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View Full Version : Advice needed on fired cases not ejecting and getting pushed back into chamber.


Seraphim
June 30, 1999, 08:22 PM
I’ve got a G21 that is not ejecting the spent case after firing. The spent case is being partly pushed back into the chamber ahead of the new round. The following round is not even leaving the magazine. This is a relatively new, stock gun. I’ve put maybe 800-900 rounds through it. The malfunctions have happened with several magazines, and all types of factory FMJ and JHP ammo from American Eagle to Triton +P rounds. I have had other people shoot it, which only produced the error twice, and changed my grip to every conceivable combination. I’ve tried the “death grip”, sand bag, cupped, wrap around, etc. I, being the primary shooter, have had the most jams. It will usually shoot fine for four or five rounds and jam on the six or seventh. When cleared, sometimes I can finish the magazine, and sometimes it will immediately jam again. I simply don’t know what else to try.
Now here’s the rub, I simply DON’T feel comfortable sending the gun back to Glock. YES, I understand this is the “right” thing to do. I also understand that many people have done this in the past without incident. I simply don’t want to do it. I am mechanically inclined enough to replace the parts I may need to replace, and I’m not overly concerned about voiding the warrantee (If you feel the need to flame me on this, do what you must). I understand all the implications. I simply want so advice from those out there who may have experienced this problem and may be able to give me a couple of things to try. IF, the cost of these possibilities becomes too high, or I simply can’t remedy the situation myself, I PROMISE, I will take it to a qualified gunsmith. For now, I just want some constructive advice and a chance to LEARN about the functioning of my weapon. That may be the key; this is primarily a LEARNING experience.
Thanks,
Sean

GLV
June 30, 1999, 08:53 PM
Go to a Glock Shooting Sports Foundation match, and have one of there factory armorers check the gun. Take all of your magazines.

Did you buy the gun new? Are you sure all of the parts in the gun are stock and correct for the Glock 21? When gun does work, how many rounds in the mag? How many magazines do you have, and are they numbered so you can track the malfunctions? Where does brass fall when gun works? What is the condition of the fired brass?

From the described position of malfunction, it sounds like one of the following: Bad or incorrectly fitted extractor, too much recoil spring, underpowered ammo. All magazines allowing the accending round to sit too high, with ogive hitting the extracted round. Did this problem start from day one?

Hope some of this helps, GLV

Seraphim
June 30, 1999, 10:33 PM
GLV, Yes I bought the gun new. Yes, I’m sure all the parts are new/correct (unless Glock made a mistake at the factory). I usually fill the 10 round magazines (of which I own two, but have tried a couple of others from rental guns). Both of my new mags display the same problem. The brass usually hits me in the face (no, I shouldn’t say all, but it does fling at pretty far left and back over my right shoulder) I shoot a modified Weaver stance (being right hand left eye dominant). The brass looks O.K. there was a slight “cut” in the brass rim, where the ejector was running over the rim when the round was being fed. It was a pretty sharp and deep cut. But, I haven’t noticed it lately. I just figured the gun needed to be “broken in”. I’m not against the idea of having an armorer check the gun. I’m just hoping to learn how I can fix it, so I don’t HAVE to run to an armorer every time the gun malfunctions. I think I may try a different spring and maybe an extractor. Maybe, I’ll also try a new extractor depressor plunger spring. BTW, it’s not the money (o.k. there are limits to that), it’s the experience I hope to gain. I KNOW I can ALWAYS have it professionally looked at. I just want to try and do it myself.

“That which does not destroy you, only serves to make you stronger” - F.N.
Thanks for the advice,
Sean

George Stringer
June 30, 1999, 11:14 PM
Seraphim, in an semi-auto pistol the cause of this problem is usually a maladjusted extractor, too heavy a recoil spring or something causing the gun to short cycle like your thumb riding against the slide. George

James K
July 1, 1999, 12:46 PM
I doubt it is the ammo or the magazines.

Since the empty case is ahead of the cartridge coming from the magazine, I suspect extractor problems. If it were the ejector, the round rising from the magazine would come up under the fired case but wouldn't try to push it back in the chamber. If it were a short cycle, I would not expect the slide to come back far enough to try to pick up the round from the magazine.

The extractor may be chipped or broken. But it may not be the extractor itself. Dirt can work under the extractor and prevent it from engaging, the extractor spring can become weak or the plunger can become dirty or rust in its hole.

Jim

[This message has been edited by Jim Keenan (edited July 01, 1999).]

Seraphim
July 1, 1999, 11:12 PM
Thanks for the advice everyone.
I am nearly anal about cleaning. “Cleanliness is next to Godliness”. Actually I find it a nice “meditative” practice. I also enjoy polishing boots to a “shave in the toe” spit shine. Helps clam the soul and adds a feeling of closure to a day at the range. You know “Be the bullet” and all. It is sort of a religious ritual.
Anyway, on the advise from another (hiss!!! Completive message forum) I decided to check the gap on the extractor.
I field striped the G21 and placed a round under the extractor on the breach face. There is a good 1/32 of an inch between the rim of the round and the extractor notch face (i.e. a gap of 1/32 “ between the round rim and extractor) Or, if I were to pull the round forward until the “front” of the rim is resting on the extractor lip, there is a 1/32 of an inch gap between the back of the round (rim) and the breach face. Now, the round is held into place by the edge of the extractor pushing on the edge of the rim (the flat part of the extractor between the “lip” and the post that engages the safety plunger [the inside long part of a “squared “C”) pushing against the outside edge of the round’s rim. Thus, the round IS held into place, even if I shake the slide. If I do not retract the firing pin, I can not slip a round between the breach face and the extractor.

Do you have any idea how difficult it is to verbalize a visual image? I only hope my description will not be nearly as difficult to decipher.

On the advice above, I went ahead an ordered a new extractor and extractor depressor plunger spring. I will certainly keep you posted with my results.
If you have any further suggestions, feel free. I’m only up to about $20.00 w/ shipping. Well under a trip to the armorer. We’ll see if it works.

Thanks,
Sean

buzz riley
July 2, 1999, 11:16 PM
I saw this happen on a G-21 with an old style extractor that had a chip out of the very bottom of the claw. It was easy to miss in an inspection. It must have been a problem, since Glock came up with an upgraded 5-degree beveled extractor on the .45 and .40 cal guns. I'm sure that it could happen to a new style one too.
P.S. Is the extractor spring and plunger installed correctly?

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Blessed are the peacemakers: for they shall be called the children of God. Matthew 5:9

Harley Nolden
July 6, 1999, 08:15 AM
SERAPHIN:
Try "locking" the wrist and arm of the strong side. Force the arm forward, even if it comes partially out of socket. "Push" the arm forward as far as you can. Maintain the pressure forward until you regain Tgt acquisition. (Back on Tgt)

Many times when a Semi-auto recoils, the wrist breaks, the elbow bends some, thus countering the action of the gun.

HJN