't going to make any difference your first time anyway. You're not going to screw up and accidentally bring a gun that's not fun to shoot the match with, so relax and go enjoy yourself.

Para Bellum
June 3, 2009, 03:10 PM
Glock 19. All you need.

cschwanz
June 6, 2009, 03:42 PM
i am in your EXACT situation myself. I have been to one match to just watch and will probably check out another in the near future. use what you have access to in the way of a gun. For me thats my XD or my soon to be 1911(im buying it for a carry purpose but will use it for comps to get used to shooting it). I have no doubt i will enjoy practical shooting and will probably invest some money in a new setup later down the road.

MGMorden
June 10, 2009, 04:20 PM
Sorry to hijack a (slightly) older thread, but I had an interest in this one too.

Just out of curiosity, how many rounds should one bring to a typical match? I here "a lot" and "plenty" batted about, but that varies depending on whose thinking about the question :).

So are we talking 100 rounds? 250? 500?

Ammo is so hard to find right now that I'd likely be loading my own (got lots of components stored up) - on a single stage press, so I'd like to know ahead of time just how much time I have to spend in the shed in a Carolina summer :).

Also, I've got several guns, but finding something to actually shoot competition with is tricky. My 1911 is just picky as heck - needs to go to a smith before I'd use it (it jams once every few mags). I've got a SIG P6 that I like, but it only holds 8 rounds per mag which would likely hamper me a lot in Production class (and from what I've heard shooting 9mm outside of production isn't too viable). I've got a CZ-82 but I'm not sure if 9mm Makarov even makes the "floor" for minor.

About all that I'm left with that I think would be workable for production division is a Ruger P-95DA. Reliable gun - 15 round mags. Not the most accurate gun in the stable, but I'd mostly just be going to have fun rather than seriously expect to win anything. Just making sure - I won't get laughed off the range for bringing a Ruger P-95 right? :)

perpster
June 10, 2009, 04:56 PM
Good questions!

lmccrock
June 11, 2009, 07:12 AM
How many rounds depends on the match. Typical club match is about 125-150 rounds; check with the club. You would need more in case something goes wrong and you need to reshoot a stage.

No one will laugh you off the range with a Ruger. Again, check with the club, but the max round count will be 32 or so for one stage, so you need at least 4 10-round mags (having a spare for a total of 5 is better), to shoot in Production or Limited 10. If you choose to shoot in Limited, then you can load up the mags to full capacity (if that is greater than 10). For fun, sometimes I have loaded my Glock 17 mags and run in Limited.

9mm Mak may not make power floor, however, 9x19 is the minimum physical cartridge size. That is USPSA, not sure about IPSC.

Lee

Hunter Customs
June 11, 2009, 07:56 AM
Here's a good set-up, custom built Para in 40 cal with four 21 round mags. This is a good gun for limited 10 and limited divisions.
Also have a complete 9mm topend with high cap mags for this pistol.
The 9mm topend makes practice cheaper and is also great if you want to compete in steel matches.
Regards
Bob Hunter
www.huntercustoms.com

http://www.huntercustoms.com/images/01132009-B.JPG

SavageMOA
June 16, 2009, 04:02 PM
I'm a new guy as well, and I just bought a set-up for myself for relatively cheap.

-M&P40
-6 magazines (Came with 2, got 2 free with the rebate, and bought 2 cheap)
-CR Speed belt
-Bladetech DOH (dropped and offset holster)
-Bianchi mag pouches (cheap but they work well for a beginner)

All of this cost me about $700 with the gun being about $550.

As far as the amount of ammo you'll shoot, I always bring 200 rounds to the match, but rarely shoot more than 125. I bring extra because after the match, I can sometimes re-shoot stages for practice.

Trust me, IPSC shooting is the most fun you can have with your clothes on!

oldkim
June 16, 2009, 04:06 PM
It's always good to bring as much as you can - a case would really cover all of it.

But it really depends on what type of shooting and with what.

IDPA typically will be no more than 150 rounds
USPSA will run about 200-250 but again depends on what you shoot and what division.

And then you can factor in if you are shooting multiple guns.
So, it's safe to say at least 250 but more the merrier since you can always shoot it another day.

Ken O
June 16, 2009, 08:46 PM
The round count is different for each club. It depends on how many stages they set up. One IDPA club I shoot at is about 80, another I shoot at is close to 200. The ISPC clubs I shoot are in the 150-200 range.

I take 250 rounds, because a large stage can have things that go wrong and you might have a re-shoot. For example, a windy day a target or popper could get blown over while your shooting.

I agree with the posts above, don't worry about which gun you think you have to have right now. Take whatever you have, shoot it, and get a feel for what your next gun might be.

BobbyT
June 17, 2009, 06:20 PM
CZ 75? I have this urge to grab a CZ 52 and show up with that.

Would that just be downright obnoxious of me...? :cool:

lmccrock
June 18, 2009, 05:54 AM
Would that just be downright obnoxious of me...?CZ-52 is 7.62x25, right? USPSA has a 9mm minimum. They may let a newcomer shoot, though. Not sure about IDPA.

As for obnoxious, 7.62x25 got nothin' on a USPSA Open gun, where powders are chosen to INCREASE muzzle blast because it works the comp better. :D

Lee

BobbyT
June 18, 2009, 06:06 AM
Well the energy level on the 7.62x25 is on par with a .40 or .45, but I guess it would depend on how they determine "minimum" caliber, since a size-favoring metric like power factor would have the Tok coming up short.

Drawing a clunky old communist gun from a flap holster wouldn't exactly be elegant, but the idea of running through a competitive pistol course with a 17-1800 fps flamethrower just seems wickedly appealing.

lmccrock
June 18, 2009, 07:08 AM
From the USPSA rulebook
Minimum bullet caliber / cartridge case length = .38 cal. / 9x19 mm (0.354” x 0.748”)

Caliber is bullet diameter. So, 9mm Makarovs and .380 are below minimum as well due to case length. 7.62x25 makes power factor, but not the minimum caliber, kindof like my Automag III in 30 carbine. :D

Lee

arkieron
July 5, 2009, 06:55 PM
Being new to Pactical shooting, I brought my 92 Beretta. It seems to me that the hammerless pistols (with very modified triggers) have the advantage of all shots having the same great trigger. I have a D spring in my 92 but it still has significant trigger pull on the double action shot. I examined a Glock today . The trigger was as light as my Model 17 S&W revolver, which is under 2 lb s/A. I love the 9mm hammer guns but the odds seemed stacked when the first shot has to be DA. Am I wrong?

Strick
July 5, 2009, 07:13 PM
Are you wrong? Well the old "it depends" is about all I can say. No matter which you use it still comes down to sights and trigger. There are guys that run with all the other top shooters, beating them on the national stage, using 92's. Personally I think the biggest mistake newer shooters make is jumping from a gun they are familiar with and shoot comfortably to what others are shooting thinking that is the difference.

Don Gwinn
July 5, 2009, 07:52 PM
Custom Paras and all are really neat and all, but I repeat: shoot what you have. Show up with what you've got, ask what division it's legal for, and sign up for that division.

Custom whatever's are nice to have, but you have no need to think about such things when you first start. The rules are about the gun, but the game is about the shooter. That's you.

WESHOOT2
July 13, 2009, 06:41 AM
My Springfield Armory 1911 in 9x19 works with eight mags.

My EAA Witnesses (three, in 9x19, 9x21, 40 S&W, 41 AE, and 45 ACP) all work exceedingly well with at least six mags for any chambering.

Bring any reliable gun in any scoring chambering; bring six magazines.

oldkim
July 13, 2009, 08:22 PM
Here's a perfect find for you. The link has pictures. I know the guy and he's a master at USPSA and IDPA. Let him know Young sent you. :cool:



CZ 75B
-Competition sights (Front/Rear)
-Competition hammer
-Trigger work done by Springer Precision somewhere around 6-7lb DA/ 3lb SA
-Stainless Mag Break
-Thin Aluminum grips
-Houge fingerlock grips
-6x 16 round magazines (2 w/ bumper pads)
-Blade Tech Holster w/ teklok
-Blade Tech dual mag pouch w/teklok
-Original box/papers

$750 for the entire package. This gun is ready for Competition or carry with a trigger that can only be rivaled by a 1911. All work was done by Scott at Springer Precision.

http://www.seattleguns.org/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=6204&sid=56c29ce0b0a29a614d8fe41ea2043e62