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Ac1d0v3r1d3
June 2, 2005, 08:01 PM
How hard is it to get a full auto Ak47? i thought that the AWB that outlawed them had ended. i really dont know tho, i DO live in california after all.

4V50 Gary
June 2, 2005, 08:04 PM
You won't get one in CA. CA doesn't allow private ownership of full auto. You have to move to a friendlier state like Nevada or Tennessee and once there, find a dealer who has one (or a seller who can ship to the Class III dealer).

shaggy
June 2, 2005, 08:26 PM
And bring plenty of money.

Currently a full auto AK will run you between $14,000 and $15,000 for a conversion. I've seen as high as $20k+ for rewelded original type 56s.

I believe at one point full autos were legal in CA. LaFrance Specialties is located in CA and a few years ago I bought a LaFrance converted AK from a dealer in CA for the low, low price of $3900 (going rate at the time was $4500-5000). When it got to my dealer on a F3, he made me an offer on it and I sold it to my dealer for a tidy profit. In retrospect I wish I had kept it. A few months ago I tried to buy an AK and got screwed out of a deal for a full stocked Ciener conversion for about $12k.

4V50 Gary
June 2, 2005, 08:29 PM
That must have been decades ago when full auto AKs could be purchased by a Californian. We have Class 3 Dealers right now, but they can't sell to us peons. We can't be trusted by big brudder. :mad: On the other hand, we don't deserve to have them. Look at how collectively stupid we are to keep voting in Fineswine. :barf:

Hkmp5sd
June 2, 2005, 08:57 PM
I knew a guy back in the mid-80s that had a .45 MAC-10 on a Form 4 while living in CA.

i thought that the AWB that outlawed them had ended.
The AW ban had nothing to do with full-auto firearms.

Ac1d0v3r1d3
June 2, 2005, 10:26 PM
sad times, i'm actually moving to Washington State in about a month and was hoping i'd beable to buy a full auto at a decent price. oh well... i guess i'll just have to deal with it. Thanks Guys

shaggy
June 3, 2005, 09:12 AM
sad times, i'm actually moving to Washington State in about a month and was hoping i'd beable to buy a full auto at a decent price. oh well... i guess i'll just have to deal with it. Thanks Guys

The money for some of this stuff has gotten really ridiculous in the last few years. The ban has now been in place for 19 years and every year the prices get more steep. Lately though, AKs seem to have really gone through the roof. Transferable AKs have always been a little harder to find and a little more pricey. Probably the news footage of Iraq has sparked even more interest in AKs and spurred more demand for them. If you were thinking a full-auto AK would be on the less expensive side because semi-auto AKs are relatively inexpensive, you were dead wrong. The scarcity of registered full auto AKs has driven the prices into the stratosphere.

If you don't have your heart dead set on an AK, there are all sorts of other machineguns you can buy and many are much less expensive. Granted, its still not cheap by any stretch of the imagination, but there's plenty to buy under the $10,000 mark.

Just for reference, consider the following:

Thompsons start at about $13k and go up from there. There have been some Colt Thompsons recently advertised for as high as $40k
An MP5 will run somewhere in the $14k range
A non-Colt M16 will run you about $10k
An Uzi $6k-7k
Ruger ACC556 (full auto Mini-14) about $6k-$7k
Sten MKII about $4k
A MAC-10 in .45 $2800-3000.
M11-9 $2500-3000

Even at the very bottom, $2500 for an M11 is not cheap, but its still a great little subgun for the money. If you're just looking to get something full auto and aren't dead set on a rifle caliber, even an M11 would be a great start.

Ac1d0v3r1d3
June 3, 2005, 01:12 PM
this is depressing, i'm a college kid, on a college kid budget, so i'm not gonna have $3000 sitting around. Why do full automatic weapons cost so much? is it so us poor people cant have them?
Damn you Government ::shakes fist::

tanstaafl4y
June 3, 2005, 02:33 PM
Supply and demand.

Seriously if your not in a postition to drop $XX,XXX without though - Would you be able to afford ammo to shoot?

I know I sure can't.

boofus
June 3, 2005, 02:40 PM
is it so us poor people cant have them?

Yes, I think that was the general idea with all the MG laws. First the $200 tax that was double what a Tommy Gun cost in the 1930s and then the ban on manufacture of new MGs.

All the while the dimocrats claim they are the party of the 'little' people. You have to be a Dick Cheney or Reed Knight to own 20 or more machineguns now. :barf:

Hkmp5sd
June 3, 2005, 02:49 PM
Why do full automatic weapons cost so much?
In 1986, the government banned new machineguns for civilians. Only machineguns that were registered prior to this date are legal for civilian ownership. That means there is a fixed number (if not actually decreasing number) of full-auto guns available. They seem to be increasing in price at about $1,000-$2,000 per year.

cuate
June 3, 2005, 06:26 PM
Since 1934 or there abouts when the gangs and bootleggers had the LEOs outgunned, the Feds decided that ordinary citizens would not possess them without proper paperwork, background investigations and a tax stamp.

I have fired many automatic weapons both in the Military and at a Class III dealer's range. Psycologically when you are young and impressionable there is a rush of POWER but when you mature you begin to realize that its just Hollywood stuff and that there are more dependable weapons that are legal and available. Jeff Cooper thinks they are the birds and excepting the Military and Law Enforcement I tend to agree.

Go shoot a BIG .50 rifle and see some real power! We aren't soldiers anymore and are not born killers so settle down to what we have. Go shoot and have a ball but forget
full auto if you can;t afford it.

James K
June 3, 2005, 08:30 PM
I might be wrong, but I thought full auto weapons were totally banned in Washington state.

Jim

Hkmp5sd
June 4, 2005, 12:18 PM
They are.

shaggy
June 4, 2005, 03:18 PM
I have fired many automatic weapons both in the Military and at a Class III dealer's range. Psycologically when you are young and impressionable there is a rush of POWER but when you mature you begin to realize that its just Hollywood stuff and that there are more dependable weapons that are legal and available. Jeff Cooper thinks they are the birds and excepting the Military and Law Enforcement I tend to agree.

Go shoot a BIG .50 rifle and see some real power! We aren't soldiers anymore and are not born killers so settle down to what we have. Go shoot and have a ball but forget
full auto if you can;t afford it



Geez... :rolleyes:

Both a .50 and a machinegun give you that "rush of power", and neither is particularly inexpensive or significantly more affordable than the other. Its just a matter of personal taste. Full auto is not just "Hollywood stuff"...at least no more than shooting a .50. Whether you want to admit it or not, the simple fact is people own both .50s and machineguns primarily for enjoyment.

And with all due respect, I don't think anyone really cares what you or Jeff Cooper may think about the utility of machineguns in private hands. Its not about utility; its about a personal choice and the exercise of a right. The fact that you and Mr. Cooper apparently think full-auto is perfectly good and acceptable for the military and law enforcement, but "for the birds" when it comes to civilian possession belies the fact that full-auto is not just "Hollywood stuff". It may not be your cup of tea or Jeff Cooper's cup of tea, but to many people shooting a full auto is no less a valid way to enjoy the shooting sports and exercise the RKBA than shooting that .50.

As as for dependability, legality, and availability, full auto weapons are dependable, they are legal, and they are available. It just takes money and the will to jump through the proper hoops to acquire them in spite of government regulations designed to deter most people.