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View Full Version : M16/AR15 Rifle .223 recommend!


Colduglandon
March 11, 2005, 07:41 PM
I am considering the purchase of a rifle in .223. I would like to get something that I can use in a DCM style match. Whats out there that may be REASOSABLY priced, new or used. What should I stay away from. Have not fired one of these since Army days late 60s again in the Guards in the early 1990s. I know they did something to the rifling in between because the newer rifles seemed to have a flatter tragectory. Is it possible to pick up something used for under $700. Just got the notion to start looking for a different gun. Been rolling this around in the head for a month or so. There's lots of different makes out there.

WillBrayjr
March 11, 2005, 08:35 PM
Check out www.atlanticfirearms.com. They have all sorts of M16 type rifles. I'm sure you can find what you're looking for there. $800.00 will get a brand new M16 type rifle there! ;)

GaryXD
March 11, 2005, 09:10 PM
I would suggest instead of getting something that you will hate that is reasonably priced get something that is a good gun for the money like Bushmaster or Rock River Arms.

Tim R
March 12, 2005, 03:51 PM
What you will need is a standard A-2 or a rifle that looks like what is being issued. I believe the flat tops are now allowed do to the use of the A4's in Iraq.

The price you are looking at might buy a used AR type service rifle. If I were to buy a new service rifle, I would look at the RRA match rifle. The asking price is well over your price range but I understand shooters are very happy with them right out of the box. I would shop around with different dealers as the price will vary. You should be able to find someone who would sell a NM RRA for a little more than you are planning.

The reason for needing a special rifle over a regular A2 type is the twist rate of the barrel. If you get much slower than a 1-8 twist, the heavy bullets needed to compete with the 308 168 SMK's won't stablize. I would suggest a 1-7 twist. These will shoot the 77 and 80 SMK's without question. The 77's and 80 SMK's seem to be the most commonly used for a full across the course match which runs out to 600 yards. Another reason for the need of a NM rifle is you will have a better sight system. It's pretty hard to shoot well with battle sights, front post too wide and rear app too big.

Another thought to see if you would like High Power, and I know I sure do,
is maybe get a CMP M-1 and shoot a John C. Garand match. Same game, closer ranges and everyone is one the same playing field.

Go to a match. Every High Power shooter I know is more than willing to help a guy out. There might even be someone there that will loan you a rifle until you decide what to do. You do have to be careful though, the bug might bite you.

bikenjam
March 12, 2005, 10:01 PM
lets hear an Amen to GaryXD! After going the route of "cheap" and tring to save money, i've learned that for almost all cases you should spend the extra money on a quality product. that goes for most things in life. i don't think you'd get a quality DCM AR for 700 bucks. Armalite, bushmaster, DPMS, Rock River Arms are all good rifles for a little over 1K for DCM models. I just bought a DPMS National match upper for my AR- 15. Its nice to buy a product that works without any duck tape sawing required. So spend the extra money on a rifle that will serve you well for a lifetime.

kittyhawk
March 14, 2005, 04:00 PM
I have the RRA NM and love this gun It shoots soooooooooo good right out of the box. I have worked up my loads and it will shoot 1/2 or better most of the time. It is more accurate than I can shoot It has been the best Ar-15 I have owned and I have several.
By the way It might be for sale.
Dave

The Body Bagger
March 14, 2005, 04:07 PM
Easily done. Buy yourself a stripped lower for about $99 and build your own. DCM uppers can be had for $400.00 and it won't take $300 to build your lower with the amount of parts out there.

Colduglandon
March 14, 2005, 07:28 PM
Thanks for the responses.

I have an M1 which I purchased through DCM a few years back. Great rife.

Building a rifle from a lower is what got me interested when I saw a match DPMS upper, I think it was in Midway. Thats what got me thinking about one of these rifles. Like I said I don't know a lot about the various .223. Have not fired one in a while. This looks like a reasonable option. What should I look for in a stripped lower if I go that route. I have seen them around.

nobanforme
March 14, 2005, 09:12 PM
www.impactguns.com has alot of cool stuff, check them out. :)

The Body Bagger
March 14, 2005, 10:09 PM
www.aimsurplus.com (http://www.aimsurplus.com/acatalog/Stag_Arms_AR-15_.223_Receiver.html) AR 15 stripped lower black anodized Stag Receiver $99. Or RRA Stripped Lower $105.00 @ Impact (http://www.impactguns.com/store/RRA-AR0114RRA.html) Eagle Arms lower $100 from Quantico. (http://www.quanticoarms.com/armalite/eagleArmsReceivers.htm) or Stag Arms lower for $85 @ Eagle Firearms (http://www.eaglefirearms.net/stag_arms.htm)

FWIW I'd go with the Stag Arms lowers. The RRA typically have a VERY tight fit between upper and lowers of mismatched manufacturers. Thats not to say they aren't good, but you will most likely have wear some of the anodizing off to make them fit.

Colduglandon
March 15, 2005, 02:55 PM
Again Thanks

Made a trip to the Gun Shop today on my way home from Drs Office. Took a look at an Armalite $699 and a Bushmaster $899.

I will check out the web sites that you recommend and I noticed a thread on building an AR 15 on this forum so I will check that out as well. I will keep a look out at the gun shows as well for lowers.

This is going to be inetersting.

ghettopettingzoo
March 15, 2005, 03:06 PM
model1sales.com sells the kits for a very low price everything less the reciver

The Body Bagger
March 15, 2005, 08:58 PM
forget model1sales. that guy over there got Darth Vadered at gun show by a customer after he was mouthing off. AR15.com had the entire story including several eye witness accounts. Apparently the owner of model1 chased one of the ar15 members down and started calling him every dirty name in the book all because the gentlemen wasn;t interested in buying something. The model1sales guy then proceeded to get choked, held high in the air by one arm, feet off the ground, Darth Vader style, the ar15.com member finally had enough of being followed arround from table to table getting yelled and screamed at. There were enough witnesses and very few were aware that they were all AR15.com members until posting the story. I have a hard time in not believing the story.

Colduglandon
March 16, 2005, 07:29 AM
The issue of 5.56 and .223 intrigues me. Is that similar to the differences between military rifles chambered for 7.62x39 and commercial rifles that have a .308 barrel. I read something about that a few years back. Never followed up on it because I don't own a commercial version of these rifles. I always assumed that the ammo was interchangeable for both types of weapons those based on the Warsaw pact and the Nato round. Of course when reloading for the 7.62 x 39 you use the same diameter bullet that is used in the .303 enfield as I recall.
So much for assumptions.

GaryXD
March 16, 2005, 07:41 AM
http://www.ammo-oracle.com

Colduglandon
March 16, 2005, 08:46 AM
Gary
Geeez. Who knew there was so much to learn.
Good info, clears up a lot of concern over chamber size and manufacture markings. Looks Like 1 in 9 twist is a good choice. I was getting scared off with all the hype.

Logs
March 18, 2005, 12:19 PM
Check out www.centerfiresystems.com Star AR 15's for $699 NIB