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? ? ? ?
October 14, 2008, 11:54 AM
hello, i am really new to all this but the bug has bit me and i would like some help.
i'm looking for a bp revolver in stainless,that has a 5 1/2" barrel,in 44 or 45 cal. that also has an cartridge converter that i can buy for it later down the road.i like the top strap on my guns i dont like the opentop ones(but here is my delimma) i like the grip of the opentop colts, not the grip on the closedtop remmys. the only gun i have found so far that meets my requrerments is the ruger old army in stainless with fixed sights and a 5.5" barrel, but from what i can gather ruger no longer makes them and the only ones i seem to find online are way too much, im looking to spend no more than $200. so here is the other question if i get a gun repro that has the top strap can i get some cosmetic work done to get the grips to look like i want them? also what gun would you all suggest as a good gun that meets most of my requrerments. i will end up buying a pair and taking them along with my remmington genisis with me to alaska which is where i will be moving soon. i awaite you replys as you guys know way more than i do.


P.S. the revolvers will be used for small game and protection from wolves.unless i can give the guns a full 50 grain charge of 777. and it will bring down something bigger. Also do you think my rem genisis is going to be able to stop a bear if need be? thanx all for helping this noob:cool:

P.P.S. can i also get the gun converted to double action?

Hawg
October 14, 2008, 12:09 PM
Sorry, you're looking for the impossible. Having a Remington grip frame reshaped will run over 200 by itself. If anybody was willing to take it on. It's possible to make a round butt yourself but I don't think that's what you're wanting. Ruger has ceased production of all bp guns. None of them will hold 50 grs. of 777.

? ? ? ?
October 14, 2008, 12:20 PM
well i called ruger and asked what the max safe charge would be for the old army and they had said 50 gr of black powder so ok maybe i can't use that much 777,now i know i may not be able to get the guns grips converted but i am still looking for help with finding a stainless gun for under $200

Fingers McGee
October 14, 2008, 12:20 PM
What Hawg said.

If you have enough money and can find the right gunsmith, just about anyting is possible. AN ROA would be close; but, no seeegarr.

mykeal
October 14, 2008, 12:30 PM
Lets' see.

Closed top frame.
Colt style grip frame.
Stainless finish.
.44/.45 cal.
Cartridge conversion available.
Less than $200.
Capable of 50 gr bp load.

Nope. Don't know of any.
I suggest you you prioritize your list.

? ? ? ?
October 14, 2008, 12:36 PM
ok lets see what i can change.

Closed top frame.

Stainless finish.
.44/.45 cal.
Cartridge conversion available.
Less than $250.
Capable of 45 gr bp load.

how would this be?

Smokin_Gun
October 14, 2008, 01:04 PM
Closed top frame.

Stainless finish.
.44/.45 cal.
Cartridge conversion available.
Less than $250.
Capable of 45 gr bp load

You can get None in SS for $250...search the Web and Auctions like Gunbroker and Auction Arms, you may get lucky.

None with 45gr of BP... 40gr max with Rems...w/conversion to .45 Colt drop in 255gr soft lead flat point 35gr Goex BP fffg...plenty to stop a Bear if need be.
I don't hunt Man or Beast with jus' a Revolver or handgun...but carry one with a Rifle.

Have a Pietta 1858 Rem .44 Blued very good condition $180 + Shipping.

http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c277/Smokin_Gun/09-16-08_1626.jpg
http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c277/Smokin_Gun/09-16-08_1627.jpg
http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c277/Smokin_Gun/09-16-08_1628.jpg

Rogers & Spencer .44 by Euroarms is another choice but not under $250.

SG

Oquirrh
October 14, 2008, 01:25 PM
If you love a good grip, just get a Colt 1860. (You'll be lucky to find a used one for under $175, unless it's brass framed.)

The lack of top strap means little, as the Colt is probably as strong as a Remmy. But you'll have to work with the pistol and get to know it before it shoots dependably. If you aren't into knowing your firearms--get the Remmy.

Forget about stainless unless you throw a lot more money at it.

I have a stainless ROA and a few steel Remmys and colts. I shoot the ROA the least because it's not "authentic" and I have no problem with rust on the other revs with reasonable cleaning.

Raider2000
October 14, 2008, 01:31 PM
For the money the Pietta '58 in either blued steel or stainless would be your best bet & the one that SG has there is about the best price going right now "I'd jump on it if'n I hadn't bought my Uberti not too long ago" but I keep my lil Pietta '58 with it's 5.5 inch barrel loaded with 30gr. of FFFG Goex & a 220gr. .456 Lee conical & it has the same velocity & energy as a .45 Schofield in that barrel, you can squeeze 36gr. FFFG in there & the 220gr. conical for almost the same power as a .45 Colt but she is a bit less accurate with that load & a little violent in the hand.

grymster2007
October 14, 2008, 01:51 PM
Hurry up and buy SG's Pietta before I commit an act detrimental to the matrimonial bliss I currently enjoy. :)

I am not a shill :)

Shotgun Willy
October 14, 2008, 02:04 PM
You can get the top strap and the Colt grips, with the Uberti 1873 model. I don't think you can do a conversion cylinder with it though, and I don't know about stainless.

? ? ? ?
October 14, 2008, 02:14 PM
well i think im gonna go for a stainless 58 remmy from cabellas its more than i want to spend but what the hell im going for it. i really dont like the look of the blued steel so im gonna stick with stainless. i have a link to the two guns the one is the remmy the other is a colt, the only thing holding me back from buying a colt is i was told due to it not having a top strap that the barrel will soon become loose and need fixing, and i do not know how to do this. as i am still a noob. here are the links. oh by the way these guns are not for compotition they are for protection in the wilderness of alaska.(so keeping this in mind what do u sugest long barrel or should i stick with the 5.5)?

#1,,,http://www.cabelas.com/cabelas/en/templates/pod/horizontal-pod.jsp;jsessionid=O4C4OFW00MGXHLAQBBKSCO3MCAEFAIWE?_DARGS=/cabelas/en/common/catalog/pod-link.jsp_A&_DAV=MainCatcat20712-cat20720-cat20817&rid=&indexId=cat20817&navAction=push&masterpathid=&navCount=11&parentType=index&parentId=cat20817&id=0058615&_requestid=68899


#2,,,http://www.cabelas.com/cabelas/en/templates/product/standard-item.jsp?_DARGS=/cabelas/en/common/catalog/item-link.jsp_A&_DAV=MainCatcat20712-cat20720-cat20817-cat20817&id=0035950212969a&navCount=2&podId=0035950&parentId=cat20817&masterpathid=&navAction=push&catalogCode=XJ&rid=&parentType=index&indexId=cat20817&hasJS=true


and this is the colt,,,,http://www.cabelas.com/cabelas/en/templates/pod/horizontal-pod.jsp?id=0006191&navCount=4&parentId=cat20817&masterpathid=&navAction=push&cmCat=MainCatcat20712-cat20720-cat20817-cat20817-cat20817&parentType=index&indexId=cat20817&rid=



also i will have a rifle this is a link to the rifle i bought and man do i love it!


http://www.cabelas.com/cabelas/en/templates/product/standard-item.jsp?_DARGS=/cabelas/en/common/catalog/item-link.jsp_A&_DAV=MainCatcat20712-cat20720-cat20815&id=0040407216200a&navCount=55&podId=0040407&parentId=cat20815&masterpathid=&navAction=push&catalogCode=8IS&rid=&parentType=index&indexId=cat20815&hasJS=true


and the best part is it is on sale right now only $199.99!!! i only use 777 .50 cal pellets in this rifle.;)

? ? ? ?
October 14, 2008, 02:21 PM
shotgun willie thank you i think i could settle for blued steel if it has those grips and a top strap. do you have a link to where i can buy this gun?:eek::cool:

Raider2000
October 14, 2008, 02:25 PM
A 5.5" barrel will be quicker & easier out of the holster but the 8" barrel will be a little more accurate & powerful because of the extra length, it all really depends on what you are looking for.

? ? ? ?
October 14, 2008, 02:27 PM
well i figured the pistol would be for protection from wolves and my rifle would be for hunting for food.

Hawg
October 14, 2008, 02:36 PM
The 73 doesn't have the same grip frame as the cap and ball guns do. That bit about Colt barrels getting loose is poppycock. The only thing about them beginners don't seem to understand is the barrel wedge doesn't get driven all the way in on reassembly. The cap and ball 73 can be permanently converted to cartridge but it requires a gunsmith. Conversion cylinders for regular cap and balls cost more than the guns do and you're limited to bp pressures. Also they only hold five rounds and for the cheap route the cylinder has to be removed for loading.

? ? ? ?
October 14, 2008, 02:41 PM
hey Hawg Haggen, thanx for the info so let me get this strait when u reasenble the colt u do NOT push the wedge in all the way?:confused:

Raider2000
October 14, 2008, 02:42 PM
Well I like my little 5.5" barreled Remington copy but I also have 2 8" barreled ones too, & don't forget that Wild Bill Hickock used 2 Colt 1851 Navy's with 7.5" barrels to defend his hide more than once.

Raider2000
October 14, 2008, 02:46 PM
As far as the wedge on the Colt type of revolvers all you need is to have the wedge in roughly hand pressure "just enough to have the wedge on the other side of the barrel assembly but loose enough to let the cylinder rotate, I learned how to dissassemble & reassemble a Colt 1851 Navy when I was 6 so I know that most people with a little patience, tiral & error can too.

? ? ? ?
October 14, 2008, 02:50 PM
well thank you all for your help this has been like another day back at school,lol, only this time i am learning something i find fun. now that i know the truth about the colts i will decide on a final colt model i wish to own and shoot.how about one of these?


#1
http://www.cabelas.com/cabelas/en/templates/product/standard-item.jsp?_DARGS=/cabelas/en/common/catalog/item-link.jsp_A&_DAV=MainCatcat20712-cat20720-cat20817-cat20817-cat20817-cat20817&id=0022090215128a&navCount=13&podId=0022090&parentId=cat20817&masterpathid=&navAction=push&catalogCode=XJ&rid=&parentType=index&indexId=cat20817&hasJS=true


#2
http://www.cabelas.com/cabelas/en/templates/product/standard-item.jsp?_DARGS=/cabelas/en/common/catalog/item-link.jsp_A&_DAV=MainCatcat20712-cat20720-cat20817-cat20817-cat20817-cat20817&id=0006184213009a&navCount=12&podId=0006184&parentId=cat20817&masterpathid=&navAction=push&catalogCode=XJ&rid=&parentType=index&indexId=cat20817&hasJS=true

Hawg
October 14, 2008, 03:00 PM
The cylinder gap determines how far the wedge goes. A new gun the wedge will just be a tiny tad past flush on the off side. An older gun with a lot of use on it may need to go in further. Those are nice looking guns but that gold will wear off pretty quick with holster carry. Those aren't stainless either just polished steel. Here's mine. I prefer it over my Remingtons.

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y269/rebel727/Colt/Pietta1860.jpg

Smokin_Gun
October 14, 2008, 03:13 PM
shotgun willie thank you i think i could settle for blued steel if it has those grips and a top strap. do you have a link to where i can buy this gun?


???? get that SS 1858 Rem from Cabelas you won't be sorry...either length will be fine to suite your needs, your preferance.

Go get it....
http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c277/Smokin_Gun/10-13-08_1725.jpg
I like Colts I jus' like Rems Better.....these are what I been sellin'
http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c277/Smokin_Gun/09-02-08_1738.jpg
http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c277/Smokin_Gun/My61Colt.jpg

SG

? ? ? ?
October 14, 2008, 03:52 PM
i have decided! ok this is what i am going to do. but first i want to thank you all for your help and imput. ok i am going to buy 1 1858 5.5" rem, and next month i will buy this one..

http://www.cabelas.com/cabelas/en/templates/pod/horizontal-pod.jsp?_DARGS=/cabelas/en/common/catalog/pod-link.jsp_A&_DAV=MainCatcat20712-cat20720-cat20815-cat20817-cat20817&rid=&indexId=cat20817&navAction=push&masterpathid=&navCount=25&parentType=index&parentId=cat20817&id=0006191 :D:D:D:D

Smokin_Gun
October 14, 2008, 04:23 PM
You Da Man ????, I had a used one but it was all shot out...
Thank you for reminding me, the U.S. Marshal will be on my Priority 1 "New" Want List.
http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c277/Smokin_Gun/1056marshall44.jpg

SG

? ? ? ?
October 14, 2008, 04:27 PM
hey sg u still got the old shot out one? if u do and ur willing to part with it i would be willing to give u some $ for it, i could use a good spinning gun for my holloween costume this year.

Smokin_Gun
October 14, 2008, 08:51 PM
No I sent that back to Buffalo Bill's a couple years ago ... I fixed 3 things on it at the Range and the next shot the loading lever catch fell off in the dirt. That was enough.

All the one's I got are in good working order the cheapist would be a brasser 1851 Navy $135 shipped...

? ? ? ?
October 14, 2008, 10:42 PM
nah i'll just buy them from cabellas. i was just askin cause u said it was all shot out i would have used it for a spining gun for my costume.

? ? ? ?
October 15, 2008, 11:49 AM
ok guys and gals i did not buy from cabellas i bought from midway usa they were a little cheaper. here is the link to the guns i have bought.and since i hit the $500 jackpot in a scratch off ticket i went and bought both and i also got the starter kit from cabellas. tell me what u think, imput greatly appreciated.:D:D:D


1. http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.exe/showproduct?saleitemid=251179


2. http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.exe/showproduct?saleitemid=183598#enalarge

Shotgun Willy
October 15, 2008, 04:00 PM
Nice guns, it took me a minute to figure out that they were actually two different guns. Nice find.

? ? ? ?
October 15, 2008, 04:03 PM
yeah it took me a few min myself to figure it out as well. now im all set for my move to alaska, i have my guns my rifle my powder my bullets and my dog.

? ? ? ?
October 15, 2008, 04:08 PM
all i need now are some ivory grips and these guns will look great

flatheadsal
October 15, 2008, 07:45 PM
Hey ???? you probably should have bought one pistol AND the .45 conversion cyl, just seems more practical to be able to switch to some reliable and more powerful factory .45's, and back to black powder when theres no threat or danger. Alaska is no Sunday stroll, just my $.02, enjoy and be safe, flathead

Raider2000
October 15, 2008, 08:51 PM
Reliability, I agree because he's new to Black Powder & has some learning to do, but in the experienced hands it can be just a reliable & weather resistent.

More Powerful? Maybe but only marginal being that these conversion cylinders are only rated at Cowboy Action performance levels not the modern factory defence pressures that is out there, like I stated earlier my little '58 with it's 5.5" barrel loaded with my cast lead 220gr. .456 Lee Conical & a 30gr. load of FFFG Goex is quite potent appoximating what a .45 Schofield will produce in that barrel length "about 700 fps. 240 ft. lbs.."

I will agree that the conversion cylinder would give some advantages of loading readily available .45 Colt cartridges but otherwise that is it's only real advantage.

? ? ? ?
October 15, 2008, 10:37 PM
i was going to do things that way but my father told me that if i buy the guns with my own money he would buy me the conversion cylenders, so there was no real need to do so. And from what i have been reading there would be no real difference between using the convert cyl over the bp cyl, ecept that one u charge yourself and one is just ready to go, also they would equal out to be about the same power.

Hawg
October 16, 2008, 02:09 AM
The only problem isn't much of a problem but the starter kit from Cabela's has .451 balls and you really need .454's. The .451's will work but may not shave a ring on loading so make sure you use felt wads under the ball or lube the front of those loaded chambers real good.

? ? ? ?
October 16, 2008, 11:31 AM
yeah i have some wonder wads comming as well so no problem there, i also have a recipe for some lube from this forum that i plan to use