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View Full Version : I love my trapdoor so much....


Doc Hoy
March 3, 2013, 03:52 PM
...I am going to build another one from junk.

Some time ago, I came up with a spare breachblock for a trapdoor at a real good price. So I figured, why not buy the rest of the parts and then I'll have two.

So I am starting with a barrel which I bought off of ebay for 55.00. The ad listing said the barrel was badly pitted but I think it cleaned up okay. This is a standard length barrel with the rod bayonet fitting.

http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt259/Dochoy/Scratchbuild%20Trapdoor/Barrel001_zpsc1fa49b5.jpg

http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt259/Dochoy/Scratchbuild%20Trapdoor/Barrel003_zpscebe6c75.jpg

So I started out with a hack saw

http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt259/Dochoy/Scratchbuild%20Trapdoor/Barrel007_zps4aa0be6d.jpg

Doc Hoy
March 3, 2013, 03:57 PM
into the lathe to true up the muzzle and put a decent crown on it.

http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt259/Dochoy/Scratchbuild%20Trapdoor/Barrel009_zpsadf012e8.jpg

New length is 22 1/2 which is cavalry and officer's model length.

http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt259/Dochoy/Scratchbuild%20Trapdoor/Barrel011_zps20205b05.jpg

Doc Hoy
March 3, 2013, 04:00 PM
The muzzle, before

http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt259/Dochoy/Scratchbuild%20Trapdoor/Barrel006_zps9f83a90f.jpg

and after

http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt259/Dochoy/Scratchbuild%20Trapdoor/Barrel010_zps12d4457c.jpg

I have a receiver ordered for it.

Also have my eye on a stock.

I figure with another thousand bucks worth of parts and about a hundred manhours, I should have a rifle that is worth about 350.00 dollars.

Pretty good huh?

Doc Hoy
March 3, 2013, 04:06 PM
....the stock, the firing pin and spring, the extractor and spring, The breachblock cam and hardware, the trigger assembly, the lock assembly, the butt plate and screws, a barrel band, front and rear sight and some assorted hardware and I am in business.

Yeah....About nuther thousand bucks.

Beagle333
March 3, 2013, 04:11 PM
You're almost there, Doc! :D It's coming along great! ;)

Hawg
March 3, 2013, 04:48 PM
When you get the rear sight make sure its marked with a C and not an R.

duelist1954
March 3, 2013, 05:43 PM
Doc, that is looking really good. What a neat project.

Doc Hoy
March 4, 2013, 07:06 AM
I am prolly going to make the front sight and so I will likely be able to use a rear sight just building the front sight to match it.

I think my main concern is getting the barrel band to clear the sight if the Buffington is a good bit longer than the original design sight. I have a line on a Buffington but they are a good bit larger.

I also am a bit concerned about the condition of the barrel. It cleaned up pretty well but not perfectly.

I am told that the trapdoor shoots well even when the bore is not in great shape. The bore on my other rifle is a bit better, but we shall see.

I can say this: On my other trapdoor, the worst portion of the bore is at the muzzle. That was true of this barrel too. I think this comes from long period is inaction and inattention with the rifle standing on its butt plate.

When I cut the last ten inches off the barrel, a lot of the problems went away.

4V50 Gary
March 4, 2013, 07:52 AM
Looks promising. Is that a beer can shim to protect the barrel? It doesn't appear to protect the it fully.

Hellgate
March 4, 2013, 11:09 AM
"I figure with another thousand bucks worth of parts and about a hundred manhours, I should have a rifle that is worth about 350.00 dollars."

One's pride of workmanship is priceless. It's your "baby" and you'll be a proud papa.

I found a lot of parts for my TDs at www.ssfirearms.com/

I love my TD carbine for Plainsman shoots. I had the rusted, pitted, bulged barrel relined and it shoots great.

Doc Hoy
March 4, 2013, 02:43 PM
Gary,

It is a piece of a plastic coke bottle. It protects the barrel all the way around and it seemed to pad the barrel more than the aluminum can.

I chucked the barrel in very tightly with no mark whatever on the surface of the barrel.

Hellgate,

Loud and clear. In point of fact, this one probably will never be for sale. (Unless it is sold by my widow.)

maillemaker
March 4, 2013, 03:38 PM
I figure with another thousand bucks worth of parts and about a hundred manhours, I should have a rifle that is worth about 350.00 dollars.

LOL! :D

Steve

deerslayer303
March 4, 2013, 05:01 PM
Wow, very nice. I will be following this thread. I wish I had some of the skills demonstrated on this here meeting place.

Strafer Gott
March 4, 2013, 05:02 PM
A thousand bucks, maybe, but Doc, look at all the money you save on de-farb!

LeadZinger
March 4, 2013, 05:52 PM
over a $1000 to made $350?? What are you? The Federal Government?:D

Envy your ability and machining talents to produce something useful out of a handful of parts. Look forward to seeing the finished product, and of course, and early range report.

Doc Hoy
March 4, 2013, 07:19 PM
I was in the Navy for 26 years and I can tell you if the federal government thought they could get 350.00 in value from a thousand dollar investment, they would be doing cartwheels.

Hawg
March 4, 2013, 08:30 PM
Doc, the C & R sights are incremented differently. The C is set up for a carbine length barrel and the R a rifle length barrel.

Doc Hoy
March 5, 2013, 05:58 AM
I should have known it was not as simple as I originally thought.

Doc Hoy
March 5, 2013, 04:43 PM
25.00 delivered from eBay.

975.00 left.

brazosdave
March 5, 2013, 06:31 PM
cool project! Can't wait to see the results!

WillyKern69
March 5, 2013, 07:48 PM
I like the project. If you decide to have it cased hardened or blued Classic Guns in Crete, Il. They do a great job.

http://www.classicgunsinc.com/apps/photos/album?albumid=8759608

WK

Doc Hoy
March 5, 2013, 08:23 PM
That is the second good link in this thread.

bedbugbilly
March 6, 2013, 11:32 AM
Hey Doc . . . sometimes you just can't put a price on pleasure . . . it's lookin' goooood! Will be anxious to see your progress! :)

Doc Hoy
March 10, 2013, 08:30 AM
Got my thumblatch and cam. Needs a bit of fitting to get it to go into the breach block.

I expect the receiver tomorrow.

Watching a bunch of other parts on the evil bay and on gunbroker.

My father is checking his shop, thinking he has a hunk of cherry that will work for the stock.

Cherry is close grained and should have enough strength for the stock. But it is hard. I hope I am up to this.

Doc Hoy
March 10, 2013, 08:38 AM
Been thinking about your recommendation for case hardening and bluing.

If I blue anything, I will prolly cold blue it myself.

In fact I am also thinking about case hardening the reciever and breachblock myself.

Something else to study up on.

Captainkirk
March 10, 2013, 10:00 PM
Nice work, Doc!

James K
March 10, 2013, 11:37 PM
The receiver and breechblock are already case hardened; trying to color them (which is what I assume you mean) will actually soften them.

Jim

Doc Hoy
March 11, 2013, 06:01 AM
Bought a stock last night.

As regards the finish on the rifle I am thinking I will blue the whole thing, receiver and all.

I know....I know, the good looking case hardening on the recent TD replicas sure is pretty.

I like the rubbed metal on my present one. There was no collector value in the rifle at all and that will be true of the one I am building.

We shall see.

mykeal
March 11, 2013, 06:41 AM
You mean you're not going to sign it?;)

Doc Hoy
March 11, 2013, 07:09 AM
....Never had to learn it because none of my acquaintences are deaf.

Well, I do know one sign which I learned in the Navy but I haven't had to use it in a long time.

.


.

.

......... ;o)

On the serious side....

I put the cam lock in the breach block last night.

Cam lock in the breach block

Cam lock in the breach block

Hmmm....That ryhmes

I grabbed my rifle, trusty, but I found that it was a trifle rusty.



http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt259/Dochoy/Scratchbuild%20Trapdoor/BreachBlock003_zpsb91b6d80.jpg


Had to chase out the threads and make a screw

http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt259/Dochoy/Scratchbuild%20Trapdoor/BreachBlock002_zpsb64e5fbf.jpg

Doc Hoy
March 11, 2013, 11:01 AM
I made up a firing pin from a piece of hard steel round stock.

http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt259/Dochoy/Scratchbuild%20Trapdoor/FiringPin002_zpse179553e.jpg

The actual pin is a drill bit shank driven into the body of the firing pin.

Also had to chase these threads as well and make a retaining screw for the firing pin.

http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt259/Dochoy/Scratchbuild%20Trapdoor/FiringPin003_zps438bc971.jpg

Here is the pin at full extension.

http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt259/Dochoy/Scratchbuild%20Trapdoor/FiringPin004_zpsfac85111.jpg

Doc Hoy
March 11, 2013, 11:02 AM
...Is the breach block completed.

I hope it works.

http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt259/Dochoy/Scratchbuild%20Trapdoor/FiringPin006_zps26a03f3e.jpg

Doc Hoy
March 11, 2013, 03:48 PM
....A trigger assembly which includes the entire trigger guard and a trigger for 40.00 and a tang for 25.00 from Al Frasca.

Watching a lock and the extractor parts on the evil Bay.

HOGSHOOTER
March 11, 2013, 06:24 PM
All us gun lovers understand.Make sure to show it off when its ready. HOGSHOOTER

Doc Hoy
March 15, 2013, 03:16 PM
Bought the receiver froma guy on Gunbroker. He is a little haphazard when it comes to service. But the price was not bad at 40.00 for the condition which is dirty but excellent.

http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt259/Dochoy/Scratchbuild%20Trapdoor/Stockandreceiver007_zps383b9238.jpg

Nuther view

http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt259/Dochoy/Scratchbuild%20Trapdoor/Stockandreceiver003_zpsbbc7c490.jpg

Everything fits as it should

http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt259/Dochoy/Scratchbuild%20Trapdoor/Stockandreceiver002_zpsb6bfac98.jpg

Doc Hoy
March 15, 2013, 03:19 PM
I am pretty sure this stock started life as a carbine stock

http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt259/Dochoy/Scratchbuild%20Trapdoor/Stockandreceiver004_zps536022ab.jpg

I picked up a tang from Al Frasca.

http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt259/Dochoy/Scratchbuild%20Trapdoor/Stockandreceiver007_zps383b9238.jpg

The stock is gong to need a lot of sanding.

http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt259/Dochoy/Scratchbuild%20Trapdoor/Stockandreceiver006_zpsd3f9a707.jpg

Hellgate
March 15, 2013, 03:22 PM
This is like watching the wonder of a baby gradually forming in the womb at each sonogram.

Doc Hoy
March 15, 2013, 03:31 PM
http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt259/Dochoy/Scratchbuild%20Trapdoor/Stockandreceiver001_zpsf4bf07b7.jpg

Let me say a word about Al Frasca. This guy has a good quality website which he keeps up to date pretty well. http://www.trapdoorcollector.com/

This guy is very knowledgable. He has a good stock of parts. His prices are good and shipping is outstanding.

He is not afraid to hang on the phone and speak about the parts you need and the manner in which they fit. Good with advice.

Strafer Gott
March 15, 2013, 03:33 PM
I have the H&R Officer model. My stock isn't much better. Yours has much more red cast. Are you going back to like new? I'd be afraid to take too much character away from it. That project is really coming along nicely. I must say I am amazed at how rapidly you gathered or made the bits.

Doc Hoy
March 15, 2013, 03:42 PM
I have not yet decided what I want the final product to look like.

I thought about just smoothing it up a little and also thought about shining it up, bluing it and completely refinishing the stock.

I have a trigger and tang coming yet. Got my eyes on a lock.

Made a great deal on the hingepin, extractor, plunger and spring. Got it for about a third of what I was expecting to pay.

I'll keep posting photos as the project moved forward.

Tidewater_Kid
March 15, 2013, 09:43 PM
Doc,

Wonderful project and photos. I just ordered a basket case one today in 50-70. I think your helpful photos have inspired me to get mine working.

TK

BirchOrr
March 16, 2013, 06:02 AM
Very cool!

Birch

Doc Hoy
March 16, 2013, 08:42 AM
...I heartily recommend this guy Al Frasca if you get to needing parts.

Very interesting guy to talk to.

Be good to see some photos or your project as well.

Tidewater_Kid
March 16, 2013, 08:56 AM
Doc,

Thanks I will keep that in mind. I will post pictures when it arrives. In the meantime keep up the good work!

TK

Hawg
March 16, 2013, 11:03 AM
Doc, sand too much on that stock and the wood to metal fit will be atrocious.

Archie Otto
March 17, 2013, 07:27 PM
1884 with new barrel and stock.

http://i1080.photobucket.com/albums/j333/bigotto1/td5_zps0a9a7212.jpg

Doc Hoy
March 17, 2013, 08:30 PM
...enjoyed and continue to enjoy a great reputation among shooters but a terrible record with soldiers.

I can easily understand both sides.

I love mine but I would hate to rely upon it to try to kill folks who were angry at me. Especially with copper cartridges.

Barnacle Brad
March 18, 2013, 01:40 PM
I found this site the other day - lots of parts (maybe a little high $$$)

http://www.trapdoors.com/index.php

Cool project! Good luck!

Doc Hoy
March 19, 2013, 10:05 AM
Spoke to him early on but have avoided him since that conversation.

Prices appear to be way out of line.

Doc Hoy
March 27, 2013, 04:26 AM
Hinge pin, Extractor plunger, extractor pin, and extractor. But the extractor is for a 50-70 and won't work in my rifle.

I spoke to Al Frasca and he has agreed to exchange it for one which is from a .45-70.

Also bought the triggerguard assembly and tang which has now arrived and the lock, carbine sight and barrel band which has not arrived yet.

I am going to try to make the saddle ring rail and the front sight.

This is almost starting to look like a rifle.

Tidewater_Kid
March 27, 2013, 08:09 PM
Be sure to post pictures.

I might need the 50-70 extractor. I hope Al still has it when my rifle arrives.

TK

Doc Hoy
March 29, 2013, 11:30 AM
Here are some photos of the rifle with all of the components present.

http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt259/Dochoy/Scratchbuild%20Trapdoor/Trapdoor001_zps9902af1e.jpg

I don't have the screws yet so the sight was just sitting on the barrel.

http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt259/Dochoy/Trapdoor002_zps6604eecf.jpg

Sorry the muzzle is out of focus. A photographer I am NOT.

http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt259/Dochoy/Trapdoor003_zpsed7b38da.jpg

I will be dovetailing the front sight.

Doc Hoy
March 29, 2013, 11:34 AM
Both of my trapdoors have a good bit of trigger creep and I suspect it is not uncommon in the marque.

I solved the problem in the one I am building by layering heat shrink tubing onto the sear.

http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt259/Dochoy/Trapdoor004_zps7749f6d8.jpg

This got creep down to about a sixteenth inch where the finger bears.

This is a three position tumbler and I want the trigger to be right. If the tubing lasts, I will do the same thing on my other one.

Hellgate
March 29, 2013, 11:41 AM
When my tumbler broke the replacement was a two position one. It was OK but just different. Basically a 1/4 cock and full cock. You can load & unload on 1/4 cock.

Hawg
March 29, 2013, 11:55 AM
Looking good Doc but that's a rifle butt plate.

Doc Hoy
March 29, 2013, 01:38 PM
Yeah I know. But if you don't say nuthin, I won't.

Hawg
March 29, 2013, 06:39 PM
Yeah I know. But if you don't say nuthin, I won't.

I ain't sayin nuffin.;)

BerdanSS
March 29, 2013, 08:45 PM
I like it already! (heck, I liked it from the first pic of just the barrel :o) Shes a real looker Doc :) I cant wait to see the final product :cool:

Tidewater_Kid
March 29, 2013, 09:26 PM
It's looking real nice! I'm so jealous!

TK

Doc Hoy
March 31, 2013, 12:07 PM
I made this sight and now I am afraid it might be too short.

Clamping this to the milling machine table was a bear. I had to be SOOO careful to get the alignment right.

http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt259/Dochoy/Scratchbuild%20Trapdoor/Sight003_zps5441b1d3.jpg

I cold blued the barrel, and receiver to try to get them to match.

http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt259/Dochoy/Scratchbuild%20Trapdoor/Sight004_zpse9d89ee1.jpg

Only just so successful. I might try that again.

Here is the closeup of the sight.

http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt259/Dochoy/Scratchbuild%20Trapdoor/Sight006_zps8412a674.jpg

Doc Hoy
March 31, 2013, 12:10 PM
Goes off fine, but I am afraid the firing pin is too long.

Pretty big dent in the primer. Don't reckon it matters all that much.

I have all of the screws coming from Al Frasca's running mate, Ed Knisely. I am going to try to make the saddle ring rail.

Might be shooting this thing next week.

BirchOrr
March 31, 2013, 12:30 PM
Thanks for sharing Doc!!!

Birch

Doc Hoy
March 31, 2013, 12:36 PM
$533.00.

chickenmcnasty
March 31, 2013, 07:57 PM
This is really cool. Looks like a lot of fun

Doc Hoy
April 4, 2013, 10:09 AM
This is the most fun I have had with my clothes on in a long time.

Been away on travel for a coupla days and am just getting back to the forum.

I have decided on a minimalist approach to th final finish on the rifle. Maybe just brown the rifle and take the shine off of the stock.

chickenmcnasty
April 4, 2013, 11:19 AM
I would keep it simple too. Browning the barrel would give it more character than a shiny finish I would think. It really is awesome, you should be proud of it.

Hawg
April 4, 2013, 07:07 PM
Brown is good and I think the stock looks good as is.

Doc Hoy
April 4, 2013, 07:37 PM
on some browning processes.

I see the links to Brownells, but is that the best option?

mykeal
April 4, 2013, 08:59 PM
I've used two different processes, both successfully. Each has it's own 'tricks'.

1) Birchwood Casey Plum Brown. This is a hot process; you heat the metal and apply the browning solution with a large cotton swab. The key is to thoroughly clean and degrease the metal first. This makes handling the parts an issue; nitrile gloves are the solution. Two to four coats are usually necessary. The first one will appear uneven but that's quickly and easily fixed with the following coats. Also, if one of the coats is uneven, due to the metal cooling too fast, fixing it by applying another coat is easy and effective. Pros of this method are speed (you can apply several coats in one day) and control (each coat gives a darker and smoother finish and you can quickly judge whether to add another). Plus you don't need to plug the bore because the interior of the barrel doesn't get hot enough to react with the solution if any should get inside. Cons are the need to keep the metal clean and degreased, so plan how to handle the parts in advance.

2) Laurel Mountain Browning and Degreaser Solution. This is a cold process; you create a high humidity environment and apply the solution, then let it rust for several hours. The parts are then 'carded' with a stiff brush or denim cloth to remove the scale. Several coats are necessary and it will take a couple of days to complete one gun. Warning: the first coat or two will look terrible, but each subsequent coat will get better. Pros are the humid environment is easy to set up (I just turned on a hot shower and closed the bathroom door) and the solution is itself a degreaser, so keeping the parts clean and grease free is not as important. Cons are the time invested - it takes much longer than the hot process. Also, you will need to plug the muzzle and nipple/touch holes to keep from rusting the bore.

Both will give a deep, smooth brown finish, and both can be tailored to produce the amount of 'antique' that one desires.

Doc Hoy
April 5, 2013, 07:00 AM
Thanks for the tips.

Using Plum Brown...

Does the surface to be browned need to be completely free of previous bluing?

Does the process produce a markedly different appearance when applied to case hardened parts?

Sarge
April 5, 2013, 07:13 AM
Splendid thread, Doc.

mykeal
April 5, 2013, 07:37 AM
Using Plum Brown...
Does the surface to be browned need to be completely free of previous bluing?
I've never applied Plum Brown over blued metal, or 'partially' blued metal. However, I have used it to cover worn rust browned surfaces and it worked just fine, so I suspect the answer is no. Both Plum Brown and Laurel Mountain finishes are opaque, not translucent, so repeated applications will cover surface coloration inconsistencies. The color just gets deeper and more uniform, a lot like painting with a heavy glaze.

Does the process produce a markedly different appearance when applied to case hardened parts?
I'd say 'noticeably' different with light application, much less so the more coats you add. Plum Brown, like Laurel Mountain, works by rusting the surface of the metal. A chemically 'color case hardened' surface (if that's what you meant) will resist that process more than an untreated steel, so it will take more work. If you meant a truly case hardened surface I don't really know for sure what it will do, but I suspect it will be closer to untreated steel than the chemically 'hardened' surface. I've seen work that was very dark brown, almost black, and I believe it started as a bone charcoal hardened surface that was then treated with Plum Brown. In the end it's speculation as I really have no personal experience with it.

Captainkirk
April 5, 2013, 10:14 PM
Beautiful work, Doc, and I applaud your decision on the minimalist touch. You are building both a historical and interesting piece. Can't wait to see the finished product!

Doc Hoy
April 6, 2013, 05:26 AM
Capt and Sarge,

Thanks for the compliments

Mykeal,

Thanks for the info. The 1873 Peacemaker clone that I have from Geroco is browned.

I have to put more thought into this decision.

Strafer Gott
April 6, 2013, 01:01 PM
So I'm in the LGS and what to my wondering eyes.. It's the full length infantry rifle by Pedersoli. Now it looks too long, after seeing yours. I hope your piece shoots as good as it looks. Putting the saddle ring rail on will really take the cake!

Doc Hoy
April 6, 2013, 01:07 PM
You and me both.

I am told that a trapdoor will shoot fairly well even though the bore may be less than perfect.

I hope that is right.

Tnx,

Hawg
April 6, 2013, 01:08 PM
Just don't use jakcketed bullets in it Doc.

Doc Hoy
April 6, 2013, 01:16 PM
I am using the Lee mold 405 grain bullet in probably BHN14 lead.

Doc Hoy
April 7, 2013, 07:01 PM
A replacement saddle ring and rail goes for about 80 bucks. So being a tightwad, I decided to try to make my own.

I started out with strap stock that was significantly oversized and milled it down to the right width.

http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt259/Dochoy/Scratchbuild%20Trapdoor/Saddleringandrail001_zps7532b805.jpg

Cut and shaped the pads and bent the rail to fit.

http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt259/Dochoy/Scratchbuild%20Trapdoor/Saddleringandrail004_zps540da40b.jpg

After braising the parts together, I drilled and counterbored the screw holes.

http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt259/Dochoy/Scratchbuild%20Trapdoor/Saddleringandrail005_zpsae61f93a.jpg

Doc Hoy
April 7, 2013, 07:06 PM
Even though the originals used round stock of different sizes for the ring and rail, mine are the same size.

http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt259/Dochoy/Scratchbuild%20Trapdoor/Saddleringandrail006_zps5f75d8ac.jpg

Here is the fixture attached to the rifle.

http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt259/Dochoy/Scratchbuild%20Trapdoor/Saddleringandrail007_zps28bd892d.jpg


And a view fromt he port quarter

http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt259/Dochoy/Scratchbuild%20Trapdoor/Saddleringandrail008_zps72632d69.jpg

Doc Hoy
April 7, 2013, 07:11 PM
....Of the more or less finished rifle

http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt259/Dochoy/Scratchbuild%20Trapdoor/Saddleringandrail009_zps1f9fb2ea.jpg

and the starboard side

http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt259/Dochoy/Scratchbuild%20Trapdoor/Saddleringandrail011_zpsb5e39f20.jpg

Hawg
April 7, 2013, 07:20 PM
Shaping up good Doc.:cool:

Hellgate
April 7, 2013, 11:10 PM
My TD carbine has the bar & ring sawed off. Guess they didn't like the noise.

Doc Hoy
April 8, 2013, 07:47 AM
In the immortal words of Peter Boyle, "Holy Crap!"

As technicians we modify our tools and that process results in improvements to our tools. (How many different kinds of hammers are out there?)

So, sawing off the saddle ring rail must be viewed as an effort to improve the tool (the rifle) as interpretted by the guy who sawed it off.

Maybe he didn't have a saddle.

Sure Shot Mc Gee
April 8, 2013, 09:27 AM
Not bad. You want to sell it?

S/S

chickenmcnasty
April 8, 2013, 10:46 AM
Really really nice. That will be a riot to shoot and an awesome family heirloom

Doc Hoy
April 8, 2013, 11:16 AM
CM,

Thanks. The family would not appreciate it so it has to be a "Doc heirloom". But you are right. I can't wait to shoot the SOB.

S/S,

Everything is for sale eventually. I'd want too much for this one. I am going to shorten the barrel on the other one just as I did this one. When I have two that are alike, I may come to the conclusion I have too many. (Or as it is with revolvers, not enough.)

As Hawg says, there are a coupla inaccuracies in this rifle and also in the other one when it is finished.

Too expensive to make it a true representation of a carbine.

Sure Shot Mc Gee
April 8, 2013, 12:27 PM
I was just kidding yaw Doc. I wouldn't take your pride and joy away from you. Hmm? ~~?~~Yaw I would!!!_:p

BirchOrr
April 8, 2013, 03:44 PM
You do fine work Doc!!!

Birch

Doc Hoy
April 8, 2013, 04:08 PM
I am learning.

Strafer Gott
April 8, 2013, 04:13 PM
The suspense is killing me! Please shoot it. I got's to know.

Doc Hoy
April 8, 2013, 04:41 PM
My wife is out with her pals tonight.

I might just make up some bullets. I am thinking Sunday.

Captainkirk
April 9, 2013, 10:54 PM
Wow....love it, Doc!

Doc Hoy
April 10, 2013, 05:38 AM
I have worked myself up to about 150 rounds of .45-70.

As long as I replace failed cases periodically, I think this may be enough to keep me going.

I bought the Lee .405 mold and have been shooting those bullets.

I have been less than careful as regards hardness but I believe I can keep hardness above 13 consistently now that I am paying closer attention.

That bullet has three wide grooves.

I am going to use beeswax and mutton tallow in one series of rounds and beeswax and Lard in another. I want to compare the performance of these two differently based lubes.

4V50 Gary
April 10, 2013, 07:46 AM
nice replacement saddle ring.:cool:

Doc Hoy
April 10, 2013, 07:55 AM
I just mixed up some lube with lard as opposed to mutton tallow.

Since lard is less viscous than mutton tallow, it appears that the revised mix should be 1 part lard to 2 parts beeswax. That gives me about the right consistency. Of course this must be taken into account when calculating the cost of the lube.

These two mixes are pretty stiff.

Doc Hoy
April 14, 2013, 03:33 PM
I got to shoot this thing.

What a great shooter!

With my eyes I can keep the slug inside the nine ring at 25 yards consistently.

The sight is way too short but once I figure the right height for the sight, this thing is going to be a real pleasant surprise.

I am using the 405 gr slug from the Lee mold. Triple Seven with powder to the bottom of the bullet an no compression drive the slug to about 1200 fps.

I use both lard based lube and mutton based lube interchangeably with identical performance.

I love this rifle so much....I might make another one.

Captainkirk
April 16, 2013, 10:38 PM
Man, what a sweet pea shooter, Doc! Really dig the worn look; it adds character! Well done!:D

Doc Hoy
April 17, 2013, 01:24 AM
I imagine that the shooting qualities of this rifle are better than the other trapdoor that I have with a 29 inch barrel and the original muzzle crown.

I am wondering if I can make that one shoot better by cutting and crowning the barrel.

It will certainly look better.

Doc Hoy
April 22, 2013, 05:47 AM
And made the taller sight. I calculated .080 inch taller than the first sight to correct the POI that I experienced last week end.

Made it a little over tall so I can file it down if needed.

Now I need to go back out and see how it shoots.

My Uncle (RIP) was a serious hunter in SE PA. He shot .270 in a Remington and .308 in a Marlin 336. (Factory loads) He always zeroed his deer rifles at 25 yards. He said this put him right on at hunting distances (150 - 250 yards)

So my strategy is to not even try shooting longer than 25 yds until I can get it right. Then I will go out to longer ranges.

I think this 22 barrel has better shooting qualities than the other trapdoor I own which is an uncut and original crown 29 inch barrel. I am thinking I can improve that rifle as a shooter by using the same process I did on this one.

Cutting that barrel did two things:

1. It rid me of the last ten inches of barrel which was in the worst condition

2. It compelled recrowning the barrel

Thoughts anyone?

Captainkirk
April 23, 2013, 11:19 PM
I guess it would depend on the bore condition, Doc.
If the bore is good, I would simply re-crown, but if there is any pitting I think I might be tempted to shorten it up some.

Doc Hoy
April 24, 2013, 05:40 AM
A main reason for shortening the barrel has nothing to do with shooting, but the appearance of the rifle.

It would make it more authentic looking as a carbine.

So If I amgoing to crown it, I'll shorten it too.

I do see your point.