View Full Version : Double Feed Jam
March 17, 2009, 04:42 PM
I just bought a brand new Winchester Model 1300. From what I read they are amazing shotguns and everyone says they have never had a problem. Unfortunately whenever I get something, something comes up. Whenever I load more than 3 shells in the magazine it has a double feed jam. This has happened with only two in the mag before. I am using the right ammo size and everything. I did some searching and found that one place that said it is supposedly a fairly common problem with the Winchesters and was an easy fix. But he did not specify how to fix it. I cleaned and lubed it before I shot it so its not that. Does anyone know why my gun is jamming and how I may fix it. If I have to take it to a gunsmith how much do you think it would cost to fix an "easy fix"?
March 17, 2009, 05:56 PM
I'd return it to where I bought it.
A new gun should not be having this problem, and you should not be paying someone to fix it.
You paid for a good gun and didn't get it.
March 18, 2009, 12:05 AM
Of course I would have done that but I can't really return it and get another one because its a discontinued model. I wanted this specific model so I don't want to return and get another shotgun. Also I bought it on an online auction site and would rather not go through the pain of shipping a firearm and having it shipped back.
The question is, has anyone ever dealt with this before? With the Model 1300 or another shotgun? I have heard of it happening to other brands. How does the magazine mechanisms work in a gun like this and what could be the problem?
I like this gun and its supposedly an easy fix...
March 18, 2009, 12:25 AM
It's worth getting it sorted out. They are sweet shotguns.
Are both the rounds that end up lodged in there unfired, or is it a live one and the empty hull from the previous shot? The later can happen from "short stroking" (not forcefully bringing the pump all the way back and forward again). The hull kicks out at the most rearward point, so if you don't shuck it all the way back vigerously you can leave the empty shell hanging there as you cycle in a new one. The 1300 action is so slick it seems like it would be tough to do, but anything is possible, I guess. If both of the jammed shells are live, it sounds like something is going wrong in the parts that feed the rounds from the tube. I've never seen this failure in a 1300, but all guns can break.
Just ask the gunsmith for a rough estimate when you talk to them. If it's a known problem, they can probably tell you what it will cost to fix it. There are no rockets or computers involved, it's just a few little pieces of metal.:)
March 18, 2009, 12:46 AM
Yes two live rounds are getting lodged. The stop is not working correctly. I found this post on another forum, talking about mossbergs but he mentions that its similar in most pump guns. http://www.thehighroad.org/archive/index.php/t-185095.html It was very informational, and using that post coupled with a headlamp and experimentation I can see what the problem is and why it happening. Pretty much its an "adjustment" that is needed. Whether I should try fixing it myself or leave it up to the gunsmith is a matter of cost. I kind of want to do it myself for the experience. But I don't want to be having it repaired because of my repairs....
March 19, 2009, 01:11 PM
My wife's 1300 20-gauge will double-feed jam with 3" shells - pretty much every time. If you run the action slowly and gently, it has had a tendency to double-feed. It has done this more with Federal-brand 2-3/4's than other brands. Apparently, the Federal's are slightly smaller around than the Winchester or Remington shells.
Hers would only hold 4 in the magazine due to the length of the spring-retaining clip in the end of the mag tube. When I got the 7-shot extension for my 12-gauge Ranger, I tried it out on her 1300 before installing it on my gun. Evidently, the Winchesters' magazine tubes are identical between the 20-, 16- and 12-gauges. Her little 1300 did not like the extension. It was double-feeding more often than not.
I wound up installing the mag extension on my Ranger, and I put the mag spring and retaining clip from my Ranger in her 1300 since my retaining clip was shorter, and would accommodate 5-shells in the mag. Since then, her 20-gauge has not tried to double-feed since.
I don't know how helpful that is or is not, as her 1300 has probably had a billion rounds put through it - as opposed to being a brand-new gun. If you wind up finding a solution on yours, I would be interested to hear what you did, as I'd like to play with hers and get it to the point that I'm a little more confident that it won't ever double-feed again.
March 20, 2009, 02:28 PM
Cool, thanks for the input, every bit helps. I'm taking it to a gunsmith on Monday hopefully, from what I described to him, on how it might be fixed, he said it might be a $25 repair job...
March 20, 2009, 04:44 PM
same goes here too. i have a winchester 1400 thats been doing the same thing. i still dont know why its started doing it. i've had it completely apart and cant see anything that would cause it.
March 24, 2009, 01:47 PM
Got my shotgun back and it works like a champ now! The guy I took it to said that he adjusted the shell interrupter. He also said my mag spring was very strong and made it harder for the interrupter to work right. The adjustment cost me $25 and the gun works perfectly now! For more information see below, I put the contents of the link that I put up earlier, this is what helped me figure out what was wrong and how to get it fixed. Its a simple job and shouldn't be that much of a job for a gunsmith. If you are having the same problem, it, in all likelihood is a simple adjustment. But it should be done by a gunsmith, so if he breaks it he has to fix it...
Here is that link http://www.thehighroad.org/archive/index.php/t-185095.html
and below is what helped me. The article is about a Mossberg but it can be used for many types of shotguns, including my Winchester Model 1300 which works perfect now, because they have similar designs.
Dealing with double feeds , late feeds, and no feeds of the shell/cartridge from the magazine of the Mossberg 500 and other shotguns is a matter of controlling the shell/cartridge stop and the interrupter. (info below assumes a clean gun)
On the Mossberg 500 series guns the stop is on the inside left panel of the receiver and the interrupter is on the right side internal panel. They are held in place by the trigger housing and are easily removed (or fall out) when the housing is removed from the receiver .
The cartridge stop is actuated in and out by a small tab protruding upward near the front of the stop (just back from the front curve) as it interacts with the left slide action bar . (tapered ramps meet during the feed cycle and pull the stop to the left releasing the shell from the magazine. When the bolt is forward, the shell stop is allowed to be at rest and hold the shell head to prevent shells from coming out of the magazine tube.
The cartridge interrupter is actuated up and down on it's pivot with its interaction with the bolt slide. The front of this interrupter moves downward during the feed cycle to prevent the second shell in the magazine from coming out . (double feeding). When the bolt is forward the head of the interuptor is held out of the path of the shell head in the magazine allowing it to push up against the shell stop where it is held in place. (read above)
The most frequent adjustment needed in this system is with the cartridge stop. If not adjusted properly it will allow the shell head to pass out of the magazine at the incorrect time, or it will hold the shell into the magazine when it is suppose to release it into the action. Since there is some variation allowed in the diameter of the shell base in cartridge manufacturing there are times that changing brands, or lots ,of shells can correct feed problems. A much better way however is to correctly adjust the stop so that it will reliably feed all brands having some tolerance built into the gun by adjustment.
To adjust the shell stop you should first observe its range of movement during operation. You can use dummy rounds, feeding them with the gun held upside down to observe how the end of the stop mates with the base of the shell. With the bolt forward there should be sufficient engagement to hold the shells into the magazine.(even when wiggled slightly by hand the shell head should not jump past the tip of the stop).
If this is not the case, the front half of the stop can be adjusted (bent) to increase the engagement. Do this by removing the stop from the gun , and clamp the rear half in a vise, then bend the front in the direction of the curve in the front tip of the stop. Do not over adjust, it takes only a small amount to make a big difference. If over adjusted the ramp engagement of the stop and its actuator ramp on the action slide bar will not mate properly. This can cause malfunctions and can damage the tips of the ramps.
If the shell stop is holding the shell in the magazine with good engagement, but will not release them during the feed cycle, then you must adjust the tip of the stop by removing just enough material from it to give clearance for the shell head to pass while the stop is pulled out of the way. Making sure that you have proper engagement of the ramps to provide the full movement of the the stops tip out of the way is important before you remove material from the tip. Again, this doesn't generally take a lot of adjustment so remove only a small amount of material at a time using a file or dremel tool.
If you study the operation well before adjusting you should be able to tune this stop to the middle of it's proper travel and take away the possibility of small variations in the diameter of the shells base causing a problem.
With the shell stop working properly there is seldom a problem with the interrupter. The tip of the interrupter has a less critical range of motion and is controlled well by the pivot method. What the interrupter does is swing into position during the feed cycle before the first shell clears the magazine. By being in a position in front of the magazine opening at this time it prevents the second shell from being released during the action cycle. If it does not hold the second round from coming out of the magazine the result is a double feed jam. If it does not allow the first shell in the magazine past it to rest onto the shell stop, you will have complete failure to feed out of the magazine. Adjustments can be made to the tip of this stop by bending it in the direction needed to prevent the problems mentioned - it's just that this is a seldom seen problem.
So that's about it folks - I hope this helps somebody and questions/corrections are welcomed. Keep in mind also that these parts are not all that expensive and having a second set isn't a bad idea. Typically though, they don't wear out so to speak - they generally are out of adjustment rather than worn out. A little tweak can make a big difference in reliability , and although this info is specific to the Mossberg, it can serve as a guide for many other brands of guns as well.
I hope this helps. And if all else fails just take it into your gunsmith and ask!
March 25, 2009, 12:53 PM
He also said my mag spring was very strong and made it harder for the interrupter to work right.
That's funny. The spring I put in her mag tube is a lot softer than the one that was in there, and we haven't noticed an issue with it since. On Sunday, we had the pleasure of taking a combat class with some pretty rigorous speed drills. Both guns worked perfectly!
Once my regular gunsmith gets caught up with the current hailstorm, I'll probably take the 20-gauge to him. I usually like to do my own mechanical work, but it does sound worthwhile to have done. I'm going to have to read the linked text later.
Thanks for the update!
March 25, 2009, 12:57 PM
My 870 will double feed once and a while.
March 25, 2009, 11:58 PM
Yeah Evyl my interrupter was engaging some put since the spring would slam the shells back the little grip that the interrupter got on the shell would slip out and double feed. It sounds like your interrupter needs a little adjustment. If you have the tools and steady hands its a simple job, if you take it into a gunsmith you can have him or her put the extension back onto it and make sure its adjusted right. Hooray for your wife!:D
CrossbowKiller the forum I found that helped me find the problem with my Winchester shotgun was written for Mossbergs. It makes sense that most pump shotguns are similar in mechanics, like cars, so it's worth it to ask your gunsmith about it, or if you are confident in your repair skills to do it yourself...
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