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View Full Version : 12 Gauge Tactical vs. 20 Gauge


Skorzeny
May 30, 1999, 04:00 PM
I have been thinking about getting a new shotgun that both my wife and I can use for home defense purpose. I would like a 12 guage semi-auto (Beretta 1201 or a Police 11-87), but I fear that my wife may not be able to handle the recoil. So, I am considering a Rem 1100 LT-20 Youth (21" barrel, 13" pull), a gun that Massad Ayoob praises in his Stressfire II book. If, however, the 12 gauge "Tactical" or reduced velocity load (00 or #4) is as gentle as a 20 gauge (#3), then I'd rather have a Beretta or a Rem 1187 and have the stock cut to 13" of pull. So, I guess what I am asking is: is there a significant recoil difference between 12 gauge Tactical and 20 gauge (non-magnum) buck? Skorzeny

HeadHunter
May 30, 1999, 07:37 PM
I used 20 gauge for a long time to cut down on recoil. However, I've now switched to Fed Tactical 12 gauge and don't notice much difference. For a woman, a very important thing is to make sure the stock fits her. Most stocks are too long for a woman, which will cause her to mount the gun improperly. That's why many women feel pain when shooting by the shotgun.

Rosco Benson
June 1, 1999, 07:46 AM
A few years back, I attended a defensive shotgun class given by Louis Awerbuck (Yavapai Firearms Academy). Louis is an old friend and has become one of acknowledged masters of shotgun instruction. Anyway, also in the class was a married couple who are friends of mine. The wife was using a 12-ga. 870 with the stock cut WAAAAY down to fit her (she's short). The buttstock fit her, but she had to reach WAAAAY forward for the forend...to the point that her left arm was almost fully extended. She fought that 870 all through the first day, but had to sit out the second day of class.

A year or so later, we had Louis back again for Level II of defensive shotgun. THIS TIME she had a 1100 lightweight 20-ga. with the butt cut down for her (the butt was actually a little long for her as the action spring therein limits how short you can cut it). The main difference was that she could now grasp the forend just in front of the receiver and not have to extend her left arm so far (also, with the autoloader she didn't need to manipulate the forend to cycle the action as she had to with her 870). The lesser weight of the new gun also helped keep her from getting fatigued. She did GREAT in the class and got very competent with her 20ga.

Rosco

[This message has been edited by Rosco Benson (edited June 01, 1999).]

Skorzeny
June 1, 1999, 08:09 AM
Gee, that's funny. The reason I asked the question in the first place was because I wanted my wife to be able to use the shotgun, too. She finds my Rem 870 too heavy and too unwieldy. She also finds the 12 gauge a bit too much.

I have been considering the Rem 1100 LT-20 Youth (13" pull, 21" barrel). However, I am concerned by 1) the O-ring, which seems a bit fragile to me and 2) the scarcity of 20 gauge buckshots (only #2 or #3 even when I can find some). So, I was thinking about getting a Vang Comp 870 with a stock cut to 13" of pull.

Skorzeny

Rosco Benson
June 1, 1999, 09:00 AM
You might want to consider getting two shotguns...one optimized for you and another optimized for your wife. Regardless of gauge or action type, it is unlikely that a single shotgun will fit you both well.

I don't know what your home security arrangments are, but I take a dim view of the "single weapon for both husband and wife" approach. If, for example, the husband takes the sole gun to investigate a bump in the night and gets taken out by the intruder(s), the wife is now unarmed and the intruder(s), even if they were unarmed initially, now have the husband's gun. If husband and wife are both competent, then they should both have their own defensive firearms.

Rosco

[This message has been edited by Rosco Benson (edited June 01, 1999).]

Skorzeny
June 2, 1999, 12:52 PM
Rosco:

That shotgun won't be the only weapon immediately accessible to us. My wife's primary weapon will be her Glock 19. My primary is either a Kimber Pro Carry or a USP Compact 40.

However, I think you are right. We'll have to get two shotguns. I think that I'll either get my wife a Rem 1100 LT-20 Youth or a Rem 11-87 Police (with the stock cut) and then get myself a Winchester 1300 Defender 20 gauge or a Rem 870 12 gauge (modified with extended mag, jumbo safety, cut forend and a few other minor riff-raff).

The questions are: will the 11-87 be light enough for my little wife and will the tactical loads for 12 guage be as gentle for her as 20 gauge loads?

Say, does anyone know where I can buy a Remington 11-87 Police model?

Skorzeny

Rosco Benson
June 3, 1999, 07:16 AM
Skorzeny wrote:
"Say, does anyone know where I can buy a Remington 11-87 Police model?"

Hoplite, in Sheppardsville, KY usually has them. CHeck at (502)955-5014.

Rosco

Skorzeny
June 3, 1999, 08:08 AM
Eric:

You wrote that you were "finishing up" your new Rem 870 Youth. What do you mean? Are you adding some accessories?

Skorzeny