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View Full Version : Sleepwalking and firearms


Freetacos
October 23, 2006, 11:28 PM
Some people are chronic sleepwalkers, sleeptalkers, and night fidgiters. Since there have been extreme cases of people sleepwalking naked through golf courses, walking into a 7-11, or just simply getting up to make a peanut butter sandwich, how much of a leap would it be for such a person to engage a loaded firearm next to their bed while in an unconscious state?

Hook686
October 24, 2006, 12:41 AM
About 30 years ago, a serial rapist was hitting houses in my section of the city. He would get in through a window at night. I took a single action revolver to bed with me, after he hit just a couple blocks away. I did that once, for I woke up in the morning and the gun was cocked, and in the bed between me and my wife ... it had started out on a book case/head board.

I do not know who cocked it, but I sure have no memory of it. I don't think it is a good idea to have a loaded gun, within reach, in the bedroom.

Axion
October 24, 2006, 12:48 AM
Hook that story is crazy. When i was little I used to sleep walk occasionally. I once, while staying the night at a friend's house, nocked on his parents door and aksked for an extra blanket all while I was sleeping. I didn't even know it happened for many months untill someone told me about it. Makes me re-think keeping a gun in my nightstand.

chemist308
October 24, 2006, 12:55 AM
hmmm wonder if that would make a decent aliby...
LMAO
i'm a fan of not having a loaded firearm under the pillow...

Blackwater OPS
October 24, 2006, 03:50 AM
I keep all most of my guns loaded, and almost all are stored in the bedroom. It's not something I will change unless I have kids. An unloaded gun, or one that is out of reach or in a safe, won't do you much good if your door/window gets kicked in. If you are a heavy enough sleeper that you could walk around and still not wake up, it seems like you might even have to worry about waking up to find someone ALREADY in your room! In that case, maybe you should lock it up, since they might just take it from you while you drool on your pillow.

I don't sleepwalk, I am a VERY light sleeper.. FYI, it's a bar to enlistment if you do(and admit it I guess).

GoSlash27
October 24, 2006, 05:28 AM
What's the downside to keeping a loaded firearm in a quick access safe next to the bed? That's what I do. :confused:

FS2K
October 24, 2006, 05:30 AM
I used to suffer from extreme Insomnia. You know that main charater on "Fight Club? That was me. I would stay up for 3 days on the average but have gone as long as 4 1/2 days without sleep. No, I have never taken Meth in my whole life and since having this don't even drink coffee any more.
Sometimes when I can't sleep I will clean some of my guns...which ends up being a pain in the butt because it'll feel like a dream sometimes and I need to check my weapons to see if I put it back together right when I wake up. Anyway, during one of my stints I decided to go sight in a couple of my rifles at 4:30am. I live in the country and have my own "range" I made out in the woods 2 miles away from home. So I loaded my guns, put them in their cases, carried them out to the car along with the stuff I needed to sight in my guns, and got into the drivers seat.

I wake up at 11:00am in my garage, sitting in my car. Startled I make a quick check of my surroundings then get out of my car to unload my stuff and that's when I discover that I didn't just fall asleep in the driveway, I went shooting first. I had gone through 8 AR magazines, and didn't have any targets with me. SPOOKY.

I have since made it a point not to touch the gunsafe when I can't sleep. Cleaning guns is no longer on the list of things to do to get tired. The memory of that mornings session is like a dream, I can only remember bits and pieces. One thing positive came out of all of this; my guns were both sighted in perfectly when I checked them after that.

My doctor now has my Insomnia under control and has for 4 years now, but that was THE worst episode I ever had. It's no leap Tacos, it's for real and I can attest to it.

Double Naught Spy
October 24, 2006, 05:52 AM
FS2K has an excellent story that illustrates just what all can happen. In more severe cases, sleepwalkers can perform complicated tasks. Putting a gun in a quick access sort of safe isn't going to stop a severe case.

Some people manage to cook, clean, move furniture, etc. in their sleep, so grabbing a gun from a safe, loading one, etc., would not be all that big of a deal from a task perspective.

Big Calhoun
October 24, 2006, 09:50 AM
I think if I were to develop a sleep-walking issue, I'd rethink my strategy of loaded guns around the bed. As such, I don't suffer through such issues so a loaded pistol under the pillow, on the side of the bed, under the mattress, whereever, is not much of an issue.

OBIWAN
October 24, 2006, 10:54 AM
Exactly why my handgun is in a lockbox that requires me to get out of bed to access it

Half awake is no way to operate a firearm

If you are worried about someone sneaking into (or kicking into) your bedroom you need more layered security

Blackwater OPS
October 24, 2006, 12:16 PM
Half awake is no way to operate a firearm

Just my point, whenever I hear some thing *wrong* in the middle of the night, I am FULLY awake instantly, my brain is quick to pump the good juices.

If you are worried about someone sneaking into (or kicking into) your bedroom you need more layered security

Here in LA I have to worry about home invasions. Think SWAT team entry. And, as I have said before, there is no reason for a real SWAT team to hit my house so I am assuming it's criminals, but I don't intend to die in any case. In a situation like that, every second counts. If I have a few extra, I will toss on some tac armor. I'd rather be doing that then trying to find a handgun. My primary HD gun is not a pistol anyway, so not quick access safe options there.

Samurai
October 24, 2006, 12:30 PM
I sleep like the dead. I have awakened in weird places other than where I went to sleep, but it's always been because someone carried me.

I keep my guns in a large oak trunk in my bedroom, under lock and key. To access them, I'll have to get my keys, unlock the bolt, and then reach in, grab magazine and pistol, load mag, rack slide, and go to work. I can do this in a matter of seconds, VERY quietly.

I keep several CQB weapons nearby in case of kicked-in door. A katana rests in the window sill above my bed. In one fluid movement, I can sit up from any position, grab it, draw it, and cut through the entire room in about 2 seconds. Two hunting daggers are on one nightstand, and an asp is on the other. At the door are two splintered halves of a broken broomstick (one about jo-length). Various bokens, clubs, and other implements are scattered around the room. A heavy steel statuette sits on the nightstand with the asp.

I'm not worried about sleepwalking. I'm a little worried about making my fiance angry, but I'm not worried about sleepwalking.

Wildalaska
October 24, 2006, 12:51 PM
This thread has to be a joke.

WildlikesomeothersrecentlyAlaska

Freetacos
October 24, 2006, 01:04 PM
Alaska, I don't mean to hurt your feelings but your little signatures involving your user name really are annoying to most people here.

Blackwater OPS
October 24, 2006, 01:09 PM
Alaska, I don't mean to hurt your feelings but your little signatures involving your user name really are annoying to most people here.

You are just jealous because you didn't think of it first.

Wild you are always quick to call people paranoid for their habits, but when it happens to you, your tune changes quick. I remember you saying you had come to some sort of realization that CCW was silly and paranoid, until you were nearly robbed outside your shop. How do you feel about it now?

Wildalaska
October 24, 2006, 01:15 PM
I remember you saying you had come to some sort of realization that CCW was silly and paranoid, until you were nearly robbed outside your shop. How do you feel about it now?

Black I think thats a misquote. CCW in and of itself isnt silly and paranoid...its some of the more extreme methods.....:)

Me I usually carry my little mousegun, no reloads, no surefire, no body armour....:)

WildandiwenttowalmartyesterdayanddidntcarryatallAlaska

Wildalaska
October 24, 2006, 01:17 PM
Alaska, I don't mean to hurt your feelings but your little signatures involving your user name really are annoying to most people here.

Gee, the last time I took a poll most folks wanted me to keep it :)

Notice how you use the term "little"...psycologically, thats a subtle denigration indicating your superiority over me....care to fit that into an anlysis of your political beliefs?

WildandmyfeelingscantbehurtitsthenetrememberAlaska

Freetacos
October 24, 2006, 01:24 PM
:D Alaska, just relax. Anger is self punishment.

UglyGlock
October 24, 2006, 02:18 PM
I am not annoyed by his signatures.

- UglyIlikewildalaskatypesignaturesGlock.

OBIWAN
October 24, 2006, 02:18 PM
I guess different rules apply for the majority of us (I hope) that are not under the constant threat of being overrun while we sleep

BWOPS- In your case maybe claymores would be better than an alert canine;)

In my case, I tend to be the wide awake guy when one of the cats throw up.....but I still occaisonally find myself bumping into walls trying to get into the bathroom at 3am

Probably just a training issue

To each his own....but if it were me I might use my Tac Armor budget to relocate


FT- how many words would you say are in a BIG signature?
or are you just sore that Ken thought of it first

OBIimustnotbeoneofmostpoepleWAN

springmom
October 24, 2006, 02:22 PM
Alaska, I don't mean to hurt your feelings but your little signatures involving your user name really are annoying to most people here

And you can speak for all of exactly HOW????????

Careful, Wild, he'll have you on the couch and come up with a DMS-IV diagnosis for your sig lines next. :D

SpringIlikehissiglinesalthoughtheyaresometimesabithardtoreadmom

springmom
October 24, 2006, 02:25 PM
And now, in regards to the TOPIC (which is NOT Wildalaska):

I keep my Kimber on the bedside table next to me. I insist that Archerandshooter have HIS handguns in the safe, for exactly this reason. Over the years he's sleepwalked any number of times, and while I don't think he can work the safe while sleepwalking, he sure as heck could work a trigger.

So the loaded handgun is with me. If something goes awry in the night, I'll wake up fully and then I'll wake him up and cover him while he (wide awake) gets the shotguns out of the safe.

But yes, this is a concern, and if you sleepwalk, add a layer of protection between yourself and your gun.

Springmom

Samurai
October 24, 2006, 02:25 PM
C'mon guys, can we stay focused?

SamomygodmyusernameisnotacompoundwordthisisterriblehowcanIparticipateinthefunifIcannotproduceoneofwildalaskasrunonsentencesignaturesbecausemyusernameisnotacompoundwordurai.

OneInTheChamber
October 24, 2006, 02:44 PM
I use a Bianchi Model 82 (the CarryLok one) to store the bedside gun while sleeping (when I'm gone its in the safe). That way it requires some sort of motor skills to get to the firearm.

I don't sleepwalk at all; I've been known to once or twice a year say something in my sleep though.

Blackwater OPS
October 24, 2006, 02:45 PM
Oh, if only I could get some claymores.....

Wildalaska
October 24, 2006, 02:45 PM
Geez stop guys, its bad enough when I do it:D

WildtrendsetterAlaska

meanoldman
October 24, 2006, 03:22 PM
What happens if the SHTF while you are sleepwalking? Can't be unprepared. Need to plan for all contingincies.

Meanoldwhatcaliberisbestwhenthealiensattackandyouareasleepman

Samurai
October 24, 2006, 03:30 PM
Zombies? .50

And if you're asleep? .50 with a shot of espresso.

SamawjeezIjustdiditagainnowIhavetocomeupwithanotheroneofwildalaskassignaturesurai

springmom
October 24, 2006, 03:35 PM
Guys, you just said the two words that are going to get this shut down if we don't get back on track. The Z word and the S... acronym are no-nos and this really is an important thread.

And Wild, you're an inspiration. We can only follow where you lead.

Springbesidesit'sagreatwaytogetinalastwordmom

Trip20
October 24, 2006, 05:18 PM
No sleepwalking in this household. I don’t lose any sleep over the issue (neat, a pun).

While it is possible as shown in above anecdotes, unless you have a known or otherwise diagnosed sleepwalking problem, having a loaded pistol with in reach is not going to then cause you to begin sleep walking and wielding a deadly weapon.

So fear not unless you occasionally wake up naked with 8 spent AR mags in your lap resulting in a gun safe full of perfectly sighted in rifles. In which case, I might invite you over to stay the night as I often can't make it to the range for that same task.

Freetacos
October 24, 2006, 07:26 PM
springmom, enough brown nosing, stay on topic kido. :D

BILLDAVE
October 24, 2006, 08:17 PM
I rarely sleep walk, but one time i opened my safe half awake/sleep. Kind of woke up staring at it open. I had no idea why i was opening it so i closed it and went back to bed. It scared the hell out of me. The next morning i unloaded the S&W model 60 in my nightstand. I waited about two months before i returned the S&W to active duty. Once i felt it was a aberration.
I think is very likley to have an accident if you sleepwalk often and keep a loaded wepon in reach. Get a bat or knife for the bedroom.

cpaspr
October 24, 2006, 08:28 PM
appears to be:

If you, or others who share your bed or have access to your bedroom during the night, suffer from sleepwalking episodes, it is probably not a good idea to have immediate access to a loaded weapon.

And in some rare cases, having it locked up in the safe still may not be enough to prevent access by an otherwise sound asleep person. For them, and you know if you're one of them, you may want to consider having them locked up offsite. Like this place: http://www.thebaronsden.com/baronsden/accessories/Safes.htm

Now THAT'S a gun safe!

springmom
October 24, 2006, 09:30 PM
Of course, grabbing your shotgun out of that in a hurry might be a problem :D

I don't worry about Archerandshooter grabbing the gun off my table; but if it were on HIS side, that would be a bad idea. If somebody's a sleepwalker, he doesn't need to be able to sleepwalk with a gun in his hand:eek:

Springmom

FS2K
October 24, 2006, 10:03 PM
But it is a serious issue for those who do, or have had to. In my case it wasn't so much being in a deep sleep...it was the exact opposite. I was operating in a half sleep, half concious, half sleeping. When I sat "sleeping" I mean your mind in a resting state. Going for days without sleep is brutal to the body as well as the mind.

The human mind is an incredible thing. My situation REALLY scared me but at the same time I was intrigued by it, I mean, think about this for a second; I was able to drive (shifting, braking and all that) set up my targets, loaded my weapons and went through the motions of sighting my guns in. That takes thought processing, is the bullet hitting high and to the right? Then I had to adjust the sights accordingly.

I don't believe any lock or security device that you can operate while fully awake can keep you from getting to your guns while half awake. The best way to describe how it feels while on the 3rd day without sleep is like running on automatic. You just do what you always do without really putting any thought into it. You can have conversations with people on the phone and not remember anything you said. Then when you do finally get to sleep and wake up, it's hard to seperate what really happened or what you may have dreamed.

There is a kinda fuzzy memory of doing stuff, but it's the same kind of fuzzy memory you get when trying to remember what you dreamed about the night before. It's spooky and I am not at all proud of what happened to me. I just thought I would share to let you know it CAN happen.

BamaMac54
October 24, 2006, 10:11 PM
I'm digging this thread. It's definitely something to think about for those of us who sleep more deeply.

Bamaicouldntresistmakingmyownsigandlikewildimightbeabigdudebutcarryaseecamplws32Mac54

spacemanspiff
October 25, 2006, 02:08 PM
A few weeks ago this chick came over, and she was telling me the next day that when she woke up she was shocked she didn't notice all the guns in the room. She was ready to pick them up an start blasting away.

Needless to say, when she comes over now, I make sure I have removed all live ammo from the room and have a chamberflag inserted in the semiautos. She really has taken a shine to the Winchester 1300 though.

And I do such a good job hiding the live ammo, it took me two days to find my loaded AR mag.

spacemanidon'tsleepwalkisleepdroolspiff

CobrayCommando
October 25, 2006, 02:24 PM
A few weeks ago this chick came over

Suspicions abound...

:)

Wildalaska
October 25, 2006, 02:28 PM
A few weeks ago this chick came over

Think twice, post not at all :)

WildomywhatanopeningAlaska

tydephan
October 25, 2006, 02:52 PM
So fear not unless you occasionally wake up naked with 8 spent AR mags in your lap resulting in a gun safe full of perfectly sighted in rifles. In which case, I might invite you over to stay the night as I often can't make it to the range for that same task.

I'm sorry but that's funny, I don't care who you are! No offense to FS.

But it is a serious problem. My wife sleepwalks. Sometimes I think she is not nearly as clumsy sleepwalking as she is awake-walking. She also has a habit of waking up in the middle of the night yelling that someone is after her. I keep a loaded handgun in the nightstand but I don't keep a round in the chamber (I have a young'un). I don't want to wake up startled and start blazing away at my wife's manifestation.:eek:

tydetoolazytoconjureagoodwildalaskasignaturephan

spacemanspiff
October 25, 2006, 03:33 PM
Suspicions abound
Heyyyy nowwww!!!!! Be nice! Its entirely plausible that it might have happened.
Think twice, post not at all
Kee-ripes, and I didn't even get to the good part of the story yet! Good thing its 'off-topic' to TFL. :D

For once it didn't end up with me getting slapped with a TRO or getting sprayed with OC.

springmom
October 25, 2006, 03:37 PM
A few weeks ago this chick came over, and she was telling me the next day that when she woke up
....:eek: :eek: :eek:

Now I'm going to have nightmares. Good thing AS doesn't have a gun on his side of the table....when I wake up screaming from THAT mental picture....

Springmom

BerettaBuckeye
October 25, 2006, 03:44 PM
True story, my one and only ND happened while I was asleep. When I was much younger and still living with my parents I used to keep a G20 in my nightstand drawer, condition 3. Long story short, I woke up shortly after dozing off with a smoking Glock in my hand, a .40 cal hole in the wall and my dad yelling my name. Apparently I had gotten the gun out, RACKED THE SLIDE and put one through the wall all while asleep. I was VERY glad to learn the 175 Silvertip stuck in an interior stud and never exited the house. If you believe it or not is up to you but there it is

spacemanspiff
October 25, 2006, 03:47 PM
You are so off the Christmas card mailing list, springmom!

:p

Dirty_Harry
October 25, 2006, 05:45 PM
I am a pretty heavy sleeper, but I do keep a loaded shotgun next to my safe...which is close to my bed.

I have never been known to sleepwalk, but I am a sleeptalker and a heavy snorer!

auberg
October 25, 2006, 06:17 PM
If I may, Many years ago, when I lived in my apartment, I had a SW 4509 (I think). I used to keep it on the floor under my bed, so that it was handy if I ever needed it. The way the apartment was laid out, I could see the front door from my bed. One night something wakes me up, (so I though) and I "see" someone leaning over my tv and stereo which were in an entertainment center next to the door. I reach under the bed, brought my knees up to use a brace to get a solid sight picture with, and truly was ready to fire. I guess about that time, my head cleared enough to realize no one was actually there, and that I always keep my pistols in condition 3. It wasn't going to go bang anyway.

I can tell you my heart was racing just as if someone was actually in my apartment, but I'm not sure if it was from the dream or the thought I was prepared to let one go half asleep. And it has never happened again, because I don't keep my pistols quite that close anymore.

FS2K
October 25, 2006, 06:25 PM
So fear not unless you occasionally wake up naked with 8 spent AR mags in your lap resulting in a gun safe full of perfectly sighted in rifles. In which case, I might invite you over to stay the night as I often can't make it to the range for that same task.


Trip20! YOU WERE IMAGINING ME NEKKID WHILE READING MY REPLY!!!!! Naughty boy...Naughty, Naughty. :) EEEWWWWWWWW!

I'm sorry but that's funny, I don't care who you are! No offense to FS.


None taken tydephan! Not at all. That was funny!

Eh...it wasn't all spookiness. I kinda miss waking up in the afternoon to find my kitchen and living room clean as a whistle!

springmom
October 25, 2006, 06:32 PM
I kinda miss waking up in the afternoon to find my kitchen and living room clean as a whistle!

So do I, but it's been since my oldest child was born since THAT has been the case...:eek: :D

Springchildrenaremessymom

22-rimfire
October 25, 2006, 06:38 PM
Interesting posts. If you sleepwalk or anything approaching this condition, keep no loaded guns in your bedroom. The mind plays strange tricks on you when you aren't all there (ie consicious).

If you have poor eye sight (uncorrected) and you are a paranoid type about home intruders, I would also suggest you think hard about the loaded gun under the pillow thing. Again, the mind can play strange tricks on you and add vision to that, shadows can look like a lot of things.

I second the comment on Wild Alaska's annoying one word posts. I refuse to try to read such a thing.