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View Full Version : Pistol Grips for Home Defense Shotgun?


Macoute
October 10, 1998, 11:18 AM
I am considering putting a pistol grip on my home defense shotgun. My reasons are to decrease it's length and increase its maneuverability in my house - when checking suspicious noises and such, before I commit to the barricade and 911 call. Do you guys have any experience/opinoins on this before I invest the money, install, and head to the range to test it out? Thanks.

fal308
October 12, 1998, 09:11 AM
Pistolgrips are harder to control and aim.You may want to try out a friend's before you change yours. Personally I have them both ways. I find that I tend to shoot lower with the pistolgripped gun than with the full stock. I usually keep a pistolgripped gun in my bedroom but I practice with it using full power loads.Also you could carry the full stock at low ready and if you should run out of ammo you could use the butt as an effective club.

Ken Campbell
October 13, 1998, 08:15 PM
Well, you may have opened a can of worms here. I can't find much use for the pistol grip. First and foremost, it makes it quite difficult to hit your target. With the full stock, you can use the sights (rifle or go\host ring is preferred) to verify that your shot is on target so you get a first round hit.
Remember, you are responisble for every round of shot you send down range. That leads me to the notion that you must know how your gun patterns with the specific ammo you have in it.
Rather than spend the money and time on the pisto grip and the practice it requires to hit regularly, it might be best to consider other options. These might be the rifle or ghost ring sights, a side saddle to carry additional rounds with the gun, and a light source.
The light source is imperative so that one can identify their target as we can't shoot at sounds.
Thus, to get back to your original question, I would use a pistol grip. If I needed to shorten the gun in a fight, I'd tuck the stock back in under my armpit.

DVC

Ken

Rob Pincus
October 13, 1998, 09:25 PM
Personally, I have a Bennelli with the factory Pistol Grip/Full Stock. I use it to shoot in tactical matches, sporting clays, 5-stand, and even Trap. The gun has a 21 inch barrel and screw in chokes.

I have gotten so used to pistol grip, that traditional stocked guns feel awkward. AND, I love the look the ATA guys give me when I step up to the Trap field with it! The look of disgust only worsens when I manage to break 5 out of 5 on the first position!

I also have a Winchester 1200 defender with a pistol grip and no stock, I would always grab the stocked benelli first, unless I had the 1300 because it was easier to store somewhere, otherwise it is infinitely harder to use accurately.
If you can only have one shotgun for home defense, I guess the best compromise would be one with a folding stock and a pistol grip.

Rich Lucibella
October 13, 1998, 10:37 PM
Rob,
I think the question on the floor is "are you breaking 5 out of 5 using the pistol grip?"

I'm sure it's all a matter of preference. I, personally, have no use for pistol grips on shotguns.

As for using the Benelli for skeet or trap, I own one and tried it myself. The recoil was just a bit too much for me to shoot 100 rounds well in competition. Again, different strokes for different folks. Gimme a Remington 1100 or 1187 any day.
Rich

Kodiac
October 14, 1998, 09:59 AM
Butler Creek makes a good steele folding stock with pistol grip. I find I can lock in a firmer hold with a pistol grip and keep my elbow tucked down. (a consideration for a fighting long gun) The B.C. stock is a strong set up. Take a look at one. The length you save makes a big diffrence when jumping in and out of a vehicle. I got one on my Moss 590, and that thing is like packing around an I-beam - that stock makes it usable. They are made for Win Defenders, Rem 870s, and Moss 500-590's.

Keith Jones
October 14, 1998, 10:59 PM
Macoute...,
When people talk of using a shotgun for home defense, it should probably be limited to scenarios where an armed intruder is smashing in to the dwelling from the outside, or where you otherwise know precisely where the bad guy is. A shotgun, because it requires two hands to control, would be a poor weapon for checking in the closets and around the kitchen corner, at least when you're working alone. If an intruder were to surprize you at close range, a shotgun (regardless of length) can be wrestled out of your grasp much easier than a handgun.
But if a shotgun is all you have at hand, probably the best thing would be to shorten the barrel to the legal minimum and, as Ken noted, tuck the buttstock under your armpit for close-quarters use. Practice maneuvering in the tights spots in your home with your 'gauge', especially in low light, or darkness (the power may go out...!). Do the bulk of your practice-firing with light skeet loads.
Having said all this, I own and frequently carry a pistol-grip shotgun with a 12.5-inch barrel on the job as a metro police officer. Like all short-barrelled shotguns, it excels as a 'threat management' tool when you're attempting to gain control over a situation. But I practice with it, because it's much different to shoot than a handgun or a shoulder-fired gun.
Attaching a pistol grip reduces the shotgun's utility and makes it a 'special-purpose' weapon. Just be sure that doing so would truly fit your 'special needs'.

Stay safe...,
Keith

Rob Pincus
October 15, 1998, 10:48 AM
Again, I have to say that it is just something that you either get used to or you don't. "A shotgun" is used much more liberally than "A semi-automatic pistol"
Each firearm is going to be different and you have to get used to what you have. some poeple like CZ grips, some people like 1911 grips, some people like traditional stocks, some people like pistol grips, some people like thumbhole stocks.

4V50
October 20, 1998, 02:00 PM
Pistol grips on shotguns are fine if you're the member of the entry team who's going to take the hinges off a door. For self defense though, I prefer to have a full stock gun. Like someone else said, pistol grips require a lot of practice to achieve proficiency than does a shotgun equipped with a normal stock.

Rob Pincus
October 20, 1998, 02:59 PM
When most of you are saying "pistol Grip" I am hearing "pistol Grip with no stock".. is that what most of you meant? Is that what you meant Macoute?
What about a pistol grip WITH a full stock, that is the set up I prefer for any shotgun application.

Nestor Rivera
October 21, 1998, 05:06 PM
I would prefer a stocked shot gun instead of a pistol only grip, 1 it is can be used from the shoulder. 2 it can be used for other activities. 3 just two words "butt stroke"

Kodiac
October 22, 1998, 04:01 PM
Ah... Nestor...
your #2... What kinds of "Other" activities?

Don R
November 2, 1998, 05:45 PM
As for me, I realize that there might be some kind of situation in the future where I would need a full-size shotgun to drop a few inches (or gain a few) in a few short seconds, due to storage requirements or whatnot. I put a Choate Folder on my Ithaca M37 w/original extended magazine and a Sidesaddle to boot! Nice gun, but hard on the shoulder. Harder on the hand when fired pistol grip only.

The other shotgun is a Benelli, full stock. If you had to have something with a pistol grip, go with a folder and only use it pistol grip only in special situations, like storage, etc...you should try to extend the stock as fast as possibly while deploying the shotgun, but realizing that you might have to crack a couple off, better practice with the pistol grip only too...

Decisions, decisions....

Rob Pincus
November 2, 1998, 05:54 PM
Back in the Day, my father had kept an Ithaca M37 that some suspects had convienently modified for him, by sawing off the barrel in front of the mag tube and the stock behind the pistol grip. This became his raid gun and accompanied him on several occcassions "through the door".
Since we don't have it quite as leniently as he did, the folding stock seems to be the best bet. You get the compactness when you need it, but you can also use the shotgun for more than just clearing an apartment building.
If you go to the trouble of registering an AOW, you can have a SBS with a folding stock, the only big drawback to the SBS is the lack of tube capacity.

SpitRhyma
January 20, 2007, 05:27 AM
Pistol grip changes your hands access to the guns mechanics like safety and action release lever. Consider these changes.

-STD Stock is decent for average people
-Stock+Pistol grip is like STD Stock but better and can be fired rambo style (w/o pressing stock to shoulder)
-Pistol grip is good for home defense and close up action only... You can't aim as good and shoot steadily but it won't matter if someone's accross ur living room.
-Pistol grip w/ foldout stock is GREAT if you like firing the gun rambo style AND occasional normal style but usually the stock is hard and kills your shoulder over time

You need maneuverability for home defense like you said so if the gun is home defense and you don't ever do a lot of repetetive firing (like at a range) then go w/ a folding stock.

Folding stocks are illegal on semi-automatic shotguns in california and a FEW SPECIFIC shotgun models... They might harras you but tell'em to ask some guy named "Hanz" (j/k that's only in Santa Barbara late night)

Anyways this is what I use and here is what I've got to say:
http://www.knoxx.com/NewStyleKnoxx/Products/COPstock.htm

It's great, pretty solid (not quite solid enough), nice and stylish, useful, and it reduces size so it's convenient to carry BUT

It hurts like a motherb!!!! when you fire several breecher shots w/ the stock open against your shoulder and no good for shooting around (like as a hobby) so use it for defense only!

If you have a hobby just have 2 diff stocks or guns but it's not worth using the COPStock for hobby

check out www.Knoxx.com

The CompStock is SAID to be the best stock ever (least recoil) for heavy duty fire! anyways I'll update my post later! G2g

Hope my rambling helps you in your decision!

miscusi
January 20, 2007, 08:38 AM
EVERYBODY keeps saying how shorter is more manuerable and etc... why dont you run around your house with your existing stock and see if you can do things?

Have it unloaded, and let your friend run around pretending to be a buglar.

Dry fire the shotgun at your friend as he runs around the house.

SpitRhyma
January 20, 2007, 09:27 AM
EVERYBODY keeps saying how shorter is more manuerable and etc... why dont you run around your house with your existing stock and see if you can do things?

Have it unloaded, and let your friend run around pretending to be a buglar.

Dry fire the shotgun at your friend as he runs around the house.

I get bits n peices of wall on my gun even when I'm pulling it out my closet sometimes... Stuff happens and it's harder to be careful when there's a real intruder.

More importantly they may not run around and try to hide and run up and grab your gun... it's harder the smaller the gun is (especially the barrel) because once they get closer to you than the barrel's tip it becomes quite hard to use it against'em.

Rifles are easier to take from someone than pistols... Also a handheld object is easier to play 'keep-away' w/ then a long rifle ESPECIALLY 1 that's being held out infront of you... Weight is also important!

Here's a nice kit but it's out of stock :(
http://www.ableammo.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=9935_13769_13821&products_id=96837

OBIWAN
January 20, 2007, 10:16 AM
I see a very narrow niche for shotguns at best

Breaching specialty rounds, or as an "area weapon"

And having experimented with PG only guns I have even less use for them

The PG-shoulder stock models seem a little easier to use one handed...which would be nice indoors...although no shotgun will be as manuverable as a handgun

Like Eric I have shortened the stock on my single token defensive shotgun and it drastically improves handling

M1911
January 20, 2007, 10:27 AM
-Pistol grip is good for home defense and close up action only... You can't aim as good and shoot steadily but it won't matter if someone's accross ur living room.I disagree quite strongly.

I have fired a shotgun with pistol-grip and no stock. You can easily miss someone 15' away using that kind of shotgun. I find it much easier to hit a target quickly with a stocked shotgun.

stuckon308
January 20, 2007, 10:55 AM
I have to agree with M1911. Depending on what load you're shooting the pistol grip can be difficult to aim (especially in tense situations). I recently put a folding stock on a Mossberg 500 and have already put about 200 rounds through it and I just can't stand the pistol grip alone. You sacrifice so much accuracy with it and after a couple of shots the fun runs out. I keep finding myself folding the stock down and shooting it like that. For home defence I would definitely get a folding stock or just a pistol grip with a fixed stock.

andrewd523
January 20, 2007, 12:21 PM
I have a Knoxx specops for my 870. It greatly reduces the recoil felt by heavy loads. Knoxx also has a pistol grip (breachers grip) that supposedly reduces recoil. They have a lot of videos on it too. Here is a link so you can check it out.

http://www.knoxx.com/

Then go to the breachers grip to watch the video.

raggededge
January 20, 2007, 02:42 PM
Guys, this topic is eight years old.

miscusi
January 20, 2007, 03:50 PM
8 years old ? WOW.

Maser
January 20, 2007, 05:44 PM
Well, my brother is 8 years old too and he's still cool just like this thread is. :D I love my pistol grips. Yeah, that's right I said grips. I have 2 on my shotgun. Rear and forend pistol grips made by Tac-Star. The added forend grips helps even out the recoil in both hands rather than just one hand.

bigghoss
January 20, 2007, 08:33 PM
speedfeed

fixboot
January 21, 2007, 09:06 AM
I have 3 stocks for my remmy. Butler creek pgo, tacstar pgo, and the original synthetic stock. I dust more clays with a pgo than the normal stock. I attribute this to my ability to raise the pgo shotty right up in my face quickly (cone of vision) instead of cocking my head to the side to look down the barrel when the full stock is on it, with the pgo I can get that puppy right in my face and stare straight down the tube. My head and the front bead move as one. Odd part is that my friends pick it up and cant hit squat. Some people can do it, others need the full stock to be accurate. As for, "it will break your hand" I shoot 3 inch mag slugs all day and the worst I get is a little sore the next day. WHO THE HELL CARES? ITS FUN! I say, do whatever the hell you want. PGO for fun, sport, defense? FINE! Switch it back to the full stock and use it for fun, sport, defense? FINE!!! Oh and to the guy that felt the need to bring up a topic older than the magna carta, read the picture below aloud to yourself please.

http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p158/laurieanne_03/Iamsofakingwetodddid.gif

mustangdan1963
January 23, 2007, 01:31 PM
Use what you're comfortable with. If you like the idea of no stock, get one and practice a lot! I have one by my bed, and have had it for close to 20 years. I've broken many many clays with it, just for kicks, so I don't necessarily agree that they are harder to shoot. But again, I believe it's all in what you get used to. I bought mine many years ago to hunt with after I had a car accident and had to start using a wheelchair. the PG is much easier to handle while pushing through the woods! I did spend a lot of time practicing and can shoot clays with it at this point one handed very consistently, i.e. 20 or better for a round of trap. Granted, I shoot a full stock SG better on clays, just making the point that they aren't that hard to aim.

Khell3770
January 23, 2007, 08:26 PM
When it comes to pistol grips on shotguns I think you have to remember that it isn't going to handle the same as a stock. I can shoot from the hip and still be acurate at 20', beyond that I am getting off some. But in a home defense situation most shots will be fired within 10' anyway. Also if you have a pistol grip only you shouldn't have a barrel more then 18" long anyway. With a barrel that short, at close range, how accurate do you need to be? If you can hit a clay hanging from a branch at 15' and break it then that is all you need.

Also practice with it. One full loadout a week is good until you get used to the recoil and are hitting within the torso of a silhouette target at 15' feet, once you get there then put one loadout a month through the shotgun until you can hit well at 20' to 30'. After that you are fine. If you could do that from the beginning then you could alread shot a pistol grip shotgun.

Once you go pistol grip you aren't aiming at squarrels anymore, it is for emergency use and that is normally short range. If you aren't up close with the person, do you really need to use deadly force in the first place? :cool:

TexiCali Slim
January 23, 2007, 10:39 PM
MISCUSI: EVERYBODY keeps saying how shorter is more manuerable and etc... why dont you run around your house with your existing stock and see if you can do things?

Have it unloaded, and let your friend run around pretending to be a buglar.

Dry fire the shotgun at your friend as he runs around the house.

And if you want to find out how effective bowie knives are give your 5 year old a butcher knive and have him skip around the house.:rolleyes:

sonyman74
January 23, 2007, 11:09 PM
Well, my Super Nova tactical came with a pistol grip and I like it very much.http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r286/sonyman74/CIMG0150Smalldfa.jpg

SIGSHR
January 24, 2007, 11:44 PM
At my usual range I saw a shooter firing a pistol grip only 12 gauge from "the hip", I noted how much the gun twisted in his hands and how difficult follow up shots were. I tried a 12 gauge with a pistol grip and stock, it
was more comfortable from the shoulder, but much less so at waist level.
IMHO-and I have very little shotgun experience-the traditional stock is the
best all-arounder.

hpg
January 25, 2007, 06:57 PM
Macoute,

Purchase yourself a Davis Speedfeed Tactical III or IV stock instead. You can thank me later....... hpg

liliysdad
January 25, 2007, 07:34 PM
Well, my Super Nova tactical came with a pistol grip and I like it very

Looks like you have 5 posts, and I swear they all have a photo of your Nova in them. It looks like a nice shotgun, definitely not what I would have done with it, but nice the same.

Marcus
January 27, 2007, 12:44 AM
Interesting (if OLD) topic. About 15 years ago a buddy of mine picked up a Mossberg Cruiser pistol grip only 18.5" 12ga. for apartment defense. I installed a Choate front pistol grip which seemed to be a big improvement over the horizontal fore end. Recoil was shared by both hands and aiming seemed easier too. Later we did some small game hunting at his folks house and I was shocked that he was able to make good hits on squirrels with it (it was his only gun). Now that there are pistol grips like the Pachmayr Vindicator and Hogue Tamer that have padded recoil absorbing backstraps I wonder if it might be even more pleasant. I`ve noted that the Pachmayr grip even merges in a smooth radius with the top of the reciever on Mossberg 500s allowing easy thumb access to the safety. It`s occured to me that a PGO shotgun might be the ideal platform for a laser also. Marcus

liliysdad
January 27, 2007, 07:14 AM
It`s occured to me that a PGO shotgun might be the ideal platform for a loser also


This statement I can agree with.

;)

Eghad
January 27, 2007, 08:25 AM
for the majority of folks the full stock is probably better on a shotgun for home defense. It also allows you to use the sights on the shotgun as was sugested in an earlier post. Like Eric suggested shortening the stock can make a big difference for some folks. I shoot the 87 in SASS and it I could tell a big difference when it came to shouldering the shotgun and shooting it after I had it shortened.

goodoleboy
February 1, 2007, 04:47 AM
Note that you will never find a Police tactical shotgun with a pistol grip only..

Ive got a freind who is a Police instructor and they are great to conceal but not worth a darn when shooting..

gak1
February 1, 2007, 08:29 AM
Have it unloaded, and let your friend run around pretending to be a buglar.
Dry fire the shotgun at your friend as he runs around the house.

Haha. Don't think I'll be trying this with the wife.
+1 on the Knoxx Spec Ops pistol/shoulder combo stocks, and get it with the optional limbsaver pad, or screw on a Hi Viz X-Coil pad after you take out the default pad/inserts to make the recoil even lighter. Excellent for reducing LoP too.

M1911
February 2, 2007, 08:02 PM
Dry fire the shotgun at your friend as he runs around the house.Please don't do this. It's a fundamental violation of gun safety rules -- always keep your gun pointed in a safe direction. Your friend is not a safe direction...

Marcus
February 4, 2007, 01:37 AM
Lilysdad, did we suddenly time warp back to grade school? Marcus

liliysdad
February 4, 2007, 08:03 AM
I suppose so, do not know what came over me....:rolleyes:

TexiCali Slim
February 4, 2007, 10:33 AM
Note that you will never find a Police tactical shotgun with a pistol grip only..

Ive got a freind who is a Police instructor and they are great to conceal but not worth a darn when shooting..
:confused: I beg to differ.