View Full Version : Thinking I need a 'silent' varmint rifle. . .
December 10, 2008, 11:09 PM
I live in Ohio, is it legal for me to hunt varmints here with a suppressed firearm?:confused:
I am thinking either a 17 Rem, 204 Ruger or 223, with a 20-24" barrel and a can on the end, I would be building the can myself so no need for a Title III dealer, just some paperwork and a stamp. . .
Hmm. . . . . Let me know what you guys think. . .I already have a 204 in a CZ Varmint rifle but, I love the caliber, and I want to stay around the 223 realm, defiantly nothing larger than a 6mm
December 10, 2008, 11:57 PM
I know nothing of silencers so as to which caliber silences better...I got nothing.
But I like the K.I.S.S. way of living.
Keep it simple stupid.
I like caliber simplicity, especially if you reload. However if the .204 is crap for silencing....
hope i helped
December 11, 2008, 10:26 AM
Up until about 1920-28, you could legally silence anything. Buy them at your local Sears or Montgomery Wards. I have several of their original adds from catalogs. I believe they are Maxim adds. Attempt to silence a firearm today and you go to jail. Federal charges. Firearms themselve are scarry enough to the estabishment let alone "silent" ones.
A bullet must be subsonic < 1050 fps to be silent (quiet). This rules out the affordable and functional practicality of virtually any varmit rifle, not to once again mention the legal aspects.
I will find the adds, scan an post them for everyone.
NRA member for 40+ years
December 11, 2008, 10:33 AM
mijaboot is hideously misinformed - silencers are legal per the 1934NFA by paying a $200 tax to either transfer one to yourself or produce one yourself.
Ignore mijaboot - silencing a small caliber rifle yields a sonic crack that sounds like a .22lr instead of a BOOM when fired. And, since you mentioned paperwork you already know that they're quite legal.
If I were you, I'd Form1 a .223 can with a bore of ~.270, make it K-baffle, make it about 1.5" diameter and at least 7 inches long. It should be made out of proper materials to withstand the heat of firing (you need to have a nice strong thick blast baffle, for example)
Video demonstration (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QGj6Kdmz-5U) of the reduction in sound. That's my M4-1000 from AAC on my PLR-16. :)
December 11, 2008, 10:34 AM
Attempt to silence a firearm today and you go to jail.
Unless, of course possession of a silencer is legal in your state and you pay the appropriate ATF tax stamp, fill out the proper federal paperwork, etc. It can be done legally in many states, if you wish to jump through all the hoops and pay the $$$. Actually hunting with it may be an issue. Make sure you check your states hunting regulations.
December 11, 2008, 10:35 AM
Speaking of hunting with silencers, BOY do I love Colorado! :D
December 11, 2008, 12:15 PM
He obviously understands silencers are legal. He just wants to know if he can legally hunt with one in his state. Best to call your local wildlife & fisheries and ask someone who actually knows.
For reference, in Louisiana it's illegal to hunt with a silencer. In Mississippi, it's perfectly legal.
I own a Gemtech Blackside .45ACP and an AAC M4-2000 5.56mm silencer.
If you get a 5.56mm silencer you can use it both on .223 and .22LR. Easiest method would be to just get a Ciener .22 conversion kit for your AR then swap to .22 when you want super stealthy hunting. I do this and it works great. My pellet rifle is literally louder than the .22 kit with subsonic ammo (supersonic ammo still has a loud crack like a whip).
December 11, 2008, 01:16 PM
This appears to be the place to look:
I scanned through and did not see any prohibitions on hunting with a suppressor in Ohio. Obviously you should make sure yourself before doing it.
December 11, 2008, 04:48 PM
Yeah, good one guys, I have a friend that has three cans, two SBR's and three machine guns, 2 being MP5 variations. . . .he has informed me of all the papers that are needed, and otherwise, but he does not hunt, or live in Ohio for that fact, soo he cannot help me there,
I just want to kill the report, the sonic crack I can live with, keeps the neighbors from bothering me while hunting if Im quiet, and since the 22 mag isn't giving me the range I want with the sound I want (or dont want) a surpressor is the next logical step right?
I might drop DNR a line or ask the local game warden, as we get along quite well, and have know each other for a couple years. .. . .
I would be building my own can likely with threaded caps and totally out of Stainless, my aforementioned friend has tons of plans for cans. . . .
Anyone else, have a 204 with a can? I do love that caliber. . . . but do I need another one??
December 14, 2008, 06:05 PM
Everyone else has settled the legality end of the post. I will touch on cartridge selection. Something easy to get subsonic is what you want. this rules out the fast .22's and the .204. Any pistol calibers work well out of a rifle. I plan on getting a 7.62x39 and putting a can on it, not quite as easy to suppress as a pistol caliber but I handload and can make a load to work pretty well.
December 16, 2008, 02:13 AM
...I would be building the can myself so no need for a Title III dealer, just some paperwork and a stamp. . ...
just to point out.....it should be Class 2 (manuf) or Class III (dealer), not Title III
December 16, 2008, 10:20 AM
It seems 40+ years NRA membership did not do anything for mijaboot's knowledge or integrity. The NRA is not known for being pro title ii anyway. It was not until 1934 that the National Firearms Act was passed. It did not ban silencers and other title 2 weapons, just placed overly strict controls on them. Ditto for his crap about needing subsonic ammo for good suppression. What wood work do these people crawl out of anyway?
Ohio is one of the 37 states that allow unlicensed civilians to own silencers. You need to check your state law to ensure they are allowed for hunting game or non-game animals. Contact the ATF (phone number at ATF.gov) and ask for ATF forms 1's, form 5330.20 and fingerprint cards. Advice for filling out the forms is at http://www.subguns.com and http://www.silencertests.com . The advice on those forums is plentiful and usually accurate; no one there will tell you it is illegal to own a silencer in the USA. :) If you want to buy a silencer, then any 223 silencer will work well, but they are expensive.
I agree that suppressing a high speed round like the 204 or 223 really helps a lot; you can even safely shoot them in the open without hearing protection. If you want to go quieter, then I suggest the 300 whisper. Unfortunately anything subsonic is going to be headed downhill very fast after 200 yards, so you need to know the range to target precisely. Good luck. Feel free to contact me if you have any questions, I have made several silencers on ATF form 1's for 22 to 50 caliber rifles.
You didn't say what metal working experience you have, but you will need a decent lathe, band saw and welder to make a good silencer for any rifle as powerful as the 204. I learned how to operate a lathe while making my first silencer for a 300 whisper.
December 16, 2008, 10:23 AM
neither does red light, smoking, chewing gum, or talking to your wife on the cell phone.
A .17 rem will get 4,000 FPS with a 42 grain, and not exit.
a 25-06 will take them out to 600 yards.
WHAT ELSE YA WANT?
December 16, 2008, 07:48 PM
I've built several on form1's and waiting for the paper work to get back for others. Anything subsonic is the best for sound but not so good for long range varmiting. The best thing I can say about supersonic loads is that you can make it less damaging to shoot without hearing protection.
State and local laws aside getting an LEO to sign the paperwork can be a problem. You must then form a trust, but its easy.
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