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glennfish
December 12, 2007, 04:42 PM
My wife has caught the bug and wants basic CQC training. We live in Minnesota and it seems like most of the local classes that we can find on the web are 2 hour pep talks with a 50 round drill shooting blindfolded at gallon milk jugs-- Learning to use the force I guess--Bring your own 1911 or light saber.

Two questions:

1. Are there any good civilian courses (like gunsite) in the Minnesota area

OR

2. Can anyone recommend out of state classes where the training is 1st class BUT my wife wouldn't be intimidated by the chief training macho, and the students don't have to live in a desert tent or trailer 50 miles from the nearest restaurant that doesn't specialize in A-1 flavored road-kill?

Pahoo
December 12, 2007, 07:44 PM
Glad you asked, I'm sure there are many you can go to but this is one that is offered in our area. You won't be disappointed.

http://www.midwesttraininggroup.net/

TWB
December 12, 2007, 11:34 PM
It's a long trip, but worth it: Gunsite. All business, no bull, no testosterone fueled BS. The women in my class did exceptionally well, and started from a level of zero skill. One had an avowed disinterest in guns and shooting. Not surprisingly, she was a California Valley Girl, with all the silliness and baggage that fits the stereotype. When the class finished, she was on par with everyone ekse. This proved to me that they can teach anyone to shoot, and handle a gun safely.

John Farnam (http://www.defense-training.com/) is an itinerant trainer who trains without bluster or foolishness. His wife Vicki is one of his trainers, and she has written a book about training women to shoot. Vicki is an outstanding trainer and is as good as the best I've ever seen. God help the lunatic that decides to shoot it out with her. They have classes for women only, if that helps. Their schedules gets lengthy as the year progresses, and they usually have classes up North.

I've had others, but they did not match up to these two in quality.

twb

pax
December 13, 2007, 12:33 PM
2. Can anyone recommend out of state classes where the training is 1st class BUT my wife wouldn't be intimidated by the chief training macho, and the students don't have to live in a desert tent or trailer 50 miles from the nearest restaurant that doesn't specialize in A-1 flavored road-kill?

Come out to Washington state, to the Firearms Academy of Seattle (www.firearmsacademy.com), where Gila Hayes teaches women-only classes at the foot of the beautiful Cascade mountain range.

pax

PaulBk
December 13, 2007, 12:41 PM
+1 on FAS and Gila (and Marty too).

Pax - Was FAS affected by the recent flooding?

-Paul

pax
December 13, 2007, 01:35 PM
Paul,

Nope, not a bit. Their driveway had water flowing over the gravel in the low spot, that was all.

People down in town weren't so fortunate. :(

On a gun-related note, a few of us pooled all the rifle-cleaning supplies we could find, and helped the Veteran's Museum rescue all of their old firearms and related cutlery that spent two or three days covered with river mud and rust. Not a pretty picture, but handling the old weapons was cool.

pax

TexasSeaRay
December 13, 2007, 01:39 PM
I'll throw in kudos for Gunsite as well.

I'm leery as hell of most training facilities that advertise or offer close quarters combat. Heard too many bad stories from civilian friends and acquaintances. Too many SEAL wannabes "teaching" those courses.

But Gunsite is okay. Strictly business and very professional.

Jeff

Rob Pincus
December 13, 2007, 02:23 PM
You might want to contact Defensive Edge (http://www.slr15.com/training.html), they are in Minnesota and Sully does conduct training. He's taught rifle and armorers courses for me out at Valhalla and is a 100% good guy to train with.

-RJP

Brian@ITC
January 16, 2008, 07:42 PM
We are coming to Northern WI in April 2008. You might want to check our schedule out. The first course we are putting on is our Advanced Pistol Fighting Course which is a reality based training course. In fact, SWAT Magazine will be publishing an article in the April issue of 2008 regarding a course review by one of our students.
______________________
Brian K. LaMaster
President -Innovative Tactical Concepts, LLC (www.right2defend.com)
Instructor - Counter Force (www.counterforceinternational.com)

Ninj500
February 23, 2008, 09:19 PM
That edition of SWAT magazine hits the news stands on March 18th.

Shane Tuttle
February 24, 2008, 11:50 AM
Glennfish,

If you want to travel to Michigan, I know a guy right up your alley...

Randy Cain. He's a disciple of Gunsite and travels to Michigan, Florida, Arizona, etc. by way of Tennessee. My wife and I went to his Handgun 101 class last May and are planning on taking his CQT this June.

His classes are dynamic enough to have a complete novice and 15 year law enforcement individuals in the same class and both will benefit from every minute. The other plus is that he does NOT allow macho attitudes in his classes. Women are treated with utter respect. He doesn't care if you're male or female. He WILL correct you in front of the whole class. However, he picks on everybody and uses it as a tool to teach, not intimidate.

It was the best money I've ever spent for training and we're willing to do it again. I think if you get a group together, he's willing to travel to your area so that you don't have to cough up travel expenses. If you're willing to go to Michigan, those locations have hotels and good food nearby. PM me if you're interested. Maybe we'll change our minds and go to 101 again. I know one of our friends that we met there last year is doing it again in May I think.

Here's his website. www.cumberlandtactics.com

Frank Ettin
February 28, 2008, 06:54 PM
Gunsite is at the top of my list. Great facilities and a fine, courteous, professional staff. I was there in 2001 for handgun (250) and in 2006 for rifle (270). I also recently had a class locally from Louis Awerbuck, and that was well worth the time and money.

Lloyd Smale
March 1, 2008, 05:37 AM
i give ccw classes too. The NRA course i teach is not going to give you much in the line of mastering a handgun. About all it does is prove you know how to handle a gun safely and let you pull the trigger a couple times. If it were my wife id take the money your willing to spend on a high dollar school and buy a pile of ammo and bring her to the range and let her get intimate with her gun. Courses like gunsite and others are great schools and have great teachers but for the average person that isnt going to see combat as a soldier or a police officer your going to be paying for training that really isnt needed. If you yourself dont feel you know enough to teach her. Ask the instuctor that gives you your ccw if he would help or recomend someone. I have a running deal with anyone that takes a ccw class from me that if they want more range time i will take them for an afternoon of one on one at my range for free. Heck ive even been know to provide the guns and the ammo. I probably loose money but feel better knowing that someone who is struggling is probably safer after i do it.

Frank Ettin
March 1, 2008, 10:54 AM
Lloyd, I disagree. I think that a course like the basic five day course at Gunsite is still not enough for a soldier or police officer. I'd actually consider it pretty much the minimum for a private citizen who wants to achieve some level of basic proficiency, assuming it's followed up with consistent practice.

I don't think there's any substitute for good, professional training.

Shane Tuttle
March 1, 2008, 06:06 PM
Courses like gunsite and others are great schools and have great teachers but for the average person that isnt going to see combat as a soldier or a police officer your going to be paying for training that really isnt needed.

I think every minute of training that my wife and I got from Cain was 100% useful in the everyday world. Have you been to Gunsite's training?

W. C. Quantrill
March 1, 2008, 08:18 PM
I have been to Gunsite, but for my dollars, the absolute most top shelf school in the country is Suarez International.

Here is their training schedule for this year.
http://www.suarezinternational.com/tech.html