View Full Version : Lazy D - question on Manson Muzzle crowning toolkit
October 31, 2007, 10:57 PM
I've noticed that you posted several times about Dave Manson muzzle crowning toolkit. What are the features you like about these tools and did you notice any improvement
in accuracy or consistency after refacing muzzle crowns
with use of Manson crowning tools? How many pilots do you have at this time? Thank you.
November 1, 2007, 08:00 AM
I don't have a Manson crowning kit, I will say if his crowning tools are as good as his reamers they will be first rate.
Another plus is, I've found Dave and his staff to be a true pleasure to do business with.
November 1, 2007, 06:26 PM
Ditto on that last comment. Long ago, when I first got my lathe, I spoke with Dave about getting a floating reamer holder. He saved me the money by describing how to make my own. I still use it.
November 1, 2007, 06:49 PM
My Grizzly 3 jaw runs out .001, along with the workpiece. My tail=stock is perfectly aligned - I've been chambering using a double alignment of the bbl. front and rear and my reamers jusr "suck" right into the hole (douglas bbls. are always concentric with their machining operations) with absolutely no trouble.
But, if you would be so inclined would you please give us some plans or a picture of that reamer floating tool.
Thanls in advance --- Harry B.:)
November 2, 2007, 06:07 AM
Dave Manson is top drawer. I would not hestitate to buy any of his products.
November 2, 2007, 07:21 PM
My shooting Buddy has the whole set and we crown 4 or 5 rifles a month. The thing puts a crown on that through the lupes looks much better than the crowns on new rifles or even some customs. We have improved every rifle we have done and some have been unbelievable . A 336 in 35cal went from 3" at 100 to below an inch. It took 10 minutes and the rifle barrel does not have to come off to be crowned. We put them in a vice muzzel up and put the pilot into the bore and secure it ( it expands to the bore and locks firmly with no slop). Use a little cutting oil and the flat cutter. Once the barrel is flat(about 50 turns of the cutter) we remove the shavings and use more cutting oil and the 11 degree cutter about 30 turns, clean off the shaving and check it with the lupes. If it is razor sharp , and it is almost every time, if not 10 more turns of the 11 degree will do it. clean and use the outside bevel cutter around the outside for a perfect crown every time .Best money you can spend and you never have to remove the barrel. My 25-06 Remington went from 2" at 300 down to 5/8" at 300 yards. It shoots like a benchrest rifle now instead of a hunting rifle. OUTSTANDING IN EVERY WAY!!!!!
November 2, 2007, 08:21 PM
That's good info. Manson is not too far south of me here in Michigan. Sounds like a good investment getting the tools to do muzzle crowns.
Dave Manson's brother is a gunsmith in New Mexico. Both are smart guys.
November 2, 2007, 08:58 PM
No French in the spell checker, either. ;). But seriously, glad to hear of your success with the tool. Not a surprise to me that it works well, considering the source.
I first became concerned about floating reamer holders when I watched an acquaintance mess up a .308 chamber. He used a through-the-spindle setup with a spider to center the barrel on the outside back end. He indicated out the chucked end of the bore in a 4-jaw chuck. His tail stock was also indicated into perfect alignment, but where he blew it was that he then depended on a tailstock Jacobs type chuck to hold the reamer. Unless you buy an Albrecht chuck, you can usually count on several thousandths of an inch of mis-centering in standard chucks. So, of course, the pilot flexed the front of the reamer into alignment, but the back portion remained off-center and was only cutting on one of the reamer's edges. The back of the chamber came out way too fat. Cartridges ejected from it would not even fit into a .308 RCBS Precision Mic.
What Dave Manson described just starts with a foot of 5/8" cold rolled steel. You drill out an inch of one end 7/16ths for the reamer stems (I slightly under-drilled and used a half mil oversize 7/16" chucking reamer to get a close fit). Then you cross-drill the hole for tapping for 10-32 thumb screws to tighten to the flats on the stem. You turn the other end, if necessary, to fit your tailstock chuck. Just ahead of where the holder will emerge from the chuck, you turn one inch of it down to 1/4". Right in the middle of the rod, you also turn one inch of the length down to 1/4".
That's it. The 1/4" lengths are flexible enough so the rod will articulate several thousandth rather than allow the reamer to fail to follow the bore axis evenly. The drawback over the stubbier commercial floating holder designs is that it uses up almost an extra foot of lathe bed.
November 3, 2007, 06:03 AM
Very interesting info, gentlemen. I appreciate it.
Raktrack, glad to hear you have so much success with Manson crowning tools. I know Dave Manson a bit, and fully agree with others that his stuff is of a great quality and he himself is one of the most knowledgable and helpful guys in gunsmithing industry.
Did you try to crown handgun barrels? I can imagine his crowning tools should do pretty good job on fixed sight revolvers in particular (where signts are integral with the frame and the barrel and can not be moved to correct point of impact). One guy I know had a problem with his
revolver shooting 2 feet off the point of aim at 20 yards, he told me it was crooked crown (from the factory), and
after crown was refaced with Manson tool, it supposetly
fixed point of impact, placing it on average at just 3 inches from the point of aim. It sounds like a radical change. Any comments from you on handgun crowns will be appreciated. Thank you.
November 3, 2007, 06:28 AM
We have not used it on pistols, however the expandable pilot needs about 3" of barrel to align perfectly with the gauge Manson sends with the tool. I don't think you would be able to do snubs but Dave Manson would be glad to give you info.
November 3, 2007, 06:54 AM
I'll call Dave Manson on Monday.
November 3, 2007, 08:41 AM
That is amazingly sinple - of course most good things are. Thank you so much - I'll get one made!
November 25, 2007, 05:00 PM
Used Manson Crowning Toolkit on 5 rifles, revolver and pistol barrel. Exceptional results. Will post pictures later.
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