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shooter71
January 29, 2007, 01:30 PM
ok go easy on me..its my first senario :D

in a carjacking senario with a guy at your car window pointing a firearm at you and demanding you get out do you:

A. get out and watch the guy drive off with your car

B. get out while inconspicuously drawing your own firearm and when the guy gets behind the wheel you let him have it

C. "put what you would do here"

ATW525
January 29, 2007, 01:43 PM
C. Put the accelator to the floor, hunch down as best I can and hope I don't get hit (by either bullets or other cars). I would cut around the first corner that I could to get myself out his line of sight. Once I felt I was safe distance away I would dial 911 and report the incident to the police.

markj
January 29, 2007, 02:02 PM
in a carjacking senario with a guy at your car window pointing a firearm at you and demanding you get out do you:



If a gun was pointed at me. I would do as asked, hoping for a chance to retaliate in some way. GTetting shot isnt high on my list. Always keep the doors locked and window up.

If I could give it gas and leave, then that would also work. But as I said getting shot isnt an option for me.

shooter71
January 29, 2007, 02:13 PM
i guess i should have put ..if you cant get away..as in youre in a mall parking lot and the only option is to toss it in reverse and chance hitting someone or 3 other cars .. which you prb wouldnt do

Samurai
January 29, 2007, 02:34 PM
Floor it. Chances of getting shot are too high if you get out of the car. Chances of getting away are nil if you get out of the car. Grab the wheel, and as you floor it, pull your body and head as far forward as you can.

Here, you're basically talking about triage/damage control. Once you've got the gun pointed at you, your survival rate is not good. If you get shot in your car, you can likely drive to help. If you get shot on the street, or worse, if the carjacker tries to relocate you, the chances of getting to help is almost zero.

Floor it. Who cares what you hit.

ATW525
January 29, 2007, 03:11 PM
i guess i should have put ..if you cant get away..as in youre in a mall parking lot and the only option is to toss it in reverse and chance hitting someone or 3 other cars .. which you prb wouldnt do

I have insurance that will pay for the damage to my car and to other cars I hit. When my life is on the line the "rules of the road" no longer apply. On a related note, you should always park so that you can drive straight out, even if it means backing into the space.

SundownRider
January 29, 2007, 03:20 PM
Situational Awareness
First things first, if I see anyone hanging around my car who is not supposed to be there, I am immediately suspicious and alert.
If I get into a car and previously unseen perp manages to point a gun at me while demanding I get out of the car, I will get out of the car. Obviously, he could have killed me first, then taken the car, which he didn't do. Not a car on this planet is worth my life.
If I got out and he said "Goodbye" then I'm in full fight mode, since I figure he's going to try to kill me. I will do anything to put him out or kill him.

whip1
January 29, 2007, 03:40 PM
Option B, is not an option. If you get out of the car, and the BG has possesion of the car, there is no longer any threat to you. If you pull a gun and shot him as he is about to drive off, it's not self defense.

If fleeing isn't an option, then give him the car. Try to have your weapon ready if it gets worse. If he only wants the car, let him have it. In most scenario's, if the BG already has you at gun point, you're going to have a hard time getting the jump on him. If he sees you pull a weapon, he's most likely going to pull the trigger before you can raise your weapon.

ATW525
January 29, 2007, 04:27 PM
Obviously, he could have killed me first, then taken the car, which he didn't do.

Though it's a possiblity that a carjacker could just shoot you dead and take the car, in most of the carjacking murders I've heard about the victim (or victims) is either killed once they're outside of the car, or kidnapped and killed elsewhere. After all, it makes logical sense that if they want your car, they likely don't want it messed up with your bodily fluids. Blood splatters across the inside of the windshield tends to draw unwanted attention when you're driving down the street.

GalilARM
January 29, 2007, 05:16 PM
In no way is this an absolute, but most carjackers want your car for just that...your car. They arent really looking to kill someone, the gun is just there for intimidation and coercion. If you floored your car in forward or reverse to try and escape, I doubt that the guy would start shooting. Your actions would have drawn attention to the spectacle (hopefully) and the guy would probably just slink away. Again, this isnt an absolute certainty ever, but I'd say 9 times out of 10 your best bet is to try and flee/avoid the problem, not stay and shoot it out.

Dwight55
January 29, 2007, 08:03 PM
C. If my wife, son, grandson, etc. is also in the car, . . . the door is locked and windows are up 99% of the time (1% is when I forget).

Simply put, . . . if the above is the case, . . . he may as well shoot, . . . he is not getting my ride with my family inside.

I also already know (situational awareness thing) if there is anyone behind me, . . . and if there is not, . . . the car or van goes into reverse, . . . hard right turn on the wheel, . . . and if he's not very fast, . . . he's a pancake for the LEO's to scrape up, . . . if he is fast enough, . . . I'm going after him with the car, . . . I haven't seen a handgun yet that can stop one dead in its tracks.

May God bless,
Dwight

Haterade
January 29, 2007, 10:19 PM
I've often wondered this myself. I think that would probably be my most likely reason to use my CCW, since I drive a reasonably nice car. Of course, I also realize that my car is just a car and it's not worthy of a fight over... however, I do read the news, and they will just as often shoot you than not, even if you give up your car... at least that's my impression.

Who knows. I try to watch my mirrors and I like to think that I'll see someone rushing my vehicle. I suppose I would pay even more attention at night in a questionable neighborhood than in broad daylight on main street.

Given that scenario, I hope I would be prepared. I'm not exactly itching to get in a fight over a car, but given the possibilities, I would most likely toss up my hands, tell him I'm getting out and when I go to unbuckle my belt... I would lean forward a bit to mask my intentions, then come out with the .45 or whatever I was carrying. I figure I'll have a second or two on the crook and be able to get at least 2 good shots. Of course, I don't have a family and if they were in the car, that would seriously impact my decisions. If I'm alone, I'll take my chances... it's even odds that if I got out with my hands out they would still shoot me... I would prefer to go out shooting than with my hands up... this is against crook carjackers mind you.. not some traffic stop or something.

I have more confidence in my CCW than my car to help me escape danger. I certainly wouldn't want to risk running over some pedestrian in my haste to escape. I'll stand my ground, I guess... and take my chances. I'm not losing sleep over it. I hope that if the situation ever did come up that I would be able to make the best decision under those circumstances.

towerclimber37
January 29, 2007, 10:35 PM
something happened like you said not too long ago in south Carolina.
A BG walked up to a man who was getting into his car. His wife was already in the car. The BG demands the keys to the car and the MANS' WIFE opened the glove box, shucked a pistol and commences to shoot the crap out of the BG.
He ran and was later arrested in the hospital.
turns out he was wanted for *count em* 9 other robberies in Columbia, SC.
I would say shoot the crap out of the guy.
MOST criminals expect a certain type of behavior..they're used to it. Many of them don't train with their firearm like we do with ours. they can't because they carry them illegally. If the BG sees behavior that doesn't fit the pattern they're used to they usually try to get away.
If it were me, I'd have to fight. Not because my car is worth it but because I have NO idea of his intentions as he doesn't abide by the laws of our society so there's no telling WHAT he would do.


Elliott

Rugged
January 30, 2007, 06:20 PM
A) let him have my car.

you wnna make it interesting? Tell me that my baby is in the back in her carseat and I don't have time to get her. Then we go to option c.

Option c was already discussed. Pedal to the metal. to hit my kid, bullets would have to go through the tailgate of my truck, the back of the bed, the back of the cab, the seat and the carseat. No pistol caliber handgun bullet will do that.

For myself Ill just have to rely on the fact that thugs almost never hit who they're aiming at. They're trying to shoot me, they'll hit an 11 year old girl, probably related to them, 3 blocks away.

ford f150 v 9mm ..... gimme the ford.

9mmsnoopy
January 31, 2007, 09:36 PM
"Option B, is not an option. If you get out of the car, and the BG has possesion of the car, there is no longer any threat to you. If you pull a gun and shot him as he is about to drive off, it's not self defense."

It might not be a self defense claim, i dont know the law everywhere, but in Texas you have the legal right to stop the theft of your property, in this case a car. It happens all the time, just this last week in Houston a guy shot a BG who was stealing his car from his driveway.

whip1
January 31, 2007, 10:55 PM
Snoopy, they do things a little different in Texas. If I shoot a guy in Ohio because he's stealing my car, I go to jail.

Vitamin G
February 1, 2007, 07:53 AM
I agree that option B is no option at all.
I mean really, who wants to get blood on the inside of their car!


I'd get out and pop him repeatedly. There's no danger at all really, Grand Theft Auto 3 and other assorted video games has taught me that I can take multiple hits from an AK-47 and shrug it off. I'll just mapquest myself the nearest healthpak, go pick it up, and go on about my business.

Whats the problem?

JohnKSa
February 1, 2007, 03:10 PM
It might not be a self defense claim, i dont know the law everywhere, but in Texas you have the legal right to stop the theft of your property, in this case a car. It happens all the time, just this last week in Houston a guy shot a BG who was stealing his car from his driveway.The law in TX does allow the use of deadly force to protect retrieve property in limited situations, but it's nothing nearly so clearcut as the legal right to shoot to stop the theft of your property.

Here's the entire text of the law:

§ 9.41. PROTECTION OF ONE'S OWN PROPERTY. (a) A person in lawful possession of land or tangible, movable property is justified in using force against another when and to the degree the actor reasonably believes the force is immediately necessary to prevent or terminate the other's trespass on the land or unlawful interference with the property.
(b) A person unlawfully dispossessed of land or tangible, movable property by another is justified in using force against the other when and to the degree the actor reasonably believes the force is immediately necessary to reenter the land or recover the property if the actor uses the force immediately or in fresh pursuit after the dispossession and:
(1) the actor reasonably believes the other had no claim of right when he dispossessed the actor; or
(2) the other accomplished the dispossession by using force, threat, or fraud against the actor.


§ 9.42. DEADLY FORCE TO PROTECT PROPERTY. A person is justified in using deadly force against another to protect land or tangible, movable property:
(1) if he would be justified in using force against the other under Section 9.41; and
(2) when and to the degree he reasonably believes the deadly force is immediately necessary:
(A) to prevent the other's imminent commission of arson, burglary, robbery, aggravated robbery, theft during the nighttime, or criminal mischief during the nighttime; or
(B) to prevent the other who is fleeing immediately after committing burglary, robbery, aggravated robbery, or theft during the nighttime from escaping with the property; and
(3) he reasonably believes that:
(A) the land or property cannot be protected or recovered by any other means; or
(B) the use of force other than deadly force to protect or recover the land or property would expose the actor or another to a substantial risk of death or serious bodily injury.
So, all of the requirements in 9:42 AND 9:41 must be satisfied before deadly force can be used.

Posession of the property must be lawful.
Force (not deadly force) is immediately necessary to recover property
Owner must be in FRESH pursuit or force must be used immediately
Owner must reasonably believe the other had no claim (can’t shoot the repo guy) or the theft had to happen by “force, threat, or fraud against the owner”.
Deadly force is reasonably believed to be immediately necessary to prevent:
Burglary
robbery
aggravated robbery
theft during the nighttime
the thief/robber/burglar from escaping with the property
AND
There’s no other way to protect/recover the property without exposing the owner to “substantial risk of death or serious bodily injury”.

At least one person has suggested that insurance is a "way to protect/recover the property without exposing the owner to substantial risk of death or serious bodily injury."

And THAT's before we even get into the cost of legal representation (just because you don't go to jail doesn't mean you won't go to court) and the likelihood of civil suits.

Hook686
February 1, 2007, 07:18 PM
I pick A.