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Shorts
March 22, 2008, 06:29 PM
I was curious if there is available instruction/courses specifically tailored to training disabled folks. For instance, me with only one good hand (left is paralyzed). I realize some courses do offer the scenarios of dealing in a 'wounded arm/hand' situation, but I'd like to find some dedicated training and tactics for permanently disabled. I don't want a fly-by-night instructor who wants to show off, but rather, tried and true training with some substance.

Thanks

Shadi Khalil
March 22, 2008, 07:47 PM
Well your profile says your in Japan, so that rules out my suggestion of contacting the local NRA office...Maybe check with one of our military instilations in the area? I dont know what kind of laws Japan has for firearms, do they encourage or tolerate civilian firearm ownership? If so maybe there are organizations like the NRA...

Shorts
March 22, 2008, 07:51 PM
Ahh, why does everyone immediately question location? :rolleyes: That's my concern and a tiresome thing to explain - in short, I know the laws, that's not the topic of discussion and we're Navy. Please stick to the question at hand.

Anyone else with possible leads on training?

pax
March 22, 2008, 08:58 PM
Shorts,

Every single one of the big-name instructors has some experience teaching disabled folks, but I'm aware of no dedicated classes specifically designed around disabilities.

The late Jim Cirillo used to teach classes which included a downed defender portion, allowing people to practice shooting from the ground following simulated injuries. While I've not yet heard of others teaching that specific component, if it hasn't happened yet it is only a matter of time before various schools and instructors realize that the hole needs filling. If I were shopping for classes as a disabled person, I would ask around to find who might be teaching the particular set of skills related to the downed defender.

One young man of my acquaintance is in a chair and has taken multiple classes from Tom Givens at Rangemaster, John Farnam, Massad Ayoob, and others. If you'd like I can put you in touch with him to talk about his training experiences. I'm sure his recommendations would be a lot more pertinent than mine.

Hope that helps.

pax

Shadi Khalil
March 22, 2008, 09:59 PM
Ahh, why does everyone immediately question location? That's my concern and a tiresome thing to explain - in short, I know the laws, that's not the topic of discussion and we're Navy. Please stick to the question at hand.

Man...

Location is irrelevent, noted. I was just wondering about the laws, and I didnt know you were navy, people live in japan for reasons other than military. Sorry for wasting you time. Good luck.

MLeake
March 22, 2008, 10:04 PM
Misawa is both an Air Force Base and a Naval Air Facility (Navy units on the Air Force base). It's up on the northern end of the northernmost Japanese main island.

To Shorts: Good luck in your quest, and congratulations on surviving a Misawa winter.

Cheers,

M

Shorts
March 22, 2008, 10:13 PM
Hi Pax, thanks for the options. I'd be interested in talking with the gentleman if he doesn't mind. I echo the sentiment of its only a matter of time before that niche is given some attention. Matter of fact, I've contemplated undertaking participation in getting that area off the ground once we get back (< 1yr now), assuming I got myself into a position to lead by example.

In WA I took an optional CCW course and I enjoyed it. I was also pleased how the instructor helped me adapt the moves for my abilities and now I would love to take that farther. Of course we've all seen advertisements and read others' experience doing a weekend course or a training school. It does make one want to attend. I know I do. However, I'm concerned the need for me to do things a bit different would drastically slow the pace and/or degrade the training. I guess it be trying to train for a marathon but only going out for a walk around the block, drinking a soda, pushing a stroller with the dog on his leash tied to the handle. Sure, the walk around the block is a start, but you aren't going to get into marathon shape like that. Specificity of the exercise is what will offer the best results.

Thanks MLeak :) I've been gone these last 3wks and I tell you I believe that's why I survived. I was REALLY growing tired of the snow. This is our 3rd winter here (2nd full one), but it wears on a person. It sounds as though you are familiar with them as well...?

teifmen1948, sorry, I hear "now I don't know all of Japan's laws, but" in more threads than I care to count when that isn't necessarily what needs to be known to answer my inquiry. Shotguns can be owned with a permit only for hunting & skeet/trap, and they are registered, mapped, and all ammo transactions are kept on record. Its a lengthy procedure to acquire the permit (training class, written test, practical test, medical/mental exam, background checks) and police have the final say so. You can be disqualified for being in the wrong political group. Without a permit, one cannot hold/touch a gun. Civilians owning handguns are prohibited completely.

As for goingto my local military installation, that would more than likely be of no assistance. Pistols are only loaned out to AD member in SF or those needing to requal. Let's not talk about ammo. As for the base itself, well, that's Air Force. You need lengthy paperwork just to pick your nose :p


Air Force - "I can't do that, it's not in the rules that I can"

Navy - "I don't see why not, nothing in the rules that say you can't"

pax
March 22, 2008, 10:29 PM
Shorts,

I've assisted on the line at FAS when people with various impairments were in class. In a well-run school, unless your difference is truly radical (and sometimes, even if it is), it is not going to slow the rest of the class down because the instructor won't let it. Similarly, the special needs student will nearly always get the benefit of learning the same basic skills everyone needs to learn, but doing them with whatever adaptations needed to make the skill work. (Example: when the class is doing reloads, the special-need student learns reloads. You may have to move to one end of the line so you can practice one-handed reloads without danger while everyone else is practicing two-handed reloads, but you'll learn the basic skill set along with the class and at the speed the class is learning it. In truth, this variant in skill sets is not much different than teaching a group which includes revolver reloads vs semi-auto reloads.)

Another option: one-on-one tutoring, which may be your best bet anyway. 'Most all the pros offer one-on-one to folks willing to pay for it.

PM me your email address. I'll pass it along. :)

pax

Shorts
March 22, 2008, 10:41 PM
PM sent

T. O'Heir
March 23, 2008, 01:07 AM
"...why does everyone immediately question location?..." Hi, Shorts. It's because Japanese firearm laws are extremely restrictive. Being U.S. Boat People doesn't matter. If you're stationed in Japan, you have to play by the local laws, off the base.
All that aside, if there's a base gun club, go talk to them. You'll likely find that most recreational shooters will help you even if they're somewhat confused how to help. Most will at least try.

Shorts
March 23, 2008, 02:12 AM
"...why does everyone immediately question location?..." Hi, Shorts. It's because Japanese firearm laws are extremely restrictive. Being U.S. Boat People doesn't matter. If you're stationed in Japan, you have to play by the local laws, off the base.
All that aside, if there's a base gun club, go talk to them. You'll likely find that most recreational shooters will help you even if they're somewhat confused how to help. Most will at least try.


Point is, location doesn't matter to answer my particular question. Too hard to swallow?


...lol "boat people" - but no, not SWO - Aviation, with wings, not fins.

MLeake
March 23, 2008, 08:52 AM
Shorts,

Only caught a bit of a winter there. Mostly popped through in summertime. However, as a P3 driver, was based in some fairly cold places.

Cheers, and Happy Easter.

M

Shorts
March 23, 2008, 03:41 PM
Happy Easter.

+1 P3 driver. I think up here they're called "penguins" :D

JohnKSa
March 23, 2008, 04:44 PM
Shorts,

Did you ever find a replacement for your Model 86? They're not so common these days, unfortunately...

Shorts
March 23, 2008, 05:11 PM
Hi John. I picked up a Commander as the replacement. As it was when I left, I was grooming the Oacp for carry, but I knew that 86 inside and out and in my sleep. I did happen upon a NIB 86 at the gun show I attended several weeks ago. It was at a table from a guy out of Houston (I grabbed his card). The price he had on it there at the table was $100 more than what I originally paid for mine in '04. We'll see, I might go in search of one again. It was the first pistol I owned so there's a bit of attachment.

Thing about that Cheetah on the table, I memorized the serial # so I could reference it against my inventory (knew it wasn't from looking at it, but had to check). As it turns out, mine was numerically ~400 higher than the one there.

Marty Hayes
March 23, 2008, 07:50 PM
Any reputable school should be able to incorporate a one handed individual in thier regular training courses without skipping a beat. Wheel chairs are a little tougher, as sometimes the physical layout of the ranges is an issue. I would recommend signing up for the type of course at the place you want to train at. As a courtesy, inform the instructor ahead of time (upon enrollment) so they can prepare properly if necessary. Then, train...

Shorts
March 24, 2008, 03:21 PM
Thanks Marty. I'll do that.