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View Full Version : K98 or 12 ga. for HD


goosegunner
April 12, 2002, 04:09 AM
I have a wery limited gun collection, will my singel shot 12 ga.(with #00 buck) or my mauser k98(with V-max bullets) be my best choice for home defence?

Coronach
April 12, 2002, 08:40 AM
Is overpenetration a concern? If not, I would say the one that gives you more on-tap rounds the better, all else being equal. That would cause me to lean towards the K98.

Mike

CMichael
April 12, 2002, 11:09 AM
I would go for the 12 gauge. There is very little that is more powerful for close range. I think the stopping power is important.

Also, the ability to aim a 12 gauge is much better than a handgun.

Mihcael

C.R.Sam
April 12, 2002, 11:31 AM
Ranges inside home....both could be considered rifles. One is bout .73 caliber and the other bout .32 caliber. Penetration of the neighbor's house is a concern. Multiple round capacity of the Mauser is also a valid concern.

Boils down to your boiling down of all the factors in your particular situation.

Sam

goosegunner
April 12, 2002, 12:52 PM
overpenetration is no problem; walls in 3 directions are made of concrete, the last wall is of wood but the background is 5km of open sea. And the best plase to defend my home is in the top of a stairway, so the basement will be the backstop for most bullets.

ronin308
April 12, 2002, 01:25 PM
Its sounds completely nuts to use a K98 for home defense! :D But in your situation, IMHO its the best tool for the job. You get greater capacity and since overpenetration isn't a concern, you may as well use the Mauser. BTW- What weight are the V-Max bullets that you're using?

goosegunner
April 12, 2002, 03:05 PM
They are (.30-06) 110 gr., don't ask for the velocity - I don't know

Navy joe
April 12, 2002, 04:31 PM
110gr Vmax outta a .30-06 K98? OW! I don't think overpenetration will be a problem, explosion of subject might be.

K98 most definitely, round count, good bullet, plus its a very heavy and robust piece should you choose to beat the crap out of someone with it. Does it still accept a bayonet? :D

C.R.Sam
April 12, 2002, 05:45 PM
Red mist reduces recidivism.

Sam

ATeaM
April 12, 2002, 06:03 PM
K98, but you have to stick a bayonet on that puppy.

Navy joe
April 12, 2002, 08:35 PM
Rehabilitation through robber atomization?

flinch_of_gt
April 12, 2002, 10:38 PM
Technically, it's "Rehabilitation through disassociation."

BamBam-31
April 13, 2002, 04:06 AM
Another vote for the K98. Skewer first, then vaporize. :D

STEVE M
April 13, 2002, 07:03 AM
Why does it have to be one or the other?
Use both with the right tactics and you should be ok. Your top of the stairway sounds like a very good start.

ACP230
April 13, 2002, 09:21 AM
That .30-06 is going to be awfully loud inside. I suggest you get a set of electronic ear muffs that will allow you to hear what is going on in the house, but shut down when a gun is fired. Keep them with your rifle.
What are the laws of self-defense in Norway? Do you have to retreat as far as possible before firing on a home invader? Will you be prosecuted for "defending yourself too much," if you shoot an attacker in your house? That last question may sound like a joke, but people have gone to jail for self-defense in Britain, and, with bad luck and a lousy lawyer, even in the US.

Cosmoline
April 13, 2002, 08:53 PM
Overpenetration is only a concern with the K-98 if you're using FMJ ammo. For SP or HP ammo, it's no more a cocern with with stray buckshot. In fact, I'd be more worried about stray buckshot. At close range you WILL NOT miss with a Mauser. Fifty yards is point blank for those rifles. At extremely close range it's an amazing weapon in its own right, even without a bayonet. All that wood and steel makes it a real bone-breaker.

Also, noise is quite a bit less from the K98 than from a shotgun firing magnum shells. I very much doubt it will be louder than a shotgun. The reverse is true in my experience. My Mossberg 500 firing small game loads hurts my ears more than my Turk Mauser.

KSFreeman
April 18, 2002, 06:27 PM
Cos, you can't miss??? Oh, yes, you can!!!

BTW, isn't point blank for a 8mm like 350 yards? Now that's a big house! A 8mm SP won't blow through walls???:eek: I guess it depends on the house.

Unless you live in a castle in the desert or hang out at a gunshop talking about your days in the Selous Scouts, over penetration is always a concern. The concussion from gunfire is ALWAYS a concern. Remember Miami?

Remember, inside your house, a shotgun is a rifle. Get a shotgun with a light. Pattern your weapon. Measure the known distances and go shoot them at the range.

Use good tactics. Get training. Don't let them get within bayonet range. Save the rifle for the elg.

Navy joe
April 19, 2002, 12:55 AM
Umm.. KS, our Norweigan friend is surrounded on 3 sides by concrete as he explained and the 4th opens out onto a rather large expanse of water. Since were dealing with what he has, not what magical-tactical sword he can buy I can't see recommending a single shot SG of probably comparatively delicate construction over the more robust and multi-shot K98. Further I don't think a 110gr V-max from the -06, not 8mm, will over penetrate flesh or concrete, I see lots of dust or pink mist depending on what you hit.

I don't exactly see how rifles are always bad, of two guns I could lay my hands on right now, I'd figure that the .223 with 40gr CXP HP would be less of a concern than my "wimpy" 9mm with 124 GDHP. With either gun I have to worry about what's beyond the target, why not use something effective? And no, I don't hang out in gunshops and I've said it before, I'll say it again, I just fix airplanes for a living, guess I'm not "tactical" :barf: enough to be trusted with a rifle. Your anti rifle for home HD arguement sounds a lot like the Bill Ruger "No honest man..." line. By your same reasoning no PD should have patrol rifles unless they work in places with less than 50 people per sq mile. Which incidentally it sounds like just that kind of nice place where Goosegunner lives.

Speaking of that name, whatta you want to bet that 12 ga is longer than the 98, just for gunning geese? And loud? Geez, my air rifle hurts my ears indoors, I think its kind of a wash unless you get electronic muffs, nobody will hear much for a while, just one of the people it will be because his central nervous system is no longer accepting calls.

goosegunner
April 19, 2002, 01:10 PM
My K98 is re-barreled to .30-06 by/for the norwegian army (and therefore have the bayonet on), my shotgun is a old 12/70, it is the same lenght as the mauser. In a "normal" situation (nobody fires at me) i hit what I am supposed to with one shot. but I am not sure that i will depend my ass on only one shot in a critical situation. I know a load off 00 buck will stop a man if I hit where it hurts, but will a 110 gr. bullet be enough to prevent a man from shooting back. And forget the possibility of shooting somone at 50m + (I do not think distances over 10m is considered self defense in Norway, and I don't have a house that will result in looong ranges indoors anyway)

KSFreeman
April 19, 2002, 06:53 PM
Well, if you live in a concrete box or a castle in the desert then the rifle makes sense. You still have to hit with it--in the dark, up from a deep sleep, trembling. "I'm so close, I can't miss. No, you're so close you cannot afford to miss."

Not anti-rifle, Navy Joe, but firearms are only tools for a specific purpose. Remember, the rifle is loud and it shoots through a lot of stuff. Good sometimes, bad others.

Bill Ruger???:eek: A 6 of Rolling Rock and directions in a few years!