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larvatus
December 18, 2008, 03:48 AM
Anyone contemplating a rare S&W revolver purchase from David Carroll (http://www.dcarroll.net/) would be well advised to look here (http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=118572002).

laytonj1
December 18, 2008, 01:43 PM
Okay, a plug to your auction and slam a reputable dealer in your add. Did you ever take up your issue with him first?

Jim

csmsss
December 18, 2008, 02:52 PM
I'm not criticizing anyone, but...I cannot conceive of ever buying a used ANYTHING without at least having some photos of it, let alone a firearm I'm dropping several thousand dollars on.

larvatus
December 18, 2008, 03:00 PM
Did you ever take up your issue with him first?I told David Carroll of the problem and asked him to make good on his description with a store credit. He does not dispute that the damage I discovered pre-dated my purchase. But he referred me to his lawyer’s opinion that he had "no duty to disclose" this damage to the revolver, despite his express reassurances of its mechanical perfection prior to my purchase.

larvatus
December 18, 2008, 03:05 PM
I'm not criticizing anyone, but...I cannot conceive of ever buying a used ANYTHING without at least having some photos of it, let alone a firearm I'm dropping several thousand dollars on.Here is a part the email that I got in lieu of the pictures:I've provided you with a definitive comparison on two guns vs. mine, as well as having gone over quite a number of others as my inventory has changed over the past 8-10 months. If you are interested in buying the 6.5", please let me know. I'm not excited by- or, inclined to be- covering the same issues over and over - as in: more photo comparisons. As my website explains; I don't do photos for my inventory other than on engraved, extremely rare and/ or special configuration guns. My descriptions are accurate, as evidenced by the 27 collectors who have purchased 371 S&W's from me in the last 24 days.It bears special notice that David Carroll is currently serving as President of the Collector Arms Dealers Association.

Daryl
December 18, 2008, 03:19 PM
Caveat Emptor.

He doesn't do pictures, and you shouldn't do business with someone who's afraid to supply them.

Digital cameras are cheap, and pictures are easy to take. Anytime a person declines to show pictures, they're likely hiding something.

If I'm the one with the money, then I make the rules. If the seller won't comply, and dodges an issue like that, walk away. And I don't care who the person is, what their reputation is, or how many things they claim to have sold to various people. Walk away with the cash, and spend it elsewhere.

It's as simple as that. If you really want recourse, then you need to file a lawsuit.

Daryl

Sam06
December 18, 2008, 03:36 PM
Mike, This is off of his website:

GUARANTEE: Whether you agree with my description matters not at all. If you just simply don’t like a particular gun; send it back for a full refund. Our goal is for you to be well pleased with each purchase - Our guarantee is absolute and good for life !!


- Ask for your money back and if he honors his Guarantee good if not, well I guess its; Caveat emptor But if I got stuck with a broken 5000 dollar gun it would be; Caveat venditor.

Good luck with it and I don't believe I will be doing business with Mr Carroll due to my Financial constraints, au revoir......................Sam

armsmaster270
December 18, 2008, 05:51 PM
I would get a printout of the website before he removes the guarantee

Hammer It
December 19, 2008, 10:41 AM
Okay, a plug to your auction and slam a reputable dealer in your add. Did you ever take up your issue with him first?

Hello Jim
I wondered this as well ? I can tell you I know the accused David Carrol and have never heard a bad word about the man in all his Years of selling guns he has always offered a return if you are not Pleased with his Guns. There also is two sides to every story but sadly we have Not heard David's side to it. He has Many guns and I can see why he would not photograph them due to the many Tire Kicker Browsers on the net, Most Not being serious Buyers it would not be worth his while..I like to know the full story before pulling the Pin on someone and this ones seems One sided to me..:( Hammer It

Coastal
December 19, 2008, 11:47 AM
Agreed that we have only heard one side of the story. Myself, I would never buy a collector grade gun sight unseen. A picture is worth a thousand words................or thousands of dollars.

larvatus
December 19, 2008, 11:52 AM
I can tell you I know the accused David Carrol and have never heard a bad word about the man in all his Years of selling guns he has always offered a return if you are not Pleased with his Guns.David Carroll has refused to honor his warranty after misrepresenting the Registered Magnum as 100% mechanically sound and correct. You can read Peter Stefansky's evaluation of the gun in question here (http://pics.livejournal.com/larvatus/pic/001dydqp). Draw your own conclusions.He has Many guns and I can see why he would not photograph them due to the many Tire Kicker Browsers on the net, Most Not being serious Buyers it would not be worth his while..You must be joking.

Hammer It
December 19, 2008, 02:18 PM
Hey larvatus
Just curious if you are the buyer ? If not I guess your information is second hand as Well. I asked David about this Flame Thread and he agreed he did NOT offer the Buyer a refund so that tells me there is much more to the story that is NOT being told here..and No I was Not Joking one bit. Hammer It

larvatus
December 19, 2008, 04:25 PM
Just curious if you are the buyer ?As stated in the listing and confirmed above, I bought the revolver from David Carroll.

Jart
December 19, 2008, 04:30 PM
Hey larvatus
Just curious if you are the buyer ? If not I guess your information is second hand as Well.
I am not Larvatus, nor do I portray him on the internet, but that piece of information was easily determined from the auction listing:
My name is Michael Zeleny .... I paid $4,950.00 for this 1936 S&W .357 Registered Magnum to David Carroll

Since Mr. Carroll has evidently been advised of the thread I'd be interested to hear what he has to say. Registration here is free, requires no sponsor and is pretty fast.

I am curious about something though:
I asked David about this Flame Thread and he agreed he did NOT offer the Buyer a refund so that tells me there is much more to the story that is NOT being told here.
It appears you're drawing a conclusion that facts are being omitted strictly from Mr. Carroll's acknowledgement that he isn't offering a refund. I'm not seeing the connection. Perhaps you could expand some?

larvatus
December 19, 2008, 05:48 PM
It appears you're drawing a conclusion that facts are being omitted strictly from Mr. Carroll's acknowledgement that he isn't offering a refund. I'm not seeing the connection. Perhaps you could expand some?I am not Hammer It, but my favorite movie offers an insight into Mr Carroll's response:Pike Bishop: He gave his word.
Dutch Engstrom: He gave his word to a railroad.
Pike Bishop: It's his word.
Dutch Engstrom: That ain't what counts! It's who you give it to!
--The Wild Bunch (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0065214/)As elaborated by Judge Smails in Caddyshack (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0080487/): "Let's face it. Some people... simply do not belong." Bear that in mind the next time you try to hold a merchant to his word. Are you the kind of person that belongs?

jaydubya
December 19, 2008, 07:19 PM
A search of Larvatus's postings might be in order here. He started a thread on cracked CZ frames that he kept alive for more than twenty pages. Nothing personal, just thought I'd mention it.

Cordially, Jack

Hammer It
December 19, 2008, 07:25 PM
It appears you're drawing a conclusion that facts are being omitted strictly from Mr. Carroll's acknowledgement that he isn't offering a refund. I'm not seeing the connection. Perhaps you could expand some?

Hello
I saw this thread and asked David if he was aware of it. He did not give me all the details of this transaction, but I felt that they were Not my Business anyways, so I did not Pry but being that I know the Man and know he has sold Thousands of Revolvers in the past 25 Years it seemed Odd to me he had an issue with this guy as all I have ever heard is good out of anyone that has dealt with him in the past. I feel there is a Lot more that the seller Kind of Forgot or is not revealing about this whole Deal. Most of David's Guns are "Collectible" status. From what I read the Problem is a factory Problem not one MR Caroll Caused or perhaps may not have been aware of as I assume he does not fire every gun he offeres for sale. I Can't see the Guy getting Trashed when the complete story has not been disclosed by Both parties here, it is One sided from what I read & as I said, "There is always two sides to every story", and I am done with this as I Know David Carroll and Doubt he did not try to make it right with this guy to begin with, there has to be much more involved here that made him decide to Not refund the guys money, as he did share with me that this is the Only Customer in the past Quarter of a Century that he has not refunded their money when it was requested, so evidently the Buyer is NOT telling the whole story here, No Matter what he Typed up in his for sale add ..;) Hammer It

Mal H
December 19, 2008, 08:04 PM
Hammer It - unless you know the actual reason Mr. Carroll is not offering a refund, it might be best for you to stop offering your opinions on the deal. larvatus, the actual buyer of the revolver, has given his side of the story. The only person who can give David Carroll's side of the story is David Carroll himself, or his proxy who can quote him directly. So far, that proxy isn't you in that your posts are only a testimonial to the general character of the man and the manner in which he has dealt with others in the past. There have been no facts concerning the deal in question presented from Mr. Carroll's viewpoint. You yourself stated that Mr. Carroll has not given you the details of the transaction.

jaydubya - how is what you posted germane to the present topic?

I would suggest everyone take a deep breath and stop posting suppositions and hearsay on this subject until actual facts can be posted.

Hammer It
December 19, 2008, 08:16 PM
Hello mal
Sage advice. I was only stating that I have Known David a very Long time and this is Not his usual Policy, Nor way of Handling a Buyers Problems. That's is all and I am done with this thread thanks for your insight, No disrespect intended on the seller Nor the Buyer here..;) Hammer It

larvatus
December 19, 2008, 09:51 PM
I Know David Carroll and Doubt he did not try to make it right with this guy to begin with, there has to be much more involved here that made him decide to Not refund the guys money, as he did share with me that this is the Only Customer in the past Quarter of a Century that he has not refunded their money when it was requested, so evidently the Buyer is NOT telling the whole story here, No Matter what he Typed up in his for sale add ..To simplify, David Carroll is telling us through you that I am the only person to whom he has failed to deliver on his promise in the past 25 years. This might work as an excellent testimonial to his integrity for anyone who believes that it is possible to be just a little bit pregnant.

Hammer It
December 19, 2008, 10:32 PM
What Ever.... I said I was done with this thread and the Moderator has asked us to stop Flameing, But apparently that is what you want as seen in Most your threads Previously Posted. If you feel you are right, and Got a Gun that was Misrepresented by the seller why Not Hire an attorney to gain back your funds back rather than Whine on the Internet about It ? Take it up with David, I am through with it & You, as I feel there is No Merit to this, But that is just my Opinion.... ;) Hammer It

jaydubya
December 19, 2008, 10:39 PM
Mal H -- I've sent you an e-mail on this.

Cordially, Jack

Mal H
December 19, 2008, 11:04 PM
larvatus - please do not post again in an inflammatory manner. It doesn't help you or the readers of your thread one iota.


Jack - I got it, thanks.