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Epyon
June 22, 2008, 09:06 PM
I was thinking about something earlier today, suppose I have the same exact brand of ammo, same type and everything, but I decide to put alternating weights in bullets in one magazine, (example being 155grain and 180grain in .40) Would this have any adverse effect on feeding and ejection? Would it be a good idea because now I have rounds that expand well and another that penetrates deep? Has anyone here ever tried/tested these kinds of results?


Epyon

oldandslow
June 23, 2008, 12:23 AM
epyon, 6/23/08

Interesting question. I have used a number of different weight bullets in my reloads for 9mm and 45 (115 and 124 grain for 9mm, 185 and 230 for .45) and have never noticed any difference in feeding or extraction/ejection. So if each round feeds well in your pistol they should function OK from the same mag.
Several problems with different bullet weights in the same magazine though. The points of impact will differ, either higher or lower, depending on the bullet weight. The recoil will also be inconsistent between the different weights as the energy level generated by different bullet weights will not be the same. So you will have different recoil and points of impact which makes followup shots and accuracy difficult. Just my opinion but I'm not sure it would be the best way to load your mags.

best wishes- oldandslow

JohnKSa
June 23, 2008, 12:31 AM
Would this have any adverse effect on feeding and ejection? Would it be a good idea because now I have rounds that expand well and another that penetrates deep? Has anyone here ever tried/tested these kinds of results?I have heard that loading a single magazine with various kinds of loads can result in malfunctions even when the individual loads would function fine.

I have no idea why that would be true and I have not experienced the problem in the very limited testing I've done.

fbrown333@suddenlink
June 23, 2008, 02:38 AM
I have a .45 ACP and shoot factory and hand loads stagard in the same magazine (ball, hollow point, ball,etc...) and have not had a jam or missfire yet:). Not sure about the .40 though :confused: just my .5 cents (inflation):D

Superhouse 15
June 23, 2008, 06:12 AM
I believe it is called "Dutch Loading". No LEO agency I know of authorizes it. although I might carry a spare mag of a different round, I don't mix ammo in the same magazine. How do you keep track when the bullets are flying? What if, as you get ready to take the shot at someone behind cover, you realize you have counted and you have a frangible in the chamber?

I carry mostly Hydra Shok or Gold Saber in my CCW, but have Gold Dot in the spare magazine for the performance of a bonded bullet. I have been known to load a couple of tracers near the bottom of some AR magazines I keep for the next Katrina, but I don't routinely carry them.

IGO1320
June 24, 2008, 09:51 AM
I have a .40 HK P2000SK and have mixed Remington 180grn GS with 135grn Cor-Bon, and Winchester 165grn. I wanted to A, see if the POI was dramatically different, B, if the difference in recoil would mess up follow up shots, C cause any feeding/ejection problems. I fired from 7 yards out to 15 yards and the answers are A not enough to worry about with a silhoette, B I found I wait for the sights to realign before I pull the trigger again so even though there was a significant difference in perceived recoil, accuracy and time to followup was not significantly effected, and lastly C none, either left or right hand only nor with both hand holds. Not saying I recommend this just thought I would try it as an experiment. Have a good day.

Keltyke
June 24, 2008, 04:18 PM
Superhouse 15 is right, that is called "Dutch loading".

As someone mentioned, you'd have to keep track if which type is in the tube at any given moment. Too much to think about in a gunfight. I'd pick a good compromise round and stick with that.

TexasSeaRay
June 24, 2008, 08:20 PM
Personally and professionally, I think it's a bad idea.

We never did it in the unit during military operations. We fiddled around with it in training, but saw far more potential for disaster than positive outcome.

When you're in a fight, especially where weapons are involved, you want to control as many variables as you possibly can. The weapon you carry is one such variable, as is the ammunition you choose for it.

Different ammo in the same magazine gives you variables that are hard to keep up with. "Let's see, did I just fire all my subsonic rounds or not--or do I have the 95-grain rounds up next?"

Or, "Oh (stinky stuff)! I thought that was buckshot in the tube but it was a slug--and it went right through the bad guy and hit a child standing behind him!"

Things happen damn fast in a fight. You can't remember which round is which when they're staggered.

For the most part, everytime we went out on an operation, we carried the same handguns, same long guns, same sniper guns, same ammunition, etc. Occasionally you would change that for a particular mission, but in our line of work, not all that often. We planned our mission sequences bearing in mind the tools we had and were most comfortable and confident with.

In my law enforcement agency, staggering rounds was a firable offense--no if's, and's, or but's about it and no warning or second chances.

Jeff

orionengnr
June 24, 2008, 08:38 PM
To me, it indicates that either you have doubts in your choice of loads, or that you are indecisive. Or both. :)

Teppo Sensei
June 24, 2008, 10:11 PM
at most police departments duty ammo is issued and is the only ammo you can carry
we have a 2 older officers with .357 revolvers
they can only carry issued .38 special ammo
caliber choices are .380, 9mm, .38special, .40 and .45
there is a bomb tech that carries a sig .380

heavy bullets work better than light bullets in short barrels
it gives the powder more time to burn
i use .40 180gr STX in my glock27 ccw

velobard
July 5, 2008, 09:36 AM
heavy bullets work better than light bullets in short barrels
it gives the powder more time to burn
I admit to being a relative rookie, but I didn't know that. Something to keep in mind for loads for my Keltec PF9. My current load for that gun is low recoil 135 grain, so I guess I'm in decent shape. For my full-sized 9mm with a 4" barrel that I carry most of the time I currently use Ranger 115 grain +P+.

I've been considering loading a 147 grain FMJ flat point for the second round, at least for winter carry, because I've seen that particular round have significantly higher penetration. I hope that if I used it for just the second round that I'd have a better chance of keeping track of which round is the "punch-through" load.

Threefeathers
July 5, 2008, 10:20 AM
Absolutely not. Two bullet weights will have adifferent point of aim. There is no way you'll know what tactical situation you will be in. You may be close so ther will be no problem But, you may have to make that 25 meter head shot and you won't know which point of aim to take. You may have to do as I did 3 yars ago and make the head dhot on a Diamondback that is heading for your 1 year old grand daughter. In fact you'll have a better chance at having to ake out a critter than anything else.

Keltyke
July 5, 2008, 10:58 AM
I admit to being a relative rookie, but I didn't know that. Something to keep in mind for loads for my Keltec PF9.

I carry a Keltec PF-9 loaded with Corbon DPX. You might want to check goldenloki.com for his testing of the 9mm from short barrels. I prefer a lighter bullet, personally, for a higher velocity. The bullet weight does, in part, determine if the powder burns completely before it exits the muzzle, but so does the powder composition.

velobard
July 5, 2008, 08:09 PM
That's a great website, Keltyke. I've read up on some other ballistics sites like brassfetcher, but this one is more relevant to "mouse guns".

Mannlicher
July 5, 2008, 08:48 PM
Life is complicated enough without throwing curve balls to yourself. The single most important aspect of carrying a particular weapon and load is reliability. Doing anything to compromise that is probably not going to be a good thing.
Keep it simple :D

T. O'Heir
July 5, 2008, 09:44 PM
"...adverse effect on feeding and ejection?..." Not if both are reliable to start with, but your shots would be all over the target. Like Threefeathers says, you'd have two POA's and two POI's. Doesn't make for accurate shooting.

izzkidioto
July 6, 2008, 11:30 PM
I carried a PF-9 for a while, I had the first round as a hard first punch 124gr Hornady JHP, then the rest were 115gr JHP. Spare mag had all 115gr. I now carry the Kahr P9 with that same configuration. I have learned to expect the first round from draw to be a bit more juicy than the rest. Just my preference, though...

I would not alternate rounds in the same mag by any means, like TexasSeaRay said, control as many variables as you can, it all happens in a heartbeat.

Hook686
July 7, 2008, 12:06 PM
I use different bullet weights (115, 125, 147) in my 9mm S&W pistol and different bullet weights (125, 158, 170) in my S&W .357 revolver. I do not notice any deviations when I practice and at 10 yards shooting from a ready position - target acquisition position I do not notice any great variation in Point of Aim and Point of Impact.

Bullseye target shooters will, but then personal defense scenarios are hardly a bullseye competition event. At 25 yards, if I keep the rounds within an 8" circle, I'm happy. I can do this with the mixed bullet weights I use.

I suggest simply practice with what you plan to carry in the pistol. As long as there are no feed issues, I don't see a problem with mixed loads at close distances and rapid target acquisition.