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AKhunter
February 21, 2006, 08:44 PM
Have any of you heard about this incident? Here is the link: http://www.2theadvocate.com/news/2343136.html A few comments: It seems that the dead guy had already been shot in the stomach by the cop in question. The shooter gave one verbal command for the dead guy to get off of the cop, then shot him four times in the chest. A second verbal command was followed by a fatal shot to the head. What have you heard in addition to this? What do you think?

AK

Dwight55
February 23, 2006, 07:29 PM
The way I read it, . . . it seemed to be a necessary shooting, . . . but you never know how everyone else will take it.

An Ohio State Patrolman shot and killed a guy in southern Ohio a couple days ago, . . . the guy first tried shooting the patrolman with a .45, . . . they rassled for control, . . . he wouldn't give up or give it up, . . . the officer pulled his own weapon and shot him in the side of the head, . . . ending the confrontation.

The news played it up that the officer had other options, . . . "Why did he shoot him in the head????"

You just don't know.

May God bless,
Dwight

sterno
February 23, 2006, 08:04 PM
I haven't really heard anything else about it.

I think it was a justified shooting. Here in Louisiana you can use leathal force to preserve someone else's life if the someone else that is being attacked would be within their legal rights to use it.

Besides, what does that guy think? He can attack a cop and not risk getting shot? Not that cops should go around shooting people that give them trouble, but come on. You play with fire and you get burned...or shot.

rapier144
February 23, 2006, 09:04 PM
Whats rassled mean? I couldn't find it in the dictionary.

XavierBreath
February 23, 2006, 10:57 PM
Armed Citizen Saves Cop in Baton Rouge (http://xavierthoughts.blogspot.com/2006/02/armed-citizen-saves-cop-in_114058863533452150.html)

On Friday, Feb. 17, 2005, a CCW holder armed with a .45 caliber handgun saved a policeman's life in Baton Rouge, Louisiana.

Officer Brian Harrision was escorting a funeral procession when he pulled over 24 year old George Temple II, a local businessman, to write him a ticket for breaking into the procession. That's when Temple physically attacked Harrison. During the struggle, which went to the ground, Officer Harrison shot Temple once in the abdomen. Police say Perry Stevens, who was wearing a neck brace and using a cane, was walking out of a store when he heard Officer Harrison yelling for help. Harrison was on his back with Temple on top of him. Stevens went to his car and grabbed his .45 caliber pistol.

Stevens ordered Harrison's attacker to stop the attack and get off the officer. The verbal commands were ignored. The armed citizen fired four shots, all of which struck Temple in the torso. With Temple still on top of the officer, Stevens advanced toward the struggle. He again ordered Temple to stop the attack, and get off the officer. Those commands are ignored. Stevens then fired a fifth and final shot into the head of George Temple, turning his brains into mush, and stopping his deadly attack with justified lethal force.

No charges have been filed. (http://www.2theadvocate.com/news/2343136.html)

gb_in_ga
February 23, 2006, 11:11 PM
Rassle defined (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/rassled).

GodblessAmerica
February 23, 2006, 11:52 PM
I read details of this incident on THR yesterday. Sounds like a legitimate shoot to me. XB, do you have any details of Steven's shooting position in relationship to the struggle? I'm just envisioning how hard it would be to get off 5 shots into the perp without any chance of overpenetration into the officer, unless perp was sitting up on officer and well exposed from all sides.

AKhunter
February 24, 2006, 12:39 AM
That 's pretty much how I felt about it. I especially like that the CCW shooter was wearing a neck brace and carrying a cane. Hardly a menace to society, eh? No tactical BS, no trash talk, just common sense and a steady hand. Very Nice. My new hero.

AK

SBrocker8
February 24, 2006, 08:16 AM
I think it's tragic that there's people out there willing to fistfight, and by extension DIE (you fight with a cop, you SHOULD know he could well kill you) over trying to get ahead in traffic by breaking into a funeral procession. I mean, c'mon, seriously, HOW BAD could that ticket be? A few hundred dollars??? Perhaps this is an issue where the gene pool needed to be cleansed, though, as this guy was obviously not all there, and seems to have an extensive rap sheet.

I'd also be interested in the dynamics of this shoot. Where the perp was, where the shooter was, and where the cop was for each shot.

Al Norris
February 24, 2006, 08:38 AM
Some facts have come out on this incident. I had the links to post over at THR, but someone beat me to it. Wasn't posted here, so I deleted the links.

The perp was some kind of amateur or semi-pro boxer. He had several convictions for battery and the like. He had the officer on the ground, was sitting atop of his chest while he repeatedly beat the officers face.

At one point, the officer had managed to get his service pistol out and had fired 3 times, only once hitting the perp in the abdomen.

The Samaritan was exiting the store when he heard the officers cries for help. He retrieved his .45 and ordered the perp off the officer. The perp ignored the order so the Samaritan fired 4 shots into the torso of the perp and again ordered him to stand down. The perp ignored the order and the Samaritan fired once more into his skull. Aggression stopped. Gene pool cleansed.

Bo Hunter
February 24, 2006, 11:29 AM
Maybe the armed citizen should have had a .45 instead of a 9mm because everyone knows 4 shots to the chest with a .45 would...oh wait.....;) :D

In all seriousness though - anyone know if the guy killed was on anything but an adrenaline high? Anyone know what type of ammunition the shooter used? I'm surprised, if it was a close range encounter, and those were 4 good shots center mass, that the 5th shot was required. Just goes to show you - hand guns are small!

TexasSIGMan
February 24, 2006, 11:34 AM
No no no, Rassling (http://www.wwe.com/) defined :D

Mr_Magoo
February 24, 2006, 11:37 AM
5 shots hit and the perp was still attacking . . .
A head shot sealed the deal.

Was PCP a factor?

riverrat66
February 24, 2006, 12:16 PM
Aggression stopped. Gene pool cleansed.
Amem to that! Only thing is he wasted four shots. He just should have put one in this guys pumpkin and got it over with! Mr. Stevens deserves a medal. :D

bclark1
February 24, 2006, 12:29 PM
a 24-year-old "business owner" driving a mercedes who cuts into a funeral procession... sounds shady to me. i didn't like him without the criminal record, glad we know he's - was - a tough though too. anyone who would disregard others that flagrantly, anyone who would start a deadly-force altercation with a cop over a ticket... i'm glad he kept fighting and got himself done in, taxpayers shouldn't covering somebody like that. may someone cut off his funeral procession.

i didn't like how the first article was written. the references to old event create kind of a "wild west" spectacle of cops and CCW'ers.

DennisD
February 24, 2006, 03:07 PM
Sounds like Temple was suffering from what I like to call SBS (Spoiled Brat Syndrome). I live in a small town near Houston and unfortunately I run into this type of driving just about every day when driving into the city on business. A lot of people drive really aggressive; they use turn only lanes and shoulders to pass, flagrantly run stop signs and red lights etcetera. I call it SBS because it is my theory that they were spoiled brats when growing up and never outgrew that behavior (and a lot of them were also bullys when young). They seem to think they are more important than anyone else and don’t have to obey the law or show respect for anyone else. They live their lives just like they were spoiled little kids. Then when they get caught “Oh, it wasn’t my fault, it was because (fill in the blank here)".

riverrat66
February 24, 2006, 03:34 PM
Breaking into a funeral procession shows a total lack of respect and I would consider this a mercy killing, ya know just cleansing the earth of all the garbage. Temple was supposedly some kind of amateur or semi-pro boxer and had several convictions for battery and the like. Saying he was a bully is putting it mildly! No one will miss him.

nscale
February 24, 2006, 03:34 PM
DennisD you got it right on my friend :)
I live near Houston too and you are right. And what about the crime rate going up recently since we have the refugees looking for an easy target here in the Houston area?

If you think you are above the law...It can get you dead:D

invention_45
February 24, 2006, 04:37 PM
DennisD and nscale:

You should try driving in Miami and surrounding areas for a day or two. I think the cops have just given up.

For some reason, this thread brought to mind a bumper sticker I saw in the '80s. "Come Back to Miami...(we weren't shooting at YOU)".

rapier144
February 24, 2006, 04:47 PM
Four shots with a .45. Must have been ball ammo.:D

bclark1
February 24, 2006, 05:08 PM
simunitions? rat shot?

BerettaBuckeye
February 24, 2006, 05:47 PM
The city of Baton Rouge should give Mr. Stevens a medal AND the scumbag's Mercedes.

marks655
February 24, 2006, 06:16 PM
Whats rassled mean? I couldn't find it in the dictionary.

Get a copy of the book: "How to Speak Cajun"

Ironic that he joined a funeral procession .... Almost like going to your own funeral...

Glockamolie
February 24, 2006, 06:19 PM
I guess we should all start putting some money together for this good samaritan's legal defense from the civil trial that's sure to take place. :rolleyes:

rapier144
February 24, 2006, 06:24 PM
If that happened in tennessee he wouldn't have to worry about being sued. Good samaritan law would protect him from lawsuits.:cool:

delta58
February 24, 2006, 07:22 PM
Some people think that the rules only apply to other people. It sounds like SBS to me too.

jcoiii
February 24, 2006, 07:25 PM
Good shooting with the pucker factor no doubt in effect. 4 hits COM, then 1 to the head. Wow.

OneInTheChamber
February 24, 2006, 07:35 PM
Shows you even the .45 isn't the man stopper people make it out to be. I think he did a great job. This is the reason ccw is so good. Good job to him; using his pool skimmer in .45 caliber to clean the gene pool.

LICCW
February 24, 2006, 09:10 PM
I definitely want to know the details on the ammo, position of shooter and BG. I think the guy who can take 4 shots center mass and not stop from a .45 is on something more than just vitamins. PCP, steroids? I guess that solves the caliber vs. shot placement question. I commend the good samaritan for his cool head and correct actions. Good job.

Chris1911
March 7, 2006, 03:30 PM
4 shots center mass +1 in head with a 45? This has really made me re think my choice on carrying ANY concealed weapon short of a 454 casull:confused: The guy must have been DRT, he just didn't know it yet? Maybe there's something we haven't heard yet, I want to see it on video, then i'll believe it..LOL

Chris1911
March 9, 2006, 12:05 PM
I heard an update on this incident...I don't know how old it is but for what its worth here it is: Apparently, the CCW holder's second shot would have been deadly and incapacitating to the offender according to the coroner who performed the autopsy (a + to anyone carrying a 45 LOL)... There's no law stating that you can't keep firing until the threat ceases to exist...I would have kept firing too.

Have you guys heard about the NAACP? I am absolutely horrified by these people...They are demanding action be taken against the officer and the good samaritan. I don't care what color your skin is, if you are a violent felon with prior history and you nearly beat a cop to death over a traffic ticket for a FUNERAL procession you interrupted, you get whats coming to you..What is this society turning into? Have people lost touch with reality?
Sorry if I'm venting

Chris 1911

XavierBreath
March 9, 2006, 12:20 PM
Bleeding heart related article (http://www.2theadvocate.com/news/2335111.html)

A better article (http://www.wafb.com/Global/story.asp?S=4540153)

Chris1911
March 9, 2006, 03:09 PM
I do feel awful for the Temple family...It must be awful to lose a family member in such an awful way, or in any way...But this exists in every shooting.....The victim (criminal) always has family, friends, acquaintances giving eye witness testimonies to "what a good person he was", "he wouldn't hurt a fly", but the truth is, why was Mr. Temple a violent convicted felon? Was it because he was "harmless", and "well-reserved"?

Think about this: Is it not true that most people try to be a bit more reserved around their family, around the people they love and care for. For instance, we might talk differently to our "buddy down the street" then we do to our mothers.....And that is what blinds these people...Sure, Mrs. Temple probably remembered her son as that loving and kind person who volunteered all of his time on the weekends.....But that's probably because he never tried to beat the tar out of her.......What I am trying to say here is that sometimes the people who love us have a unique image of us....People try to remembe the best of the people they love, often things that aren't the best balance of a person's character...A surreal image so to speak...

Double Naught Spy
March 11, 2006, 10:05 AM
Jeez 4 shots COM, 1 to the head
I definitely want to know the details on the ammo, position of shooter and BG. I think the guy who can take 4 shots center mass and not stop from a .45 is on something more than just vitamins. PCP, steroids? I guess that solves the caliber vs. shot placement question. I commend the good samaritan for his cool head and correct actions. Good job.

Being shot multiple times is nothing new and it most definitely does happen, on occassion, to folks not on drugs, pcp, alcohol, or anything else other than adrenaline. There is a good chance that if the guy wasn't going to collapse immediately after the first two to the chest, he probably would not have collapsed with any more until bleeding out which can take a while, or via a CNS shot which turned out to be shot 5 for the samaritan.

I heard an update on this incident...I don't know how old it is but for what its worth here it is: Apparently, the CCW holder's second shot would have been deadly and incapacitating to the offender according to the coroner who performed the autopsy (a + to anyone carrying a 45 LOL)... There's no law stating that you can't keep firing until the threat ceases to exist...I would have kept firing too.

While the second shot from the samaritan might have been deadly, a mortal wound, it obviously was NOT incapacitating. In the words of the guys from the FBI when describing Platt during the fight in Miami, Platt was dying, but was not dying fast enough. Platt's kills happened after he was mortally wounded.

XavierBreath
March 11, 2006, 10:30 AM
Temple attempted to bribe Officer Harrison to get out of the traffic ticket (http://www.2theadvocate.com/news/2437541.html). He had several thousand dollars in cash in his pocket. Public bribery is a felony in Louisiana. Thus, Officer Harrison was arresting a felon when he was attacked by Temple.

More. (http://xavierthoughts.blogspot.com/2006/03/baton-rouge-ccw-shooting-update_10.html)

An eyewitness account. (http://www.wafb.com/Global/story.asp?S=4540153)

Latest info shows Temple had no drugs or etoh in his system. He checked clean. Anger can create the same effect of withstanding wounds that would otherwise incapacitate.

riverrat66
March 15, 2006, 05:44 PM
Temple was an out of control thug, period! According to court records, he was already on probation for simple battery and simple damage to property at the time of his death. As the eyewitness says "the officer took quite a beating". But naturally the NAACP is going to make this into a racial thing, "Just simply that Mr. Temple punched the police officer is not enough," said Baton Rouge NAACP President Kwame Asante. Simply punched the police officer! Can you believe that? This guy beat the cop to a friggin' pulp! Mr. Stephens should have saved 4 bullets and simply put one into this guys noggin' and got it over with.

I wonder how Temple's family would feel if I tried to cut into his funeral precession?

I wonder what the NAACP would have to say if Temple was white and the cop was black?

nefshooter
March 17, 2006, 03:36 PM
Someone should buy the guy a box of bullets to replace the ones he used!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:D

Walter
March 23, 2006, 08:56 PM
It sounds like a classic case of "'roid rage" to me.
http://whyfiles.org/090doping_sport/5.html

Walter

C Philip
March 23, 2006, 09:05 PM
I thought that all states had a "good samaritan" law? Or is there a specific one that applies to deadly force? If so, what states have this law? Is PA one of them?