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DblTap
March 8, 1999, 03:45 PM
Does anybody know of a manufacturer other than Choate for a pistol grip stock for a Remington 11-87? I am looking for a high comb so the weld point is in line with the optics on the gun.

Thanks In Advance,
Dbl Tap

streetpro
March 8, 1999, 09:11 PM
Take a look at the speedfeed line of stocks. They are nicely done, can be had with/without integral shell holders, and come in shorter lengths for use with body armor. A high comb and pistolgrip combination may be a tall order, though.

Take Care,
Bill Perches
<a href="http://www.streetpro.com">Street Smart Professional Equipment</a>

Daniel Watters
March 8, 1999, 10:45 PM
If you need to raise the comb, consider some of the strap-on or stick-on cheekpieces. Prices run from $10 to $45, depending on construction. Look at Page 227 in Brownell's Catalog #51.

http://www.brownells.com/

Keith Rogan
March 13, 1999, 01:05 AM
Tap,

Why on earth would you want to put a pistol grip stock or optics on a shotgun? A shotgun is designed to be pointed. Many generations of thought have gun into stock design so that when you throw it to your shoulder, the shot comes "directly from your eye". Why mess with a good thing? If you are shooting slugs, your maximum range is something like 100 yards, an iron sight will suffice just as well as any optical device at that range and again, a pistol grip will do nothing but mess up your "hold" on the gun.


------------------
Keith
The Bears and bear maulings page: http://members.xoom.com/keithrogan

David Schmidbauer
March 13, 1999, 07:39 PM
R. Keith Rogan, Bearman of Kodiac

>A shotgun is designed to be pointed

So what you are saying is that I wasted good money having a ghostring rear and tritium front sight on my 1201? Damn... and to think all I have to do is point it. :D

------------------
Schmit, GySg, USMC(Ret)
NRA Life, Lodge 1201-UOSSS
"Si vis Pacem Para Bellum"

Keith Rogan
March 13, 1999, 08:43 PM
Schmit,

I think a ghost-ring sight is entirely appropriate on a shotgun. What I meant was that a shotgun, even more so than a rifle is meant to be an extention of your eye. It should come to your shoulder and have a perfect stock weld and be already aligned and ready to fire.
Thats the beauty and thats the strength of a shotgun - speed and ergonomics.
If you put a pistol grip stock or a scope on a shotgun then you are missing the point and should be using a rifle. Such items detract from the efficiency of the weapon rather than enhance it.

------------------
Keith
The Bears and Bear Maulings Page: members.xoom.com/keithrogan (http://members.xoom.com/keithrogan)

David Schmidbauer
March 14, 1999, 01:37 AM
Playing Devils Advocate here...

<If you put a pistol grip stock or a scope on a shotgun then you are missing the point and should be using a rifle.>

Isn't a scope just a different type of sighting device? All a scope really does is cut down the number of things your eye has to contend with to align your weapon on the target (reticle v front/rear sight), puts the aiming point and target on the same focal plain and magnify the target.

Using your train of though, I think, you wouldn't put a scope on a hand gun either? And what about the different kinds of scopes... i.e. Red Dot.

Don't get me wrong, I agree with what you say mostly, but nothing is set in stone. While I would never put any type of existing scope on my 1201 GPS, nor would I put one on say a Ruger Redlabel, if I was setting up a shotgun for deer hunting (cause that is all my State allowed) you can bet your sweet arse that it would have a scope along with the best rifled bbl I could buy.

------------------
Schmit, GySg, USMC(Ret)
NRA Life, Lodge 1201-UOSSS
"Si vis Pacem Para Bellum"



[This message has been edited by David Schmidbauer (edited March 14, 1999).]

4V50 Gary
March 14, 1999, 01:38 AM
I had a factory folding stock with a plastic pistol grip on my Rem 870. Hurt my hand when I shoot it (especially with slugs) so I removed the stock and put on a Speedfeed. Call me soft, but at least I'm happy.

Keith Rogan
March 14, 1999, 10:59 AM
Devils advocate huh? Scopes have their place for long range shooting, but at under 100 yards whats the point?
Anybody should be able to hit the heart/lungs of a deer at that range with iron sights.
But lets set up a hypothetical situation. The deer appears at a range of ten yards from an unexpected quarter (this could NEVER happen in real hunting!), now your scope is a drawback because its so close that you can't focus - you shoot and make a bad hit and now the deer is running and you can't get him in your cross hairs because the field of view is too narrow and you miss again and again.
Scopes have drawbacks as well as advantages. If you're hunting in a long range environment, use a scope. If you're using a shotgun in close cover, use iron sights. Why handicap yourself?


------------------
Keith
The Bears and Bear Maulings Page: members.xoom.com/keithrogan (http://members.xoom.com/keithrogan)

Hairball
March 14, 1999, 12:37 PM
Then, why not get a see-through type scope mount? then you can have the best of both worlds. A Scope for longer ranges, Iron-sights or a bead sight for those 10 yard deer encounters.

Even though, when it comes to killing deer, I'd rather use my Jeep. :)

David Schmidbauer
March 14, 1999, 04:53 PM
Keith;

Are you trying to bait me or what? I believe you are thinking "Rifle" scope while I'm just thinking Scope in general. Remember that song from the 60s

"For every scope, turn turn turn,
There is a firearm, turn turn turn,
And a Combo for every purpose under Heaven"

There are many types of scopes... suited for different purposes. Would I put a Simmons 44 Mag Scope on a Snip.. aaaa, precision rifle. NO. Would I put a Leupole Mark 4 Ultra on a shotfun... maybe if I took enough drugs (but I'd probably OD before I was waisted enough).

Why put a scope on a weapon for under 100 yards... why to put the aiming point and target on the same focal plain. For a shotfun scope I'd want a low power (1x or 2x). A Scout wouldn't be bad (it would be mounted to the bbl so when I take off the rifle bbl and put on my goose bbl I would have to re-sight in when I put it back on) or one of those HUD Red Dot Scopes.

With a low power I could use both eyes to pick up the in close target then switch to one eye just prior to taking the shot.

OR if I got a high power scope on it I could just look over the scope... a shotfun is made to be an extention of your eye so you really don't need sights.... RIGHT? :D



------------------
Schmit, GySg, USMC(Ret)
NRA Life, Lodge 1201-UOSSS
"Si vis Pacem Para Bellum"

Keith Rogan
March 15, 1999, 04:38 PM
Schmit,

Yes, a shotgun is made to be pointed rather than aimed. However, when you stick a slug barrel on it or are just shooting slugs things change because then, in effect, you are shooting a rifle.
And yes, a low-power scope might be workable but again, you are shooting at less than 100 yards where open sights will do everything a scope will do.




------------------
Keith
The Bears and Bear Maulings Page: members.xoom.com/keithrogan (http://members.xoom.com/keithrogan)

Keith Rogan
March 15, 1999, 04:44 PM
Hairball,

Why not a see-through scope mount? Because we are still dealing with a shotgun here. Why stick a bunch of sighting devices on a firearm with an effective range of less than 100 yards?
If you are shooting slugs leave the factory iron sights on it or stick a ghost ring on the rear and be done with it.
If you are shooting buck then leave the shotgun bead alone because anything else just slows you down.
I'm not trying to be contrary here but a shotgun has range limitations and bolting all the aftermarket accessories in the world on it aren't going to change the fact thats its a shotgun.


------------------
Keith
The Bears and Bear Maulings Page: members.xoom.com/keithrogan (http://members.xoom.com/keithrogan)

David Schmidbauer
March 15, 1999, 07:55 PM
Keith;

>where open sights will do everything a scope will do.<

EXCEPT putting a single aming point on the same focal plane as the target. To some, that have problems with open sights, scopes are a fine option just for this reason.


------------------
Schmit, GySgt, USMC(Ret)
NRA Life, Lodge 1201-UOSSS
"Si vis Pacem Para Bellum"



[This message has been edited by David Schmidbauer (edited March 15, 1999).]

Keith Rogan
March 15, 1999, 11:10 PM
Schmit,

Yeah, I guess if you have troubling focusing then a scope may be the answer - but then why not just use a ghost ring which does the same thing, is more robust and a good deal cheaper?

------------------
Keith
The Bears and Bear Maulings Page: members.xoom.com/keithrogan (http://members.xoom.com/keithrogan)