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divemedic
October 29, 2006, 02:09 PM
I shot in a classifier this weekend, and a debate started that I hope you can clarify. On stage 3, the disagreement was on the use of the barricade.

One side of the debate claimed that your feet must remain behind the barricade, planted in a box 24” wide, with the shooter leaning progressively farther out as the targets are engaged.

The other side claimed that the shooter merely had to keep his legs behind cover, as viewed by the target being engaged. That is, as long as the lower body was invisible from the target’s point of view, and the shooter leans out to engage the target, the shooter is considered to be behind cover. This would allow the shooter to step to one side as each target is neutralized.

Which is correct?

Jim Watson
October 29, 2006, 02:16 PM
All I can find in the rules is in the definition:
"A Bianchi style Barricade is 24 inches wide by six feet tall; shooting box is 24 inches wide and does not necessarily have to have a back to it.

I say you have to keep your feet in the shooting box while shooting. Or at least ON the box edge.

If you don't agree, I suggest you wire Robert Ray at HQ and ask him.

HiPowering Along
October 29, 2006, 09:52 PM
The feet must stay in the box - both the classifiers I attended had that in effect. Procedural penalty if you step outside it.

If you email HQ and ask about "stepping on the box sides", please post the answer....:D

divemedic
October 30, 2006, 06:34 AM
Your points about the "shooting box" were the ones made by the side stating you had to be ebhind the barricade.

The other side used this from Appendix 3:
"However, in most instances, the safety officer can position himself so both the shooter’s gun and relationship to the targets can both be observed."

Which would indicate that one must only be behind cover in relation to the target. I sent an email to the IDPA. I will post the answer when I get it.

Jim Watson
October 30, 2006, 07:34 AM
OK.
Good luck with your @#$%^&* bedroll lawyers.

divemedic
October 31, 2006, 09:56 AM
You have no idea. Some of them even whipped out a tape measure and argued over targets that were misplaced by less than 6 inches.

DanV1317
October 31, 2006, 11:53 AM
at local matches sometimes they do not are as much, but in a real clasifier, you must keep both your feet in the box behind the baracade. You cant move your feet out of the box, no matter how much you have to wrap your body around the baracade to see the target. You will get a penalty if you do.

GoSlash27
October 31, 2006, 06:44 PM
Plus you must expose no more than 50% of your upper body to the target. It's easier than it sounds so just have fun with it.

Jeff22
November 29, 2006, 05:15 AM
Try to remember not to crowd your cover. It's easier to engage the targets and still appropriately use cover if you're back about an arm's length or so. It's also easier to engage the targets from behind low cover if you shoot from double kneeling.

Stage 3 has often been my downfall for some reason -- I tend to crowd cover, which results in my contorting funny to engage the targets, and then I sometimes shoot too fast besides . . .

jmorris
November 29, 2006, 09:46 AM
Aim and shoot on stage 3, it's not a time to hose targets. Do a RWR on string 1 and a tac load on string 2. If you aim you'll be a class higher. Remember a miss is a shot with a 2.5 second split.

robertbank
November 29, 2006, 10:20 AM
If you got guys walking around with measuring tapes I would strongly suggest you encourage them to switch to IPSC. ONn of the nice things about IDPA is we shouldn't have to engage is this type of nonsense. We aren't playing this game to win a million bucks. Up here it is all about having fun, enjoying the competition. Remember when you were a kid playing scrub baseball. For us all we have changed is the type of game we are playing.

Take Care

Bob

Hotdog1911
December 20, 2006, 03:31 AM
It was at a IDPA match. You had to shoot from behind cover, a wooden 55 gallon barrel lying on its side. I rested the butt of my 1911 on the barrel and center-punched all the BGs with the butt of the gun on the top of the cover for all my shots. The nimrod scoring the stage said next time I'd have to expose less of my body or he was going to add some penalties. Idiot.

I agree your feet need to stay behind the barricade, always, for a Bianchi style stage. Keeping your ballance is part of the game. But the I_Dont_Practice_Anymore crowd says they want to be 'practical'. O.K. If you score maximum points on all the BGs from that posittion, behind cover, and they, the BGs, have all been neutralized or aired-out, what's the problem exposing a bodypart to a past threat? "Yah, but..but...but...the rule book says..."

It's course design. If you want the shooter to stay behind cover then spell it out in the walk thru. Sometimes you stay behind cover because there maybe a threat out there that you can't see. And sometimes you expose yourself, for a small period of time, to get into a better position to finish the job. In real life you must incrementally expose parts of your body to properly 'Slice the Pie' or do a 'HammerHead Shark' drill. People are lasy and don't think things thru. Most of the time the competitors, or, a competitor, finds a new way to solve the problem in a way the designer never thought of and offends his ego. Ewww. Game-player. Bad. Evil. Yea, right.