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View Full Version : Mosin Nagant or Mauser 98?


fast-eddie
March 28, 2009, 02:53 AM
I'm in the market for a milserp bolt rifle, what do you guys prefer. The Nagant seems cheaper to shoot than the Mouser, but there is a mouser 98 with a good barrell at my local store for pretty cheap. Nagants are getting more scarce it seems.

freakintoguns
March 28, 2009, 02:55 AM
i wanna pick up a couple 3 or 4 nagants, simply because theyre so cheap. but im also interested in turnin one into a brush/truck gun witha syn stock and 20" barrel, scope etc

aeonrevolution
March 28, 2009, 03:03 AM
I'm guessing you're buying this in person.

If you go with a Mosin make sure you check the barrel. Some may seem as if they're brand new, while others will be pitted to hell.

ChicagoTex
March 28, 2009, 03:33 AM
The Nagant is still a huge bargain, but if I could get a Mauser 98k in decent shape for Nagant money, I'd absolutely jump on it. It's more ergonomic and (usually) more precisely made.

as for their respective ammo (8mm Mauser vs 7.62x54R) it's pretty much a wash performance-wise, though there seems to be a lot more cheap 7.62x54 surplus ammo out there (just be careful, a lot of it's corrosive) if ammo cost is a concern.

As a sidenote, Mauser stripper clips work much better than Nagant clips, if that matters to you.

fast-eddie
March 28, 2009, 04:18 AM
Thanks for the input, I think I'm going to buy the Mouser, it is Nagant cheap, and the ammo prices aren't
that much different to sway me in any direction.

bessemerbob
March 28, 2009, 10:24 AM
Mauser actions are some of the best all time. Copied and used to this day!

chris in va
March 28, 2009, 10:57 AM
Mouser.
http://img27.imageshack.us/img27/7753/wildcatg.jpg (http://img27.imageshack.us/my.php?image=wildcatg.jpg)

Mauser.
http://img4.imageshack.us/img4/3494/k98rescaledforweb.jpg (http://img4.imageshack.us/my.php?image=k98rescaledforweb.jpg)

:D

Hind_MI24
March 28, 2009, 11:02 AM
I have two Mosins. I Russian M44, and a M91/30 Mosin. They both shoot dead on. The M44 was a 60 dollar gun show special with a rough stock and pitted bore.

Shoots fine though. The M91 was perfect with a perfect barrel and its shoots fine.

Distortion
March 28, 2009, 11:42 AM
Yeah, I got a couple '01 mousers real cheap (free), but you have to figure in cost of maintanence and upkeep. They were both broke (got 'em fixed) and one (the boy) got kidney stones and had to go to the vet. Then there's the cost of ammo (food). Them mousers like their ammo every day.

Believe me, Mosins and Mausers will both be cheaper in the long run. :D

FrankenMauser
March 28, 2009, 01:44 PM
Yeah, I got a couple '01 mousers real cheap (free), but you have to figure in cost of maintanence and upkeep. They were both broke (got 'em fixed) and one (the boy) got kidney stones and had to go to the vet. Then there's the cost of ammo (food). Them mousers like their ammo every day.

Believe me, Mosins and Mausers will both be cheaper in the long run.

Agreed.

I have 4 Mousers, 1 Mauser, and 1 Mosin. The Mauser and Mosin are much cheaper to feed.


...I think I'm going to buy the Mouser, it is Nagant cheap,...

Sounds like a Yugo 24/47 (not a 98k). They are very good rifles, but have a unique action length. If you ever intend to throw a new stock on it, you'll be shelling out the cash; with one exception. -There are a handfull of M48 stocks on the market, that can be modified to accept the 24/47 action.-
Triggers and sights for any 98k will fit without a problem, but anything reliant on the standard action length will be a no-go.

Axel357
March 28, 2009, 02:13 PM
I have one Mauser M48, two Mosin 91/30s, and one mouser.


I enjoy shooting the first two equally, but the wife'd kill me if I shot the third. I haven't bought ammo for either in some months, but I recall the difference in the two not being very much. Both are good rifles, so get the one that feels and looks better to you.

bessemerbob
March 28, 2009, 02:33 PM
Axel is dead on, pick up both hold them get to feel them and pick the one that feels right to you........

Im still leaning towards the K98!

fast-eddie
March 28, 2009, 02:51 PM
Alright, eventually I am going to get both, but right now just one. :(

I Also had a cat named Mauser for a while, than he became a neighborhood cat, He like to eat chili. (he was an oudoor cat)

Axel357
March 28, 2009, 02:53 PM
A cat named Mauser who likes to eat chili :p That's pretty funny. My parents' cat eats green olives like they're candy.

Get a K98 first. They seem slightly less plentiful in supply right now.

Mr Odd Six
March 28, 2009, 03:46 PM
I was going to get a MN, but the mil surp ammo is getting so old, its not worth my time to shoot it. With 5-600 fps drops in pressure, I wont bet my life on it.

I went with a Mauser, becuase I can reload CHEAPLY for it.

It also kills mousers nicely too

sniperinky
March 28, 2009, 03:50 PM
Dude, go with the Mosin. Mine shoots 2" at 600 meters. Trust me;), you won't be disapointed.

ChicagoTex
March 28, 2009, 04:00 PM
Mine shoots 2" at 600 meters.

Skeptical ChicagoTex is skeptical.

Shorthair
March 28, 2009, 04:05 PM
I had a dog named Mauser. RIP, buddy.
http://i214.photobucket.com/albums/cc63/gspdave45/Maus.jpg

OLNfan
March 28, 2009, 04:06 PM
Iv got a swedish mauser thats been spoterized and I love it. very accurate got a buck with it last season, cant complain. I love the rifle. My friend just picked up a spoterized mosin for 100 bucks (cdn) plus a box of ammo, GREAT deal so I would just suggest find a deal on either or.

sniperinky
March 28, 2009, 04:46 PM
You can be skeptical ChicagoTex, but that doesn't change how she shoots. I'm talking about the real deal a Tula Sniper Mosin.

ChicagoTex
March 28, 2009, 04:58 PM
You can be skeptical ChicagoTex, but that doesn't change how she shoots. I'm talking about the real deal a Tula Sniper Mosin.

Even so, 2" at 600 meters is nigh-impossible. How many rounds is the group?

You're also being a little misleading, as the Nagant the OP is considering would be nowhere near as well-built as yours.

sniperinky
March 28, 2009, 05:00 PM
10 shot group letting the barrel cool between rounds.

.300 Weatherby Mag
March 28, 2009, 06:14 PM
Mine shoots 2" at 600 meters.

BS w/o pics and signed statements from a min. of 3 witnesses!!!!!!!!!

44 AMP
March 28, 2009, 07:18 PM
2" at 600 meters. Thats 1/3 MOA. Never heard of a Mosin Nagant that was in the bencrest class for accuracy. Or even close. 10 shots in 2 inches at 600 meters? WOW!

Please give us the details of the rifle, ammo, and how many matches you have won with that tremendous shooter!

Funeralfog
March 28, 2009, 07:55 PM
save some money and get a Mosin, ammos is cheap, and the rifle is cheap. i have both but i'd rather dirty up my Mosin than my Mauser. both excellent rifles so you cant go wrong either way

sbc1320
March 28, 2009, 09:53 PM
I have my dad's bringback which is a dou. 44 K98 German Mauser. He took it straight from the crate in a German warehouse. Unfortunately he cut the stock down in length and width. I kept the original stock and put it in another stock from Norway. I would say the metal is about 98% and yes the bolt matches. I have cared for this gun since I was about 10-12 years of age and I am now 49 years old. Dad passed on about 2 years back. Hope you like this picture.

snipecatcher
March 28, 2009, 10:20 PM
Dude, go with the Mosin. Mine shoots 2" at 600 meters. Trust me, you won't be disapointed.

10 shots

Why do people make claims like this in a GUN FORUM full of ENTHUSIASTS? This may fly in the presence of the uninformed, but did you really expect anyone here to believe that? Honestly.

Buzzcook
March 28, 2009, 10:55 PM
...2" at 600 meters...10 shot group letting the barrel cool between rounds.

I'm always impressed by how well the people on this forum shoot.
If I could shoot half that well I'd change my name to Natty Bumppo.

ndking1126
March 28, 2009, 11:03 PM
Get the Mauser as they are not as plentiful. My gun shop always has 2 rows of different types of Mosins.. Mausers are harder to find (at least around here).

paladin-34
March 28, 2009, 11:32 PM
I have two mousers a 98 and a yugo and one mosen. The mousers have seen better days but the yugo will give the mosen a run for its money. But the mouser is the gun that started it all, THE FIRST bolt action! The mosen is just a cheap copy, designed for fast build and longer tool life to get pitch forks out of the hands of the Russian army. My mosin is also a peace of history but the gun I would take hunting in the rain. Because of its price its also the gun that most kids show up with at the range.

Joe

Ignition Override
March 29, 2009, 12:07 AM
As for good prices, visited the Gander Mt. in Saginaw, MI three days ago, just east of Fashion Square Mall.
They had about four MN 91/30s, each listed at $89, and they looked good at first glance. Much better than those at our gun shows.
People can not mount scopes on most MNs unless a gunsmith 'bends' the bolt.

Gander has a 10% discount now on some items.
Did not check the MNs very closely, being distracted by a new, general imitation of a LE "Jungle Carbine" ($600). The friendly staff don't know when they will receive any MN 44s.

fast-eddie
March 29, 2009, 02:29 AM
I was picking off Elk off of my back porch with my Red Ryder at 750 yards out.
The fact that I had to hit them in the eye made it a little tougher, but you can't make it too easy on yourself.

Cpl Punishment
March 29, 2009, 05:54 AM
Either one can be good or either one can suck.

Don't believe the hype: we're at the bottom of the barrel with regards to Mausers, and there are some real dogs out there.

Point being, check both out thoroughly.

Both have fairly cheap surplus available, fairly cheap commercial available, both can be handloaded. Pick the one you like best.

The Yugo 24/47s are fine, so long as you want to keep it the way it is, and not change stocks and whatnot.

Cpl Punishment
March 29, 2009, 05:55 AM
BTW 2", 10-shot groups at 600 meters is easy.

Shoot 100 rounds, find 10 that are within 2", circle them, call the rest "called fliers". That's how gun magazines make a piece of ka-ka, pooh-pooh (****) sound like The Gun To Have.

chadwimc
March 29, 2009, 06:12 AM
" Dude, go with the Mosin. Mine shoots 2" at 600 meters. Trust me, you won't be disapointed."

Man! I'd put that on YouTube!!! That way you could bet all the skeptics big money and clean up!!!

Jon-m
March 29, 2009, 06:15 AM
heres an interesting video of someone shooting 600 yards with a nagent. don't know about 2 inch groups though...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vDIypxgwzXs

sniperinky
March 29, 2009, 09:31 AM
No one here that has fraction of the training I do. I don't appreciate being called a liar. Before you start a flame war perhaps you should really evaluate your level of training and think real hard about your own abilities. Jealousy is an ugly thing.

sniperinky
March 29, 2009, 09:40 AM
2" at 600 meters. Thats 1/3 MOA. Never heard of a Mosin Nagant that was in the bencrest class for accuracy. Or even close. 10 shots in 2 inches at 600 meters? WOW!

It's actually better than that since a meter is longer than a yard. The trick is very fine handloading and repeatable, consistant sandbagging.

Shorthair
March 29, 2009, 10:01 AM
No one here that has fraction of the training I do. I don't appreciate being called a liar. Before you start a flame war perhaps you should really evaluate your level of training and think real hard about your own abilities. Jealousy is an ugly thing.
Well, since you brought it up, please provide us your riflery CV, there Quigley. :rolleyes:
That's a pretty bold ass statement. The only thing worse than jealousy here in my opinion is a blowhard who make outrageous claims and then gets sand in his panties when called to task on it. So.... care to let us all admire your resume or are you just gonna whine?
It's actually better than that since a meter is longer than a yard. The trick is very fine handloading and repeatable, consistant sandbagging.
See, this is just plain arrogance. I'd bet there are some members here who've forgotten more about shooting and reloading in the past 6 months than you've had a chance to yet learn.
EDIT: Holy crap, I see from your profile you make claim as to being a Marine, a gunny even. Let's make this clear, it perfectly legitimate as a Marine to brag about your shooting skills, your prowess with the women, and you're ability to take any objective, its what we do. But you make us all look bad when you insult people in cyberspace you've never met. So up with the resume or STFU.

Axel357
March 29, 2009, 10:09 AM
No one here that has fraction of the training I do...Jealousy is an ugly thing.

So is ignorance ;). Glad to see you've evaluated the training of every other member here.

Fact is, no matter how "elite" you are, the standard Mosin isn't capable of that kind of accuracy by sheer engineering and build standards. Its not a "match grade" rifle by any means.

I don't care if you're Carlos-fing-Hathcock. There's always limitations to the tools you use no matter how good a job you do behind the trigger. To shoot a 2" 600 meter group with a Mosin would require some skill, yes, but I'd also say you found the leprechaun's pot-o-gold :rolleyes:.

sniperinky
March 29, 2009, 10:55 AM
I find it so amazing that instead of learning from an expert people would rather call someone else a liar and perpetuate their own ignorance. I've got nothing to prove and I don't have to put up with these insults. say la vee

Shorthair
March 29, 2009, 10:59 AM
I find it so amazing that instead of learning from an expert people would rather call someone else a liar and perpetuate their own ignorance. I've got nothing to prove and I don't have to put up with these insults. say la vee
Well, you have so far. I'm an expert. My 4 year old is an expert. Any clown can call himself an expert about anything. So, instead of whining, tell us from whence you claim your expertise or quit whining that everyone here is insulting your arrogant butt.

Axel357
March 29, 2009, 11:05 AM
I find it so amazing that instead of learning from an expert people would rather call someone else a liar and perpetuate their own ignorance. I've got nothing to prove and I don't have to put up with these insults. say la vee

Look guy, this is the internet. We're not at the range watching a demonstration. We've all seen our share of sixteen year olds who come in trolling claiming to be Force Recon snipers etc. Got to take things with a grain of salt and what you're saying is close to rediculous. Like Shorthair said, we're all experts unless you can prove your claims. No insults meant, just look at it from our point of view.

Shorthair
March 29, 2009, 11:13 AM
Hey Axel, I just read all of his posts. I doubt he's even 12, and I apologize to the forum for wasting bandwidth calling his dumb a** out..
FWIW, back on thread, I am a Mauser junkie, and I can't gin up any love at all for Mosins. None, not one bit, so my advice to OP would be full of my opinion and personal preference with little room for objectivity.

sniperinky
March 29, 2009, 11:59 AM
Shorthair, consider yourself reported for violating rules #2 and #3. I fully expect the moderators to respect my first and second ammendment rights. Also consider yourself on ignore, but I suspect that wont matter too much. Perhaps you will see the light one day and we can have a laugh about it over a beer.

2) Language that would be inappropriate in the polite company of strangers is quite unwelcome here.
3) No spamming, trolling, flaming or other personal attacks, be they acrimonious or veiled in humor. If you take issue with a Member's position, by all means speak your mind. If you have a problem with a Member's religion, creed, national origin, sex, politics, associations or personal hygiene

sniperTHEMAGNANIMOUSinky

Shorthair
March 29, 2009, 12:15 PM
Ok, so you're not a Marine. You whine way too much.
You come here spouting garbage, get taken to task on it, and respond by whining about requests to back up your ridiculous claims. There are many, many people on this board who deserve the utmost in respect for their knowledge and decency, (I may not be one of them) but you have merely come off as a pompous, self-important, immature child.
If the moderators consider anything I've said a personal attack consider me banned.

Ignition Override
March 29, 2009, 01:42 PM
Come on guys....it looks like the abrasive language found under gun videos on Youtube.

Why not address each other as if in person?

Shorthair
March 29, 2009, 02:02 PM
My apologies to the forum for the distraction.
Why not address each other as if in person?
This is exactly how I would address him in person, and I'm sure others would as well. I'm out of this thread, again, I apologize for my lack of tolerance.

sniperinky
March 29, 2009, 02:07 PM
Tell you what Shorthair. Name the time and place and bring your best rifle. Name the bet, but make it worth my while. Winner takes prize and the looser not only coughs up cash, but resigns from the forum in disgrace. Offer's open to anyone who called me a liar.:rolleyes:

Put you're money where you're mouth is.

Para Bellum
March 29, 2009, 02:26 PM
don't know about nagants, but love my mauser.
Didn't help, i'm afraid...:o

44 AMP
March 29, 2009, 02:52 PM
are often difficult to document on the Internet. But refusal to provide anything but outrageous statements does tend to weaken your arguments.
I find it so amazing that instead of learning from an expert people would rather call someone else a liar and perpetuate their own ignorance.

We are happy to learn from experts, and there are many on the board here. None of them are unwilling to provide at least a thumbnail sketch of their background and experience.

And just so everyone knows, this is a private forum. No one has First Amendment rights here. First Amendment rights only apply to government restricting your speech. Claiming First Amendment rights in private forum carries no weight. At all.

Gentlemen (and ladies) the subject under discussion is the Mosin Nagant vs the Mauser 98. lets get back to it, shall we?

The Mosin is an earlier, and in my opinion cruder design than the Mauser 98. It is less ergonomic in several aspects. Fine quality examples of both, with good ammo are accurate rifles. Beyond that, it becomes a matter of personal appeal, and choice.

However, consider that Mauser 98s have been made into fine sporting and target rifles in a wide variety of calibers, for generations. Mosins have not.

Mosins have a large popularity today because they are the last of the military bolt guns to be available to the public, and because of the low price of most models, combined with the low cost of surplus ammo.

Many beginning shooters get a Mosin today, for those reasons, as in my generation we got a Mauser, or Springfield, or Krag. And we all get and keep a deep affection for our first rifles, deserved or not.

I have a couple of Mosins, and several Mausers, some in military trim, and others in calibers ranging from .22-250 to .458 Win Mag. I think that pretty well shows which I prefer.

chuter
March 29, 2009, 06:24 PM
My Yugo version of the Mauser carries many "proofed" parts and is a tack driver. We shoot off hand at clay pidgeons on the wall of a local quarry using ammo made in the '30's. We figure we're a good 150 yards from the target. It's a ton of fun. It always impresses us that these weapons and ammo are so darn accurate. Hats off to the Mauser boys.
We have avoided the Mosin's but I know of several folks who really like them. My neighbor has one and he likes it. Ammo is cheap, etc. It's real interesting that the Mosin sounds different than the Mauser, or '03, etc. It sounds more like a shotgun shot than a rifle shot.
Anyway, I'll take a Mauser over the Mosin any day and I'll take an '03 or 1917over the Mauser any day. Don't overlook the '03 or '17. I'm one of those strange shooters who would even take the '17 over the '03. But, that's what makes the world go around. And you can find a great '17 for around $400 at shops or shows.
Good luck.
Oh, my wife says you should buy one of each.

chadwimc
March 29, 2009, 09:01 PM
Then there's this:

Rem 1187

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

So I've got this 1187 that groups great I mean like .5 MAO at 100 meters with 7 shot and I've been practicing alot and I want a longer tube to put more ammo in. I understand it's a gas operated gun and so far it hasn't needed a refill, but I'm worried I might run out of gas when I might really need it like a home invasion or something. How do I top it off so I never run out of gas? Plus I want to make it my avatar. How do I make my 1187 my avitar.

MikeG
March 29, 2009, 10:06 PM
I'd be curious as to exactly which model of Mauser Fast Eddie was looking at. If it was as cheap as the Mosin Nagants, it may be a Turkish Mauser.

Not sure what difference it makes, I have Turks and like them. Just curious.

If Eddie gets the Mauser, he may be back after a while for the Mosin Nagants, too.

Wildalaska
March 30, 2009, 02:45 PM
Dude, go with the Mosin. Mine shoots 2" at 600 meters. Trust me, you won't be disapointed.

Bullcrap

Wanna put a wager on it :)

WildineedthemoneyAlaska ™

mikejonestkd
March 30, 2009, 02:49 PM
I'll wager good money you can't do 2" at 300Meters.....LOL

2" at 600?!?!?!:) balderdash!!!!

:)

edit: Know what? I'd pay for Wild to fly down to shoot with you, as long as I get the plane ticket fare back from him when he wins...


which I am sure he will!!!!

Howaido
March 30, 2009, 03:03 PM
I posted this before, but this is the deal for me.

A long time ago, in a forum far, far away, I read a post in which the poster explained that he conducted warfare, "on a budget" when he purchased a SW K frame revolver as opposed to a more expensive SA on the chance there might be some unrest on the horizon.

I always thought that was wise, and ever since, I have done the same. The cost matters. It is part of the pie.

When I wanted to get a surplus rifle, a former war implement and not a hunting rifle, I looked around (at prices) and within a few days bought an M44. I am no collector. For me, the point of a surplus rifle is a cheap, utilitarian shooter, first and foremost. Beyond that? Gravy.

This gun will never be purposely used for SD, nor would an Enfield or any other such rifle I considered. Never say never, but.....Never. The only way I could ever see using it in this manner would be if goblins attacked me coming from, going to, or at the range. Even then, I would probably have something better suited for that with me.

Since then, I have picked up quite a few spare parts and a tin of ammo. I think the total investment has been about 250- and with that I have parts in case something ever breaks and enough ammo for a few years of shooting (for me with this rifle).

I refinished it without a care in the world about authenticity because I hated the reddish varnish that was standard. It now is a dark brown almost blackish color with a couple top coats of BLO. I like the look now.

Haven't had a chance to shoot it yet, but it won't be long...

Vanya
March 30, 2009, 03:04 PM
Mr. Inky's profile (http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/member.php?u=80456) sure does look a lot like LuckyInKentucky's (http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/member.php?u=26260).

Coincidence? I think not.

:p

Axel357
March 30, 2009, 03:18 PM
Bullcrap

Wanna put a wager on it

WildineedthemoneyAlaska ™

Ha, he already offered. Read posts 37-49.

Shorthair
March 30, 2009, 03:36 PM
Mr. Inky's profile sure does look a lot like LuckyInKentucky's.

Coincidence? I think not.
Vanya, I think you're on to something...
rofl @ this thread:
http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=165988

Wildalaska
March 30, 2009, 03:42 PM
Ha, he already offered. Read posts 37-49.

Cool. Lets see if he emails me :)

Vanya
March 30, 2009, 03:52 PM
rofl @ this thread:
http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/...d.php?t=165988

Exactly. It's, umm, memorable. :D

Axel357
March 30, 2009, 04:57 PM
Yeah, it's quite the deal he's offering.


So he's going to bring this:

http://www.tnguns.com/shop/images/mosin9130clickthru.jpg


And says I can bring this:

http://i40.tinypic.com/316xj0l.jpg


And he's going to out-shoot me at 600 meters:

http://www.piedmontgunclub.org/600%20yd%20ds.jpg



Anyone who says entertainment isn't cheap these days doesn't spend enough time on the internet :).

ChicagoTex
March 30, 2009, 04:59 PM
Good catch, Vanya.

Now we can write this guy off for good and move on.

sbc1320
March 30, 2009, 05:27 PM
You are right on with the profile for the two. Just click on contacts and the email is the same. Good job there.

Shorthair
March 30, 2009, 05:38 PM
Axel.... http://i214.photobucket.com/albums/cc63/gspdave45/rofl.gif

sniperinky
March 30, 2009, 05:48 PM
I'm more than happy to step up to the plate. It seems we have no takers. Pity, I could you a gun bail out slushy fund. Laugh all you want, but remember you weren't willing to risk anything. Fricken internet posers.

And Axel, I never said I would shootout with the Mosin. I'll bring my Accuracy International unless you want to limit it to milsup only.

Axel357
March 30, 2009, 06:09 PM
Well, sorry I misunderstood you then.

If the playing field is level, no, I wouldn't bet. I'm a decent shot, but so are a good deal of the members here. For all I know you ARE a better and more trained shooter. Great for you. I'm only still giving you grief because of your Mosin shooting claims and wouldn't have said anymore had I understood your "challenge" properly. At that, I'll end our bickering with you claiming to shoot 2" groups at 600 meters and me saying BS.

No worries, pal. It's just the internet. I'll say one last time, you make un-backed outrageous claims, you're going to get called on it.

Cheers. :)

Art Eatman
March 30, 2009, 06:13 PM
Enuf...